Author Topic: The Religion Thread  (Read 357791 times)

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Offline Klaus Weasley

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Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #1050 on: Oct 21, 2014 at 06:56 PM »
Which holy book is the most moral?


Offline Nelson de Leon

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Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #1051 on: Oct 21, 2014 at 08:52 PM »
Which holy book is the most moral?



The Holy Bible says that a woman can be sold to her rapist after he violates her.


Try lang natin sagutin ha:

Quote
Question: "Does Deuteronomy 22:28-29 command a rape victim to marry her rapist?"

Answer: Deuteronomy 22:28-29 is often pointed to by atheists, skeptics, and other Bible attackers as evidence that the Bible is backwards, cruel, and misogynist, and therefore, not the Word of God. At first glance, this passage seems to command that a rape victim must marry her rapist. Is that the correct interpretation of the text, and if so, how is that not horribly unfair to the woman? This issue is actually addressed in two passages, both of which are below:

Deuteronomy 22:28-29 “If a man meets a virgin who is not betrothed, and seizes her and lies with her, and they are found, then the man who lay with her shall give to the father of the young woman fifty shekels of silver, and she shall be his wife, because he has violated her. He may not divorce her all his days."

Exodus 22:16-17 “If a man seduces a virgin who is not betrothed and lies with her, he shall give the bride price for her and make her his wife. If her father utterly refuses to give her to him, he shall pay money equal to the bride price for virgins."

Together, these passages clearly state that if a man has sex with a virgin who is not betrothed (regardless of whether or not it was rape or consensual) he is obliged to marry her. He should have sought her father's permission first, negotiated a bride-price, and taken her as his wife. Because he did not, he is punished for this—he now must pay up (he can't opt out any more) and marry her (which could be a major punishment in itself if this was a foolish, spur-of-the-moment act and she really wasn't the right woman for him!).

Also note that "he may not divorce her all his days" – this initially doesn't seem significant but is actually a major punishment. Deuteronomy 24:1-4 (restated more clearly in Matthew 5:32 and 19:9) allowed for divorce, but only in the case of sexual immorality (the word "uncleanness" refers to this and was translated as such in the LXX). This man now may not divorce his wife even for this reason, but is obliged to continue to support her all his life whatever she does.

But her father is ultimately in authority over her, as her head, until he hands this authority over to her husband. If the man is unsuitable, the father can refuse to give his daughter to him. How many fathers would give their daughter to a rapist? Not many. So, in general, a rapist would actually have to pay a 50 silver shekel fine to her father, and not get a wife at all.

The answer to the question is in Exodus 22:17 - the woman does NOT have to marry a rapist, she must only do what her father says.

Note that throughout the Old Testament no rape victim is ever recorded as being forced to marry a rapist. However it is plausible that there could be circumstances in which a father would choose to have his daughter marry a rapist. In 2 Samuel 13, Amnon, a son of David, rapes his half-sister, Tamar. Tamar was not forced to marry Amnon. Interestingly, though, Tamar seemed to have wanted to marry Amnon after the rape (2 Samuel 13:13-16). Why would she desire such a thing? In that culture, virginity was highly prized. It would have been very difficult for a woman who was not a virgin, and especially a woman who had been raped, to find a man to marry her. It seems that Tamar would have rather married Amnon than live desolate and single the rest of her life, which is what happened to her (2 Samuel 13:20). So Deuteronomy 22:28-29 could be viewed as merciful to the woman, who, because of the rape, would be considered unmarriageable. In that culture, a woman without a husband would have a very difficult time providing for herself. Unmarried women often had no choice but to sell themselves into slavery or prostitution just to survive. This is why the passage leaves marriage to the discretion of the father, because every situation is different, and it is better to be flexible than have a blanket rule.

Also note that the penalty for having sex with an unbetrothed virgin is completely different from the penalty for sex with a married or betrothed woman. Sex with a married or betrothed woman is adultery and was to be punished by the death of both if consensual, or the death of the man if it was rape (Deuteronomy 22:22-27).

Read more: http://www.gotquestions.org/Deuteronomy-22-28-29-marry-rapist.html#ixzz3GmdTrvtL

Offline Klaus Weasley

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Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #1052 on: Oct 21, 2014 at 10:34 PM »
^What you said wasn't that much better though. It still does not refute the fact that women are second-class citizens and pretty much property to be exchanged by men. So if you have a daughter, you are the guardian of her vagina until a suitable-enough man comes along in which you pass on the control of your daughter's vagina onto him so as to give him sons. Do you agree?
« Last Edit: Oct 21, 2014 at 10:37 PM by Klaus Weasley »

Offline RU9

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Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #1053 on: Oct 21, 2014 at 11:20 PM »

For example, Mother Teresa has long been exposed as one who received enormous amounts of donations, yet never spent the money to build a single hospital, preferring to simply pray for the sick instead of providing adequate health care.  What did Teresa do with the money?  Nobody knows.  At least she didn't spend it on herself.


Here's an excerpt from a 2010 article that implies her involvement in money matters:

It is good news about some of the changes. Unfortunately, we are still in the dark when it comes to their financial records,” says Gonzalez. The donation issue first came up in the early 1990s when it was revealed that Charles Keating, an American banker known for the infamous “saving and loan scandal,” had donated up to $1.25 million to Missionaries of Charity. Amidst calls to return the money, Mother Teresa controversially chose to remain silent, an incident that is still sited by her critics who demand transparency.


http://www.forbes.com/2010/08/10/forbes-india-mother-teresa-charity-critical-public-review.html

Offline Nelson de Leon

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Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #1054 on: Oct 21, 2014 at 11:49 PM »
^What you said wasn't that much better though. It still does not refute the fact that women are second-class citizens and pretty much property to be exchanged by men. So if you have a daughter, you are the guardian of her vagina until a suitable-enough man comes along in which you pass on the control of your daughter's vagina onto him so as to give him sons. Do you agree?

Sir, actually I do have a daughter. And I am not a guardian of her vagina. She is 23 years old and under the Philippines law, she is free to choose whosoever she wants to marry. I can only give advice.

Offline dpogs

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Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #1055 on: Oct 22, 2014 at 12:14 AM »
talagang vagina pa ang kailangang protektahan:) truly a sign of no experience having a daughter... we as father are responsible for our daughter wellfafe and safety until she come to right age and capable of deciding by herself...

really... guardian of vagina?
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Offline Nelson de Leon

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Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #1056 on: Oct 22, 2014 at 12:25 AM »
talagang vagina pa ang kailangang protektahan:) truly a sign of no experience having a daughter... we as father are responsible for our daughter wellfafe and safety until she come to right age and capable of deciding by herself...

really... guardian of vagina?

Baka sir yun ang pagkaka-intindi niya sa sagot ko or dun sa verse. Or may follow up question siya after ko sagutin. Pero medjo hindi ko ma-connect re topic about rape. Or baka the virginity is in question kaya vagina ang issue.

here is some explation as to how christians consider virginity:

Quote
Question: "Why is virginity so important in the Bible?"

Answer: When the Bible uses the word virgin, it refers to an unmarried person who has not had sexual relations (see Esther 2:2 and Revelation 14:4). In today’s culture, many people use the word virginity to express sexual purity; however, many others use a technical definition to find loopholes in moral standards, limiting the word to mean only “the condition of never having gone all the way”—thus, a couple can do anything and everything short of sexual intercourse and still technically call themselves “virgins.” This is an unprofitable word game. Chastity should affect the heart, mind, and soul, not just certain body parts.

The Bible’s emphasis is not so much on a technical or medical definition of virginity as it is on the condition of a person’s heart. The morality we espouse and the actions we choose give evidence of our heart’s condition. The Bible’s standard is clear: celibacy before marriage and monogamy after marriage.

There are three serious reasons to save sex for marriage. First, as believers, we are to obey what God tells us to do. First Corinthians 6:18–20 states, “Flee from sexual immorality. All other sins a person commits are outside the body, but whoever sins sexually, sins against their own body. Do you not know that your bodies are temples of the Holy Spirit, who is in you, whom you have received from God? You are not your own; you were bought at a price. Therefore honor God with your bodies.” If we are in Christ, He has purchased us with the sacrifice of His life. He calls the shots, and we are to honor Him.

The second reason is that we are to fight our spiritual battles wearing the breastplate of righteousness (Ephesians 6:14). We are in a contest between our new nature in Christ and our fleshly desires. First Thessalonians 4:3–7 says, “It is God’s will that you should be sanctified: that you should avoid sexual immorality; that each of you should learn to control your own body in a way that is holy and honorable, not in passionate lust like the pagans, who do not know God; and that in this matter no one should wrong or take advantage of a brother or sister. The Lord will punish all those who commit such sins, as we told you and warned you before. For God did not call us to be impure, but to live a holy life.” Allowing your body (rather than the Spirit) to control your actions is an act of defiance against God. Godly, loving sex between a husband and wife is giving and unselfish. Using someone to fulfill a desire of the flesh is self-centered and abusive. Even if the partner is willing, you are still helping him or her to sin and negatively altering that person’s relationship with God and others.

The final reason involves the “mystery” of marriage (Ephesians 5:31). When God spoke of two people being joined as one, He was referring to something we’re only beginning to understand in a real, physiological way. When two people are intimate, the hypothalamus in the brain releases chemicals that induce feelings of attachment and trust. Having sex outside of marriage results in a person forming an attachment and trusting someone with whom he or she does not have a committed relationship. The definition of trust in the mind deteriorates. To have that kind of link with someone without the security of working together toward God is dangerous. Two individuals who are—even mildly—physiologically obsessed with each other but not committed to growing in God as a couple can be torn from God and His plans for them.

Conversely, if two people make a conscious, deliberate choice to commit to each other in marriage, and then allow the intimacy that releases these chemicals, the body can reaffirm the connection the mind has made. The physiological feelings of trust and attachment are reinforced by the reality of the relationship. In this way, two people become one physically, and that reflects what God has done spiritually.

Marriage is to model the relationship between the church and Christ. A married couple is to serve God in a strong, unified partnership. Sex, along with procreation, was designed by God to strengthen that partnership. Sex outside of marriage creates bonds that tear apart people’s hearts instead of joining them together.

Finally, we need to remember a few things about virginity, and the lack thereof, given God’s grace. Those who come to Christ after engaging in premarital sexual relationships are not virgins; however, they are fully cleansed by Christ at the moment they are saved. God can redeem anyone, and He can heal those who have indulged their fleshly lusts. And, in the horrible case of a woman victimized by sexual abuse or rape, who may feel that she, through no fault of her own, no longer measures up to the ideal standard of “virginity,” Christ is able to restore her spirit, heal her brokenness, and grant her wholeness.

Read more: http://www.gotquestions.org/Bible-virginity.html#ixzz3GnUqw9Cd

Offline dodie

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Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #1057 on: Oct 22, 2014 at 12:32 AM »
mahirap talagang paliwanagan ang mga taong hindi naniniwala sa dyos. kaylanman ang kanilang argumento ay hindi sasailalim sa paliwanag ng kahit sino mang  experto sa relihiyon o taong may paniniwala sa dyos.

and also their line of reasoning tends to be a little bit personal and disrespectful in nature if they are engage in a conversation that contradicts  their own personal beliefs as if they have the monopoly of righteousness. as what docelmo mentioned in the other thread.......not just a hint but truly a condescension.
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Offline dpogs

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Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #1058 on: Oct 22, 2014 at 12:36 AM »
Baka sir yun ang pagkaka-intindi niya sa sagot ko or dun sa verse. Or may follow up question siya after ko sagutin. Pero medjo hindi ko ma-connect re topic about rape. Or baka the virginity is in question kaya vagina ang issue.

from selling a rape victim to become wife instead... then it become to treating women as second class citizen...



basta ako kapag may masamang mangyari sa daughter ang isisigaw ko ay "PAGBABAYARAN nila ang ginawa nila sa anak kooooo...!!! They will pay for what they have done to my daughter...!!!"

siguro kung sa panahon ni Deutrnmy... malamang lamang... mukha ngang naibenta ko anak ko after niya marape :)
There is none righteous, no not one.

Offline leomarley

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The Religion Thread
« Reply #1059 on: Oct 22, 2014 at 05:40 AM »

mahirap talagang paliwanagan ang mga taong hindi naniniwala sa dyos. kaylanman ang kanilang argumento ay hindi sasailalim sa paliwanag ng kahit sino mang  experto sa relihiyon o taong may paniniwala sa dyos.

and also their line of reasoning tends to be a little bit personal and disrespectful in nature if they are engage in a conversation that contradicts  their own personal beliefs as if they have the monopoly of righteousness. as what docelmo mentioned in the other thread.......not just a hint but truly a condescension.

please stay on topic. The topic here is religion not the persons making the arguments. No need to get personal here.

Offline DVD_Freak

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Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #1060 on: Oct 22, 2014 at 07:56 AM »
please stay on topic. The topic here is religion not the persons making the arguments. No need to get personal here.

I think that is inevitable.  For those who believe in God, of course it's personal when you call him a tyrant.  That alone borders on disrespectful.

Online bumblebee

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Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #1061 on: Oct 22, 2014 at 10:12 AM »
Quote
In that culture, a woman without a husband would have a very difficult time providing for herself. Unmarried women often had no choice but to sell themselves into slavery or prostitution just to survive.

Where is the equality in this?

Offline Quitacet

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Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #1062 on: Oct 22, 2014 at 10:32 AM »

Offline Nelson de Leon

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Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #1063 on: Oct 22, 2014 at 11:32 AM »
Where is the equality in this?

Quote
Note that throughout the Old Testament no rape victim is ever recorded as being forced to marry a rapist. However it is plausible that there could be circumstances in which a father would choose to have his daughter marry a rapist. In 2 Samuel 13, Amnon, a son of David, rapes his half-sister, Tamar. Tamar was not forced to marry Amnon. Interestingly, though, Tamar seemed to have wanted to marry Amnon after the rape (2 Samuel 13:13-16). Why would she desire such a thing? In that culture, virginity was highly prized. It would have been very difficult for a woman who was not a virgin, and especially a woman who had been raped, to find a man to marry her. It seems that Tamar would have rather married Amnon than live desolate and single the rest of her life, which is what happened to her (2 Samuel 13:20). So Deuteronomy 22:28-29 could be viewed as merciful to the woman, who, because of the rape, would be considered unmarriageable. In that culture, a woman without a husband would have a very difficult time providing for herself. Unmarried women often had no choice but to sell themselves into slavery or prostitution just to survive. This is why the passage leaves marriage to the discretion of the father, because every situation is different, and it is better to be flexible than have a blanket rule.

Also note that the penalty for having sex with an unbetrothed virgin is completely different from the penalty for sex with a married or betrothed woman. Sex with a married or betrothed woman is adultery and was to be punished by the death of both if consensual, or the death of the man if it was rape (Deuteronomy 22:22-27).

I'm sorry pero hindi ma-gets ang question ninyo. If you mean equality re woman without a husband having a difficult time to provide for herself so they sell themselves to slavery or prostitution, di ba sir it still happens sa present day? May mga ganyan cases pa din ang DSWD and government agencies protecting women though wala na atang slavery ngayon.

Online bumblebee

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Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #1064 on: Oct 22, 2014 at 11:37 AM »
I'm sorry pero hindi ma-gets ang question ninyo. If you mean equality re woman without a husband having a difficult time to provide for herself so they sell themselves to slavery or prostitution, di ba sir it still happens sa present day? May mga ganyan cases pa din ang DSWD and government agencies protecting women though wala na atang slavery ngayon.

It doesn't really need an answer. Just pointing out that in the olden times, and as you said, even now, women are valued differently from men.

Offline barrister

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Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #1065 on: Oct 22, 2014 at 03:27 PM »
Sir, actually I do have a daughter. And I am not a guardian of her vagina. She is 23 years old and under the Philippines law, she is free to choose whosoever she wants to marry. I can only give advice.

You don't seem to be on the same page.

Ang punto ni sir Klaus, kung ganon ang regulations according to the bible, then you have the obligation to abide by those regulations.   Otherwise, you are violating those regulations.

What you failed to see is sir Klaus' misapplication of the Old Testament regulations.

The Old Testament regulations apply to ancient Israelites, not Christians.  What applies to Christians is the New Testament.

Bakit puro Old Testament ang sinisita niya?  ;)

...we have been released from the law so that we serve in the new way of the Spirit, and not in the old way of the written code. (Romans 7:6)

23 Before the coming of this faith, we were held in custody under the law, locked up until the faith that was to come would be revealed. 24So the law was our guardian until Christ came that we might be justified by faith. 25Now that this faith has come, we are no longer under a guardian.  (Galatians 3: 23-25)
« Last Edit: Oct 22, 2014 at 04:29 PM by barrister »

Offline dodie

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Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #1066 on: Oct 22, 2014 at 06:56 PM »
please stay on topic. The topic here is religion not the persons making the arguments. No need to get personal here.

im i out of topic sir? the problem with the religion thread is that the people making arguments about certain religions doesnt have a religion at all! what is this?  dito may monopoly of bashing the catholic religion or the christian faithfulls. bkt hindi nyo kaya subukang i shift yung energy of trying to find faults and wrong teachings or even corruption sa muslim religion at sa iglesia ni kristo?
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Offline Klaus Weasley

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Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #1067 on: Oct 22, 2014 at 07:07 PM »
Don't get wrong. I believe in God. But I believe in a benevolent, non-interfering God. Not a tyrannical, insecure God who needs to be worshiped constantly, who loves us by threatening to send us all in hellish torment if we don't obey His rules and who apparently, despite the fact that He's omnipotent and created a vast complex universe, is all hung-up on our sex lives since He apparently cares what we we do with our pototots and our pek-peks.

Offline barrister

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Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #1068 on: Oct 22, 2014 at 09:24 PM »
Ok lang yon sir, if that's what you believe.  I don't impose my beliefs on others.

I can cite many other barbaric Old Testament laws. 

For example, what is the penalty for a rebellious son?  Death.  :D
18 If someone has a stubborn and rebellious son who does not obey his father and mother and will not listen to them when they discipline him, 19 his father and mother shall take hold of him and bring him to the elders at the gate of his town. 20 They shall say to the elders, “This son of ours is stubborn and rebellious. He will not obey us. He is a glutton and a drunkard.” 21 Then all the men of his town are to stone him to death. (Deut. 21:18-21 )

9 Anyone who curses their father or mother is to be put to death. Because they have cursed their father or mother, their blood will be on their own head. (Lev. 20:9)


Death penalty for both parties to a homosexual act.
13 If a man has sexual relations with a man as one does with a woman, both of them have done what is detestable. They are to be put to death; their blood will be on their own heads. (Lev. 20:13)
 
Necromancy
27 A man or woman who is a medium or spiritist among you must be put to death. You are to stone them; their blood will be on their own heads.  (Lev. 20:27)

Blasphemy
16 anyone who blasphemes the name of the Lord is to be put to death.The entire assembly must stone them. Whether foreigner or native-born, when they blaspheme the Name they are to be put to death. (Lev. 24:16)
« Last Edit: Oct 22, 2014 at 09:29 PM by barrister »

Offline Nelson de Leon

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Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #1069 on: Oct 22, 2014 at 10:15 PM »
Don't get wrong. I believe in God. But I believe in a benevolent, non-interfering God. Not a tyrannical, insecure God who needs to be worshiped constantly, who loves us by threatening to send us all in hellish torment if we don't obey His rules and who apparently, despite the fact that He's omnipotent and created a vast complex universe, is all hung-up on our sex lives since He apparently cares what we we do with our pototots and our pek-peks.

Sir, when you say non-interfering, does that mean that God you believe in does not do anything for mankind or for his creations for that matter? If yes, what does the God you believe in do?

Offline dpogs

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Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #1070 on: Oct 23, 2014 at 12:12 AM »
Don't get wrong. I believe in God. But I believe in a benevolent, non-interfering God. Not a tyrannical, insecure God who needs to be worshiped constantly, who loves us by threatening to send us all in hellish torment if we don't obey His rules and who apparently, despite the fact that He's omnipotent and created a vast complex universe, is all hung-up on our sex lives since He apparently cares what we we do with our pototots and our pek-peks.

God of the Bible?
god of Koran?
god of Hindu?
Allah?

or god of "according to your expectation"?
There is none righteous, no not one.

Offline barrister

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Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #1071 on: Oct 23, 2014 at 04:02 PM »
Sir, when you say non-interfering, does that mean that God you believe in does not do anything for mankind or for his creations for that matter? If yes, what does the God you believe in do?

Good point. 
 
If sir Klaus believes there is a God, then why does God allow suffering in this world?
 
May sagot sa bible, pero hindi siya naniniwala sa bible.  So, ano kaya ang kanyang view sa issue na yon? 
« Last Edit: Oct 23, 2014 at 04:02 PM by barrister »

Offline Klaus Weasley

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Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #1072 on: Oct 23, 2014 at 04:19 PM »
God of the Bible?
god of Koran?
god of Hindu?
Allah?

or god of "according to your expectation"?

To be honest, I don't know. I believe in some form of a Supreme Being that created existence somehow. The nature of that Being, I don't claim to know. I do know He's not an old man in the sky who demands to be worshiped and gets offended when you masturbate. 

Offline tony

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Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #1073 on: Oct 23, 2014 at 05:20 PM »
religion equals lots of money, simple as that....
how do we defend our freedom? by the truth when it is assaulted by Marcos lies....

Offline barrister

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Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #1074 on: Oct 23, 2014 at 05:45 PM »
To be honest, I don't know. I believe in some form of a Supreme Being that created existence somehow. The nature of that Being, I don't claim to know.

OK yon.  You are a theist, but close to an agnostic.

An agnostic is neutral, meaning he neither believes nor disbelieves the existence of God, since that is something that is impossible for humans to know.
 
Maybe you are an agnostic?

 
religion equals lots of money, simple as that....

Sad but true.
 
I consider myself a Christian, but I don't belong to any formal religious sect.
« Last Edit: Oct 23, 2014 at 05:53 PM by barrister »

Offline dpogs

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Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #1075 on: Oct 23, 2014 at 06:08 PM »
To be honest, I don't know. I believe in some form of a Supreme Being that created existence somehow. The nature of that Being, I don't claim to know. I do know He's not an old man in the sky who demands to be worshiped and gets offended when you masturbate. 

you can start a new religion based on how you percieve god in your own imagination... you can make lot of money as sir tony said... religion is money

im sure maraming follower yan... just like prosperity gospel...


hindi kaya ganoon ang pagkakakilala mo sa isang diyos since it conform somehow sa iyong mga personal belief... and if a particular god doesnt approve to one of your belief then that is not the true god....
There is none righteous, no not one.

Offline Klaus Weasley

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Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #1076 on: Oct 23, 2014 at 06:31 PM »
you can start a new religion based on how you percieve god in your own imagination... you can make lot of money as sir tony said... religion is money

I don't believe in organized religion.

But there is already a Church of sorts that's sort of kind of close to my beliefs: Unitarian Universalists. There's also something called the Universal Life Church whose only doctrine is pretty much, "DO WHAT IS GOOD."

Personally, if your God, dpogs, is the real God. I don't want to worship that God because your God is a homophobic vain jealous insecure tyrant. I'd rather go to hell than spend eternity with that kind of God. I'm dead serious too.

Offline tony

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Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #1077 on: Oct 23, 2014 at 07:31 PM »

 
Sad but true.
 
I consider myself a Christian, but I don't belong to any formal religious sect.

Jesus Christ is a wonderful inspiration to pattern your life to...
unfortunately religion has minimized his true worth....
how do we defend our freedom? by the truth when it is assaulted by Marcos lies....

Offline barrister

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Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #1078 on: Oct 23, 2014 at 07:49 PM »
I don't believe in organized religion.

But there is already a Church of sorts that's sort of kind of close to my beliefs: Unitarian Universalists. There's also something called the Universal Life Church whose only doctrine is pretty much, "DO WHAT IS GOOD."

Those religions are so liberal that they can't be considered to have any doctrine at all.

Nothing's wrong with that, but my problem is, why do they call themselves a religion?  Because they are American in origin and US laws grant religions tax-exempt status?

That's what happened to Scientology.  The founder initially claimed it to be science, not religion; then later called it the "religion of Scientology."  Now, it claims to be a bona fide religion, and has tax-exempt status in the US.

My advice, don't join any religious organization.  Just believe what your conscience tells you, without joining any formal organization.
« Last Edit: Oct 23, 2014 at 07:50 PM by barrister »

Offline dpogs

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Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #1079 on: Oct 23, 2014 at 07:56 PM »
Jesus Christ is a wonderful inspiration to pattern your life to...
unfortunately religion has minimized his true worth....

because religion is man made - RC, pentecostal, mormon, etc... we can live without religion... but we can't live without faith...

to be or being Christian is not man-made... it is God-made.
There is none righteous, no not one.