Author Topic: The Religion Thread  (Read 357723 times)

0 Members and 3 Guests are viewing this topic.

Online bumblebee

  • Trade Count: (+1)
  • PinoyDVD Legend
  • *****
  • Posts: 4,371
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 2
Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #2340 on: Aug 23, 2016 at 08:27 AM »
Repentance does mean pagbabagong buhay. Baka naco-confuse mo repentance sa asking for forgiveness, which the other guy on the cross asked since hindi na sya pwedeng makapagbagong buhay.


Offline dpogs

  • Trade Count: (+95)
  • PinoyDVD Legend
  • *****
  • Posts: 4,397
  • love and discipline
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 483
Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #2341 on: Aug 23, 2016 at 08:47 AM »
Repentance does mean pagbabagong buhay. Baka naco-confuse mo repentance sa asking for forgiveness, which the other guy on the cross asked since hindi na sya pwedeng makapagbagong buhay.

so you mean the angels are not rejoicing in heaven over that man on the cross kasi hindi na siya puwedeng makapagbagong buhay?

repentance is different from "change of life o pagbabagong buhay"

"repent" or "repentance" is the state of mind, change of mind ... true repentance will result to "change of action - pagbabagong buhay".

prove me you that you have truly change your mind (repentance) by changing your life for good (pagbabagong buhay).

repentance - state of mind
pagbabagong buhay - results of true repentance

angels rejoice when one sinner repent (change his mind in regard of Jesus Christ) such as the case of the thief on the cross. He repented and even accepted that his actions are worthy of death (change of mind) whereas the other man on the cross still wants to save himself from death.

if given a chance that the man on the cross lived after he repented then he will have a change life (pagbabagong buhay)... ang dalawang kasama sa cross ni Jesus ay parehong binigyan ng pagkakataong mag repent pero isa lang ang nagrepent but then both of them must face the just judgement due to their crimes - death.
There is none righteous, no not one.

Online bumblebee

  • Trade Count: (+1)
  • PinoyDVD Legend
  • *****
  • Posts: 4,371
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 2
Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #2342 on: Aug 23, 2016 at 08:57 AM »
You're putting words on my mouth and quite honestly, complicating things.

And by the way, that Genesis verse, it shows how valuable life is, how despicable murder is. It says God will require blood for blood but didn't say that man should do the penalty. So you're actually pushing it by saying God instituted death penalty.

Offline dpogs

  • Trade Count: (+95)
  • PinoyDVD Legend
  • *****
  • Posts: 4,397
  • love and discipline
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 483
Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #2343 on: Aug 23, 2016 at 09:26 AM »
You're putting words on my mouth and quite honestly, complicating things.

And by the way, that Genesis verse, it shows how valuable life is, how despicable murder is.

True, life is so valuable each of us created in the image of God, that is why God instituted death penalty. A just judgment for whoever took a very valuable life. A just judgment for whoever took a life created in the image of God.

Quote
It says God will require blood for blood but didn't say that man should do the penalty. So you're actually pushing it by saying God instituted death penalty.

... by man (sa pamamagitan ng tao) shall his blood be shed ...

dumami pa nga ang mga klase ng kasalanan ng worthy of death, hindi lang murder, habang tumagal sa panahon ni moses hanggang sa new testament...

actually, even Jesus quoted the old testament law na ang sinumang magmura sa mga magulay ay may parusang kamatayan. Jesus also said that He came in this world to fulfill the law.
There is none righteous, no not one.

Offline Klaus Weasley

  • Trade Count: (+16)
  • PinoyDVD Legend
  • *****
  • Posts: 8,646
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 511
Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #2344 on: Aug 23, 2016 at 11:29 AM »
And it is also clear in the Bible that Jesus never spoke against death penalty.

Another thing that Jesus never spoke against: HOMOSEXUALITY.

Offline dpogs

  • Trade Count: (+95)
  • PinoyDVD Legend
  • *****
  • Posts: 4,397
  • love and discipline
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 483
Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #2345 on: Aug 23, 2016 at 12:54 PM »
Another thing that Jesus never spoke against: HOMOSEXUALITY.

Yes. He never spoke "against" homosexuality. Actually He "condems" it homosexuality.

God (Jesus) said that the penalty for homosexuality is death (death penalty).

Jesus was so against. He may not said it directly during His stay on earth but during old testament He said that whoever commited homosexuality should be put to death.
There is none righteous, no not one.

Offline Klaus Weasley

  • Trade Count: (+16)
  • PinoyDVD Legend
  • *****
  • Posts: 8,646
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 511
Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #2346 on: Aug 23, 2016 at 03:24 PM »
In that same book, whoever touches the body of a dead animal, whoever eats shellfish, whoever works on a Sabbath day and whoever wears clothes of two different fabrics should ALL be put to death.

Offline dpogs

  • Trade Count: (+95)
  • PinoyDVD Legend
  • *****
  • Posts: 4,397
  • love and discipline
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 483
Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #2347 on: Aug 23, 2016 at 06:10 PM »
In that same book, whoever touches the body of a dead animal, whoever eats shellfish, whoever works on a Sabbath day and whoever wears clothes of two different fabrics should ALL be put to death.

Please know the difference of the following before you mention that argument (again)

1. Ceremonial law
2. Judicial/Israel/Civil law
3. Mosaic law
4. Moral law
There is none righteous, no not one.

Offline Klaus Weasley

  • Trade Count: (+16)
  • PinoyDVD Legend
  • *****
  • Posts: 8,646
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 511
Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #2348 on: Aug 23, 2016 at 06:36 PM »
Please know the difference of the following before you mention that argument (again)

1. Ceremonial law
2. Judicial/Israel/Civil law
3. Mosaic law
4. Moral law

And you get to pick and choose which law you want to follow in order to justify your hatred of homosexuals in order to feel morally superior to them. Okay.

I guess it's okay to keep slaves na din, no?

Offline DVD_Freak

  • Trade Count: (+2)
  • PinoyDVD Legend
  • *****
  • Posts: 5,702
  • Life is a Blessing
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 12
Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #2349 on: Aug 23, 2016 at 06:56 PM »
In that same book, whoever touches the body of a dead animal, whoever eats shellfish, whoever works on a Sabbath day and whoever wears clothes of two different fabrics should ALL be put to death.

I believe na-discuss na ito Klaus.   Ilang beses na rin. I thought it was settled.  To refresh at least sa two different fabrics.......

The Bible explicitly says can't wear clothes with two different fabrics. That means if you wear a cotton shirt and denim pants, you are committing a sin.
Hindi naman ganun ang ibig sabihin nun.  The prohibition was intended during ancient Israel times where basically only wool and linen were used.  Wala pa naman denim and cotton noon.  One reason for the prohibition would most likely to maintain a distance between the high priest who was God's representative and the common people. Because the high priest wore both wool and linen.  So bawal yun common folk.  Common sense na lang.  Papano mo ipagbabawal ang hindi pa naiimbento?  Meron pa bang wool and linen today?  Pwede ka naman magsuot ng any combination from polyester, nylon, cotton and denim. Ok lang yun.   ;D
That's correct.
 
In ancient Israel, only the ephod of the high priest was woven of linen and wool.  Everyone else was prohibited from having that kind of material. 
 
The prohibition was ceremonial in nature, not moral.  It was applicable to ancient Israel; it does not apply to Christians.
 
Manipis talaga ang unawa sa bibliya nito, ayaw pang aminin...  :D

http://www.pinoydvd.com/index.php/topic,201152.msg2295774/topicseen.html#quickreply
« Last Edit: Aug 23, 2016 at 07:00 PM by DVD_Freak »

Offline Klaus Weasley

  • Trade Count: (+16)
  • PinoyDVD Legend
  • *****
  • Posts: 8,646
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 511
Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #2350 on: Aug 23, 2016 at 07:15 PM »
Oh, b.s.

Anyone can interpret the Bible any way they want to which is why I think it's dangerous and stupid to use it as your sole arbiter of morality. They're ancient texts which come from an oral tradition that's been passed on and translated and re-translated in various languages over the course of thousands of years. Plus the books in the Bible are picked and chosen by a group of MEN who chose them for their own personal agendas. They in turn pass it on to other men who interpret the Bible through the lens of their own personal biases and their own personal agendas.

Offline dpogs

  • Trade Count: (+95)
  • PinoyDVD Legend
  • *****
  • Posts: 4,397
  • love and discipline
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 483
Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #2351 on: Aug 23, 2016 at 08:11 PM »
And you get to pick and choose which law you want to follow in order to justify your hatred of homosexuals in order to feel morally superior to them. Okay.

I guess it's okay to keep slaves na din, no?

What you have mentioned above they dont belong under the category of "moral law". Moral law doesnt change. What is morally wrong before still morally wrong today.

Take note. Homosexuality were practice not by homosexuals only. Eto ay ginagawa ng kung sino man mapa hetero o homo man siya. This is not the issue of hating homosexuals. This is the issue of homosexuality. If youre heterosexual and practice homosexuality then youre as guilty as those homosexual practicing homosexuality.

Why keep on insisting the concept of "hate" eh malinaw dito kung sino sa atin ang may galit. You are known to have grudges extremely hatred to heterosexuals lalo na sa mga tatay.

Slave? First, what type of slavery youre talking about? Kung slavery tulad ng nakikita mo sa mga movies - against their will, maltrating them physcially and mentally then it is not okay for you to keep slaves.

Learn first the history of slavery (origin, diff type of slavery, etc) before you brought up (again) the issue of if its okay to keep slaves. And please kung anuman ang iyong nakikita sa mga movie na slavery hindi lang yan ang tanging klase ng slavery sa history ng mundo.

And to answer your question: if someone approach me and voluntarily want to be my "slaves" in exchange of food and shelter for him/her to continue to live why not. If its the only way to keep them alive and well.
There is none righteous, no not one.

Offline Nelson de Leon

  • Trade Count: (+141)
  • PinoyDVD Legend
  • *****
  • Posts: 10,084
  • Let us lead by example
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 291
Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #2352 on: Aug 23, 2016 at 09:57 PM »
Iba kasi ang concept of slavery during the biblical times. Sila yun mga workers ngayon, may salary rest day etc. Nag-iba lang ang concept of slavery when the people from Europe brought in the natives from Africa and abused them.

Oh, b.s.

1. Anyone can interpret the Bible any way they want to

2. which is why I think it's dangerous and stupid to use it

3. as your sole arbiter of morality.

4. They're ancient texts which come from an oral tradition that's been passed on and translated and re-translated in various languages over the course of thousands of years.

5. Plus the books in the Bible are picked and chosen by a group of MEN

6. who chose them for their own personal agendas. They in turn pass it on to other men who interpret the Bible through the lens of their own personal biases and their own personal agendas.

1. There are methods in interpreting the bible. Maybe the reason why you say that
Quote
interpret the Bible any way they want to
is becuase a lot of people find value in the wisdom. Example, when you quoted in the other thread that you are more Christ like than most of the people here, don't you think you personally find value in being Christ like?

2. Being Christ like (in the bible) while saying that the bible is dangerous and stupid is contradicting. Unless you also accept that you are , in your own words "stupid" too.

3. So if I may ask you, what is your sole basis of morality?

4. It was written by scribes.

5. Yes it was chosen by a group of men. Same goes with all the constitutions of the government which the constituents respect and uphold. Most of the people who wrote the constitution are well versed and educated men whose expertise are most often unquestionable.

6. If it was for their own personal agendas, they would have changed the words. Example, from slavery to workers. Then you wouldn't have issues with that. However, the translators' interpretation/translation from hebrew, greek & aramaic to english or whatever language are so concise that it wouldn't change the whole concept/idea of the bible.

Offline dpogs

  • Trade Count: (+95)
  • PinoyDVD Legend
  • *****
  • Posts: 4,397
  • love and discipline
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 483
Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #2353 on: Aug 23, 2016 at 10:08 PM »
One example of using the Bible for their own agenda:

Quoting what Jesus said

“He that is without sin among you, let him cast the first stone at her.”

 And then declares that Jesus spoke against death penalty using that quote. Yan ang malinaw na paggamit ng Bible for his own personal agenda.
There is none righteous, no not one.

Offline Klaus Weasley

  • Trade Count: (+16)
  • PinoyDVD Legend
  • *****
  • Posts: 8,646
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 511
Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #2354 on: Aug 25, 2016 at 10:19 PM »

Offline dpogs

  • Trade Count: (+95)
  • PinoyDVD Legend
  • *****
  • Posts: 4,397
  • love and discipline
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 483
Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #2355 on: Oct 22, 2016 at 11:35 AM »
sorry, I did not follow...

Christian = Catholics, Protestants, INC, Aglipays, Mormons, etc.
Non-Christians = Muslims, Buddhists, etc.

Believing in God/Jesus Christ as God doesnt mean youre already a Christian...

Satan also believe in God...


Dont associate the word "Christian" to any person believing in God/Jesus Christ because Satan also believe in God/Jesus and Satan is not a Christian.


PS. Using your definition of christian please include INC as non-christian... Why call them chrisitan eh Jesus Christ for therm is just only a human never a God.
« Last Edit: Oct 22, 2016 at 11:45 AM by dpogs »
There is none righteous, no not one.

Offline tony

  • Trade Count: (+5)
  • PinoyDVD Legend
  • *****
  • Posts: 4,116
  • Enjoy the hobby and be happy always!
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 7149
Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #2356 on: Oct 22, 2016 at 11:53 AM »
eh paano nga kung sa pagbabalik no Kristo, itatwa kayong lahat? sino kayo? di ko kayo kilala.....paano na?
how do we defend our freedom? by the truth when it is assaulted by Marcos lies....

Offline dpogs

  • Trade Count: (+95)
  • PinoyDVD Legend
  • *****
  • Posts: 4,397
  • love and discipline
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 483
Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #2357 on: Oct 22, 2016 at 12:27 PM »
eh paano nga kung sa pagbabalik no Kristo, itatwa kayong lahat? sino kayo? di ko kayo kilala.....paano na?

That is why faith is needed for this kind of question.

There is none righteous, no not one.

Offline tony

  • Trade Count: (+5)
  • PinoyDVD Legend
  • *****
  • Posts: 4,116
  • Enjoy the hobby and be happy always!
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 7149
Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #2358 on: Oct 22, 2016 at 12:40 PM »
That is why faith is needed for this kind of question.



kaya nga eh, paano kung sabihan ka ni Kristo, nauhaw ako pero hindi mo ako pinansin?
how do we defend our freedom? by the truth when it is assaulted by Marcos lies....

Offline Nelson de Leon

  • Trade Count: (+141)
  • PinoyDVD Legend
  • *****
  • Posts: 10,084
  • Let us lead by example
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 291
Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #2359 on: Oct 22, 2016 at 12:41 PM »
eh paano nga kung sa pagbabalik no Kristo, itatwa kayong lahat? sino kayo? di ko kayo kilala.....paano na?

To quote you dati:

"It's a personal thing." hehe!

You have a point. What if ikaw naman ang itatwa?

Offline tony

  • Trade Count: (+5)
  • PinoyDVD Legend
  • *****
  • Posts: 4,116
  • Enjoy the hobby and be happy always!
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 7149
Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #2360 on: Oct 22, 2016 at 12:43 PM »
To quote you dati:

"It's a personal thing." hehe!

You have a point. What if ikaw naman ang itatwa?

eh di tanggapin....
how do we defend our freedom? by the truth when it is assaulted by Marcos lies....

Offline Nelson de Leon

  • Trade Count: (+141)
  • PinoyDVD Legend
  • *****
  • Posts: 10,084
  • Let us lead by example
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 291
Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #2361 on: Oct 22, 2016 at 12:51 PM »
eh di tanggapin....

Oo nga naman. As if we all have a choice.

Offline tony

  • Trade Count: (+5)
  • PinoyDVD Legend
  • *****
  • Posts: 4,116
  • Enjoy the hobby and be happy always!
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 7149
Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #2362 on: Oct 22, 2016 at 12:53 PM »
^the least of my worries....
how do we defend our freedom? by the truth when it is assaulted by Marcos lies....

Offline dpogs

  • Trade Count: (+95)
  • PinoyDVD Legend
  • *****
  • Posts: 4,397
  • love and discipline
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 483
Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #2363 on: Oct 28, 2016 at 02:16 AM »
It is my conviction na anumang hakbang na tulad ng EDSA 1986 "People Power" ay hindi kalooban ng Diyos. There is always a reason why God appointed/put leader in every nation.

Naniniwala ako na "God's Power" ang dapat na manaig kesa sa "People's Power". if God put Du30 in power then we must believe that only God can bring Du30 down. Bakit ako sasali sa mga movement o rally na magpapalis sa puwesto ng kung sinumang nakaupong pinuno ng bansa? That only show that I don't have faith and trust in God's power to "remove kings"* and why He "setteth up kings"*.


*Dan.2
There is none righteous, no not one.

Offline dpogs

  • Trade Count: (+95)
  • PinoyDVD Legend
  • *****
  • Posts: 4,397
  • love and discipline
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 483
Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #2364 on: Nov 04, 2016 at 12:29 AM »
Yung governing authorities noon Roman Empire and we know iba yung belief system nila and yet Paul send that message to the believers.

Anyhow kung kinausap ng Diyos si Duterte inde naman katakataka yun...

Yup. Because God commanded all His believers to submit to those who are in authority. But nowhere in the Bible you can find the phrase or with the same meaning of "For the one in authority is God's servant."

Satan is in authority over this world power and kingdoms. So Satan is God's servant if we follow your definition?
There is none righteous, no not one.

Offline pTrader

  • Trade Count: (+4)
  • Collector
  • **
  • Posts: 487
  • Please be kind.
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 10
Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #2365 on: Nov 04, 2016 at 12:42 AM »
Yup. Because God commanded all His believers to submit to those who are in authority. But nowhere in the Bible you can find the phrase or with the same meaning of "For the one in authority is God's servant."

Satan is in authority over this world power and kingdoms. So Satan is God's servant if we follow your definition?

Please read Romans 13:1-7 in their proper context.  Your Satan argument is irrelevant to Paul's message:

Romans 13New International Version (NIV)

Submission to Governing Authorities
13 Let everyone be subject to the governing authorities, for there is no authority except that which God has established. The authorities that exist have been established by God. 2 Consequently, whoever rebels against the authority is rebelling against what God has instituted, and those who do so will bring judgment on themselves. 3 For rulers hold no terror for those who do right, but for those who do wrong. Do you want to be free from fear of the one in authority? Then do what is right and you will be commended. 4 For the one in authority is God’s servant for your good. But if you do wrong, be afraid, for rulers do not bear the sword for no reason. They are God’s servants, agents of wrath to bring punishment on the wrongdoer. 5 Therefore, it is necessary to submit to the authorities, not only because of possible punishment but also as a matter of conscience.

6 This is also why you pay taxes, for the authorities are God’s servants, who give their full time to governing. 7 Give to everyone what you owe them: If you owe taxes, pay taxes; if revenue, then revenue; if respect, then respect; if honor, then honor.

Offline dpogs

  • Trade Count: (+95)
  • PinoyDVD Legend
  • *****
  • Posts: 4,397
  • love and discipline
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 483
Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #2366 on: Nov 04, 2016 at 01:39 AM »
Please read Romans 13:1-7 in their proper context.  Your Satan argument is irrelevant to Paul's message:

Romans 13New International Version (NIV)

Submission to Governing Authorities
13 Let everyone be subject to the governing authorities, for there is no authority except that which God has established. The authorities that exist have been established by God. 2 Consequently, whoever rebels against the authority is rebelling against what God has instituted, and those who do so will bring judgment on themselves. 3 For rulers hold no terror for those who do right, but for those who do wrong. Do you want to be free from fear of the one in authority? Then do what is right and you will be commended. 4 For the one in authority is God’s servant for your good. But if you do wrong, be afraid, for rulers do not bear the sword for no reason. They are God’s servants, agents of wrath to bring punishment on the wrongdoer. 5 Therefore, it is necessary to submit to the authorities, not only because of possible punishment but also as a matter of conscience.

6 This is also why you pay taxes, for the authorities are God’s servants, who give their full time to governing. 7 Give to everyone what you owe them: If you owe taxes, pay taxes; if revenue, then revenue; if respect, then respect; if honor, then honor.


oh... you're using the New International Version RE the use of phrase "God's servant" :( I am more accustomed to this translation:

"4 For he is the minister of God to thee for good. But if thou do that which is evil, be afraid; for he beareth not the sword in vain: for he is the minister of God, a revenger to execute wrath upon him that doeth evil."



There is none righteous, no not one.

Offline pTrader

  • Trade Count: (+4)
  • Collector
  • **
  • Posts: 487
  • Please be kind.
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 10
Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #2367 on: Nov 28, 2016 at 12:41 AM »
^^^bout Hitler, Marcos, Castro, etc...

Offline dpogs

  • Trade Count: (+95)
  • PinoyDVD Legend
  • *****
  • Posts: 4,397
  • love and discipline
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 483
Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #2368 on: Dec 08, 2016 at 09:18 AM »
My God wants me to follow the law and the rules of government. I dont to the God of yours.

no wonder if someday you will forsake your so called god in order to survive in this world :( :( :(

some government law requires their people to sacrifice children - according to their law if not followed you will be killed... will you follow that law?
some government law forbid their people to worship your god - according to their law if not followed you will be killed... will you follow that law?


My God wants me to follow only His law. Nothing else.


my advice... laws in this world are just temporary... will change depende sa kung sino ang namuno... but your God will never change... hope you follow only your God not this government.
There is none righteous, no not one.

Offline pTrader

  • Trade Count: (+4)
  • Collector
  • **
  • Posts: 487
  • Please be kind.
  • Liked:
  • Likes Given: 10
Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #2369 on: Dec 08, 2016 at 09:56 AM »
no wonder if someday you will forsake your so called god in order to survive in this world :( :( :(

some government law requires their people to sacrifice children - according to their law if not followed you will be killed... will you follow that law?
some government law forbid their people to worship your god - according to their law if not followed you will be killed... will you follow that law?


My God wants me to follow only His law. Nothing else.


my advice... laws in this world are just temporary... will change depende sa kung sino ang namuno... but your God will never change... hope you follow only your God not this government.

13 Let everyone be subject to the governing authorities, for there is no authority except that which God has established. The authorities that exist have been established by God.