Author Topic: PROVING GOD WITHOUT THE BIBLE  (Read 85516 times)

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Offline Nelson de Leon

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Re: PROVING GOD WITHOUT THE BIBLE
« Reply #510 on: May 22, 2018 at 08:47 PM »
Aside from those, what is he "made" of? If he's not composed of anything from this universe, then there's no way to prove him.
Can you give to me the composition of love?

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Offline bumblebee

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Re: PROVING GOD WITHOUT THE BIBLE
« Reply #511 on: May 22, 2018 at 08:50 PM »
^Pheromones, electric signals?

Offline Nelson de Leon

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Re: PROVING GOD WITHOUT THE BIBLE
« Reply #512 on: May 23, 2018 at 10:14 PM »
^Pheromones, electric signals?

Hehe! Actually what i'm trying to point out is, not all things can be quantified or be physically existent in order to prove that it exists. Like gravity...

Offline bumblebee

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Re: PROVING GOD WITHOUT THE BIBLE
« Reply #513 on: May 23, 2018 at 10:35 PM »
I can't say i agree but let's leave it at that.

Going back, if god is a part if this universe, yes, he may be proven without the bible.

Offline tony

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Re: PROVING GOD WITHOUT THE BIBLE
« Reply #514 on: May 24, 2018 at 08:37 AM »
God did not require proof, never.... either you believe or you do not, bible or no bible....

even our ancients believed in Bathala....the Mayans and the Egytians, the Arabs and the Indians and Hindus...

we all do not have to reinvent God each time...
« Last Edit: May 24, 2018 at 08:39 AM by tony »
how do we defend our freedom? by the truth when it is assaulted by Marcos lies....

Offline dpogs

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Re: PROVING GOD WITHOUT THE BIBLE
« Reply #515 on: May 24, 2018 at 11:21 AM »
I can't say i agree but let's leave it at that.

Going back, if god is a part if this universe, yes, he may be proven without the bible.

God is not part of this system or universe. If He is then He is not God. He is not affected by time, matter and space. The creation itself proves that there is God. Its up to us whether to believe it or not. :)

https://youtu.be/w6AHcv19NIc
« Last Edit: May 24, 2018 at 01:05 PM by dpogs »
There is none righteous, no not one.

Offline Nelson de Leon

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Re: PROVING GOD WITHOUT THE BIBLE
« Reply #516 on: May 26, 2018 at 08:38 PM »
I can't say i agree but let's leave it at that.

Going back, if god is a part if this universe, yes, he may be proven without the bible.

To rephrase what Dpogs said, and to clarify my description of God, He is the creator of the universe. So what Dpogs means is as a Creator, God is distinct from the universe.

Analogy:

Dpogs is distinct from the universe meaning he may not be part of the universe though Dpogs is in the universe.

Offline bumblebee

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Re: PROVING GOD WITHOUT THE BIBLE
« Reply #517 on: May 26, 2018 at 08:51 PM »
That is fine. Like i said, if that's God's definition, then he can't be proven.

Offline tigkal

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Re: PROVING GOD WITHOUT THE BIBLE
« Reply #518 on: May 26, 2018 at 09:24 PM »
There is a netflix series titled explained. About dna splicing. Technology is now available to create a being in our likeness or liking. Maybe replicating the creation of man.

Offline Nelson de Leon

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Re: PROVING GOD WITHOUT THE BIBLE
« Reply #519 on: May 26, 2018 at 09:36 PM »
That is fine. Like i said, if that's God's definition, then he can't be proven.

It actually can sir. Everything around us is a creation. There must be a higher being that made everything.

There is a netflix series titled explained. About dna splicing. Technology is now available to create a being in our likeness or liking. Maybe replicating the creation of man.

Like what Dpogs said, there's a difference between creation and reproduction. Creation is making something out of nothing. Reproduction is making something out of something. The example you gave is making a human from DNA splicing and feeding it with enough nutrients in order for it to grow. That's reproducing. The creation i am describing is making something out of nothing. Your example used DNA. They cannot make humans without the proper DNA, nutrients, equipments etc.

Offline bumblebee

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Re: PROVING GOD WITHOUT THE BIBLE
« Reply #520 on: May 26, 2018 at 09:43 PM »
It actually can sir. Everything around us is a creation. There must be a higher being that made everything.

Beg to differ as that's not a proof. It's just something we believe or want to believe.

Offline Nelson de Leon

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Re: PROVING GOD WITHOUT THE BIBLE
« Reply #521 on: May 26, 2018 at 09:45 PM »
Beg to differ as that's not a proof. It's just something we believe or want to believe.

Fair enough. So if I may ask, what is your belief about the existence of everything?

Offline bumblebee

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Re: PROVING GOD WITHOUT THE BIBLE
« Reply #522 on: May 26, 2018 at 09:54 PM »
Short answer, there's a god. He triggered the big bang.

Offline Nelson de Leon

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Re: PROVING GOD WITHOUT THE BIBLE
« Reply #523 on: May 26, 2018 at 11:30 PM »
Short answer, there's a god. He triggered the big bang.

And who made the big bang?

Offline bumblebee

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Re: PROVING GOD WITHOUT THE BIBLE
« Reply #524 on: May 26, 2018 at 11:52 PM »
I'd like to believe God made, triggered, snapped, etc, the big bang. Sorry if it wasn't clear.
« Last Edit: May 27, 2018 at 08:41 AM by bumblebee »

Offline Nelson de Leon

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Re: PROVING GOD WITHOUT THE BIBLE
« Reply #525 on: May 27, 2018 at 12:32 AM »
I believe God made, triggered, snapped, etc, the big bang. Sorry if it wasn't clear.

Agreed!

Offline bumblebee

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Re: PROVING GOD WITHOUT THE BIBLE
« Reply #526 on: May 27, 2018 at 08:42 AM »

Offline tigkal

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Re: PROVING GOD WITHOUT THE BIBLE
« Reply #527 on: May 27, 2018 at 10:41 AM »
Short answer, there's a god. He triggered the big bang.
There are other galaxies other than ours. Different God who made the others? Or only one? 4.5b to make a universe is too long. What is logical is that the universe creation is based on science and by random events. Man created by design.

Offline dpogs

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Re: PROVING GOD WITHOUT THE BIBLE
« Reply #528 on: May 27, 2018 at 10:58 AM »
There are other galaxies other than ours. Different God who made the others? Or only one? 4.5b to make a universe is too long. What is logical is that the universe creation is based on science and by random events. Man created by design.

?

Meron pa bang ibang bigbang? :) di ba bigbang theory doon na galing lahat ng galaxies including ours.
There is none righteous, no not one.

Offline bumblebee

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Re: PROVING GOD WITHOUT THE BIBLE
« Reply #529 on: May 27, 2018 at 12:04 PM »
There are other galaxies other than ours. Different God who made the others? Or only one? 4.5b to make a universe is too long. What is logical is that the universe creation is based on science and by random events. Man created by design.

There is only one big bang and it didn't take 4.5b years to create the universe. I don't understand the rest of your post.

Offline tigkal

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Re: PROVING GOD WITHOUT THE BIBLE
« Reply #530 on: May 27, 2018 at 04:57 PM »
There is only one big bang and it didn't take 4.5b years to create the universe. I don't understand the rest of your post.
So creation took six days only? Science estimates 4.5b years ago the big bang. If you mean universe is all galaxies discovered and to be discovered with only one creator, hard to prove. Only by faith you can believe it. By science cannot as of this moment.

Offline tigkal

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Re: PROVING GOD WITHOUT THE BIBLE
« Reply #531 on: May 27, 2018 at 05:05 PM »
?

Meron pa bang ibang bigbang? :) di ba bigbang theory doon na galing lahat ng galaxies including ours.
Only one big bang. But other galaxies were created million years after big bang.

Offline bumblebee

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Re: PROVING GOD WITHOUT THE BIBLE
« Reply #532 on: May 27, 2018 at 05:16 PM »
Where did you get 6 days?

We are 13.8b years from the big bang. Baka earth tinutukoy mo with the 4.5b years.

Offline dpogs

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Re: PROVING GOD WITHOUT THE BIBLE
« Reply #533 on: May 27, 2018 at 10:16 PM »
Only one big bang. But other galaxies were created million years after big bang.

Hmmm i think bumblebee means only 1 God since theres only 1 bigbang. :)
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Offline Nelson de Leon

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Re: PROVING GOD WITHOUT THE BIBLE
« Reply #534 on: May 27, 2018 at 11:56 PM »
There is only one big bang and it didn't take 4.5b years to create the universe. I don't understand the rest of your post.
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Offline docelmo

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Re: PROVING GOD WITHOUT THE BIBLE
« Reply #535 on: May 28, 2018 at 06:32 AM »
Let us examine the  pattern of evidence, first is existence of all matter from single point in the distant past (big bang), next the presence of natural of laws governing the universe, another is the presence of information in the DNA of all living things....all these points to a powerful intelligent mind beyond space and time. That to me is a pretty good description of GOD.
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Offline Nelson de Leon

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Re: PROVING GOD WITHOUT THE BIBLE
« Reply #536 on: May 28, 2018 at 01:19 PM »
Man created by design.

Sir 2 questions.

1. I don't get your stance regarding the existence of God. I get confusing detaila from your statements.

2. What do you mean "man created by design"?

Offline tigkal

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Re: PROVING GOD WITHOUT THE BIBLE
« Reply #537 on: May 29, 2018 at 02:00 PM »
There are two creations, the universe and Man. I believe someone made man because he is created by design. There is a missing link in the evolutionary process. Therefore there is intervention. There are 5 major races in the world. Confirmed by DNA. Our DNA has a Master DNA, which allows mutation to some extent but there are limits as to what it can mutate into. The Master DNA see to it that it will not mutate beyond what is allowed. That is why we do not see persons with two heads, 4 arms, legs, etc.. Humans mutate into these condition but it will be stopped by the Master DNA. Hence we see some freaks born into the world but it will stop there.  European races tend to have some thick skull and Asian races have thin skulls. That is the mutation due to environment and allowed by the Master DNA.

As to the God who created the universe, that is a bit far fetched because new galaxies are born by the year. And if you read the bible, it seems that the creation process have been completed. This is creation  by random events, not design.

There is an episode in Netflix Bill Nye saves the world about evolution for better understanding.
« Last Edit: May 29, 2018 at 02:02 PM by tigkal »

Offline Nelson de Leon

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Re: PROVING GOD WITHOUT THE BIBLE
« Reply #538 on: May 29, 2018 at 07:32 PM »
There are two creations, the universe and Man. I believe 1. someone made man because he is created by design. There is a missing link in the evolutionary process. Therefore there is 2. intervention. There are 5 major races in the world. Confirmed by DNA. Our DNA has a Master DNA, which allows mutation to some extent but there are limits as to what it can mutate into. The Master DNA see to it that it will not mutate beyond what is allowed. That is why we do not see persons with two heads, 4 arms, legs, etc.. Humans mutate into these condition but it will be stopped by the Master DNA. Hence we see some freaks born into the world but it will stop there.  European races tend to have some thick skull and Asian races have thin skulls. That is the mutation due to environment and allowed by the Master DNA.

As to the God who created the universe, that is a bit far fetched because4. new galaxies are born by the year. And if you read the bible, it seems that the creation process have been completed. This is creation  by 5. random events, not design.

There is an episode in Netflix Bill Nye saves the world about evolution for better understanding.

1. Who do you believe is that someone?

2. What, how or who intervened?

3. I don't understand master DNA? Could you further explain it? How does "master DNA" limit mutation?

4. I don't know of any galaxies born each year. Discovered, yes. Born meaning out of nothing, I don't think so.

5. Do you know how many possibilities or chances are there to create that "random event"?
« Last Edit: May 29, 2018 at 07:42 PM by Nelson de Leon »

Offline docelmo

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Re: PROVING GOD WITHOUT THE BIBLE
« Reply #539 on: May 29, 2018 at 08:25 PM »
That is fine. Like i said, if that's God's definition, then he can't be proven.


We can prove that the creator exists by the very existences or evidence of his creation.

In the same manner we can prove that somebody built or created say, a car, a watch, a house, an amplifier. All of which are by the way a lot more simpler than creating life, man, earth or the universe. All these most certainly can't  create themselves or exist by chance. It takes a lot more faith to believe in chance than to believe in the existence of God.

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