Topic: The Religion Thread

[RU9]

Barrister: no individual predestination, yes free will
Ptrader: yes individual predestination, no free will
Dpogs: both yes

All of the above will go to heaven?
or
only God knows?

[dpogs]

All of the above will go to heaven?
or
only God knows?

only God knows? not really... the Bible says maari mong malaman yan

These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God. I John 5:13 KJV

This is one of my favorite verses at isa sa pinanghahawakan kong mga promises of God.

[Nelson de Leon]

What is the purpose of spreading the gospel if you are predestined to go to hell?

[dpogs]

What is the purpose of spreading the gospel if you are predestined to go to hell?

We are not predestined to go to hell... we are going to hell because we are sinners. we willingly commit sins. no one force us to commit sins because our heart is exceedingly wicked.

[Nelson de Leon]

We are not predestined to go to hell... we are going to hell because we are sinners. we willingly commit sins. no one force us to commit sins because our heart is exceedingly wicked.

Same question pa din. Hehe! What is the purpose of spreading the gospel if we are not predestined to go to hell.

[dpogs]

Same question pa din. Hehe! What is the purpose of spreading the gospel if we are not predestined to go to hell.

For the glory of God

"For of him, and through him, and to him, are all things: to whom be glory for ever. Amen." Rom.11:36


- God's word tells us to preach the gospel Mark 16:15
- It changes lives II Cor. 5:17
- Why not, it is a good news!

[bumblebee]

only God knows? not really... the Bible says maari mong malaman yan

These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God. I John 5:13 KJV

This is one of my favorite verses at isa sa pinanghahawakan kong mga promises of God.

So nalaman mo na kung pupunta kang heaven? Were you predestined?

[dpogs]

So nalaman mo na kung pupunta kang heaven? Were you predestined?

puwede mo ring malaman... sabi sa Bible

"...believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life,"

hindi sa nalaman ko... kungdi iyan ang sinasabi ng Bible at iyan ang pangako ng Diyos.

[pTrader]

What is the purpose of spreading the gospel if you are predestined to go to hell?

isa sa malinaw na purpose ng gospel:

Roman 1:16Sapagka't hindi ko ikinahihiya ang evangelio: sapagka't siyang kapangyarihan ng Dios sa ikaliligtas ng bawa't sumasampalataya; una'y sa Judio, at gayon din sa Griego. 17Sapagka't dito ang katuwiran ng Dios ay nahahayag mula sa pananampalataya hanggang sa pananampalataya: gaya ng nasusulat, Nguni't ang ganap ay mabubuhay sa pamamagitan ng pananampalataya.


lahat naman po pupunta ng hell kasi dahil sa ating pagkakasala sa Dios.
dahil sa habag, biyaya at awa ng Dios may hinirang upang inde lahat mapunta ng hell.

[pTrader]

So nalaman mo na kung pupunta kang heaven? Were you predestined?

Opo, ang Banal na Espirito po ang magpapatotoo sa iyo mismo na anak ka ng Dios.

Romans 8:14Sapagka't ang lahat ng mga pinapatnubayan ng Espiritu ng Dios, ay sila ang mga anak ng Dios. 15Sapagka't hindi ninyo muling tinanggap ang espiritu ng pagkaalipin sa ikatatakot; datapuwa't tinanggap ninyo ang espiritu ng pagkukupkop, na dahil dito'y sumisigaw tayo, Abba, Ama. 16Ang Espiritu rin ang nagpapatotoo kasama ng ating espiritu, na tayo'y mga anak ng Dios: 17At kung mga anak, ay mga tagapagmana nga; mga tagapagmana sa Dios, at mga kasamang tagapagmana ni Cristo; kung gayon nga makipagtiis tayo sa kaniya, upang tayo'y lumuwalhati namang kasama niya.

[bumblebee]

Opo, ang Banal na Espirito po ang magpapatotoo sa iyo mismo na anak ka ng Dios.

Romans 8:14Sapagka't ang lahat ng mga pinapatnubayan ng Espiritu ng Dios, ay sila ang mga anak ng Dios. 15Sapagka't hindi ninyo muling tinanggap ang espiritu ng pagkaalipin sa ikatatakot; datapuwa't tinanggap ninyo ang espiritu ng pagkukupkop, na dahil dito'y sumisigaw tayo, Abba, Ama. 16Ang Espiritu rin ang nagpapatotoo kasama ng ating espiritu, na tayo'y mga anak ng Dios: 17At kung mga anak, ay mga tagapagmana nga; mga tagapagmana sa Dios, at mga kasamang tagapagmana ni Cristo; kung gayon nga makipagtiis tayo sa kaniya, upang tayo'y lumuwalhati namang kasama niya.

So there's no way you're going in hell? Guaranteed seat ka na sa heaven?

[pTrader]

Barrister: no individual predestination, yes free will
Ptrader: yes individual predestination, no free will
Dpogs: both yes

care to explain?

[dpogs]

care to explain?

Kailangan po muna natin sir magkasundo ano ibig sibihin ng 'free will'.

[pTrader]

So there's no way you're going in hell? Guaranteed seat ka na sa heaven?

opo

[pTrader]

Kailangan po muna natin sir magkasundo ano ibig sibihin ng 'free will'.

siguro magkakassundo muna tayo sa choices, if you will permit for the meantime..

[rexFi]

If Adam didn't have a Choice then God is the "Author of Sin".

Visit us here...

[pTrader]

If Adam didn't have a Choice then God is the "Author of Sin".

Visit us here...

Before and after the fall of man, may choice po ang tao.

[dpogs]

I mean for you sir, what is free will?

For me free will is the ability to decide, gaano man kaunti o kadami ang choices in the end it is you who decide.

When the devil entice eve, it is not the devil who ate the fruit but Eve. Eve decided to eat the fruit and she wanted it.

When God clothed Adam and Eve, it is Adam and Eve choice to allow God clothed them and they wanted it.

When God touched my heart and lead me to salvation, it is me who accepted Christ and I want it during that time.

[jerix]

There is only one thing that all must accept. And that is, God is the author of all things because he is the creator of all things. He knows the consequences of the interactions of his creations, bad or good. This is the law of cause and effect. The creator knows the pains and sufferings and the joys or happiness on the other hand. For me, life is God himself and it is the manifestation of his power. There is no reason of him creating life in the physical and the flesh, other that to gain some experience and eventually more power.

[pTrader]

I mean for you sir, what is free will?

For me free will is the ability to decide, gaano man kaunti o kadami ang choices in the end it is you who decide.

When the devil entice eve, it is not the devil who ate the fruit but Eve. Eve decided to eat the fruit and she wanted it.

When God clothed Adam and Eve, it is Adam and Eve choice to allow God clothed them and they wanted it.

When God touched my heart and lead me to salvation, it is me who accepted Christ and I want it during that time.

21The Lord God made garments of skin for Adam and his wife and clothed them.

When God clothed Adam and Eve, it is Adam and Eve choice to allow God clothed them and they wanted it.

The action of clothing them is purely God's action. I did not find in the Scriptures that it is  only by Adam and Eve permission that God clothed them rather God made garments and clothed Adam and Eve.

[tigkal]

only God knows? not really... the Bible says maari mong malaman yan

These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God. I John 5:13 KJV

This is one of my favorite verses at isa sa pinanghahawakan kong mga promises of God.

Kaso meron naman yata verse sa bible na during end times, some people were telling that they were casting demons in Jesus's name, but still Christ did not know them. How sure are we that we are not those people? I guess what is really in your heart is what matters most. It is not religion, or good deeds, or faith. It is the heart, which means the motive or reason why you do what you do and believe in the beliefs of your faith or religion. In the end, it is God's decision, which will be based on your heart. Your treasure is where your heart is. Be it money, salvation, happiness, fear of hell, etc.

[dpogs]

21The Lord God made garments of skin for Adam and his wife and clothed them.

The action of clothing them is purely God's action. I did not find in the Scriptures that it is  only by Adam and Eve permission that God clothed them rather God made garments and clothed Adam and Eve.

it is still their choice whether to accept God's clothing or not. also, i dont see in the Bible that God forced Adam and Eve to wear the garments of skin.

[dpogs]

Kaso meron naman yata verse sa bible na during end times, some people were telling that they were casting demons in Jesus's name, but still Christ did not know them. How sure are we that we are not those people? I guess what is really in your heart is what matters most. It is not religion, or good deeds, or faith. It is the heart, which means the motive or reason why you do what you do and believe in the beliefs of your faith or religion. In the end, it is God's decision, which will be based on your heart. Your treasure is where your heart is. Be it money, salvation, happiness, fear of hell, etc.

Judas i believed ay hindi tunay na anak ng Diyos, but he is one of the apostles and he also perfromed miracles, nagpagaling ng mga may sakit in Jesus name.

for without faith it is impossible to please God. God or the bible never said that for without heart it is impossible to please God. God requires faith not what is in our heart. in fact the Bible mentioned that our heart is exceedingly wicked. our heart is the main reason why we cant follow the last commandment (#10) of ten commandment (the rest we can follow them).

[pTrader]

it is still their choice whether to accept God's clothing or not. also, i dont see in the Bible that God forced Adam and Eve to wear the garments of skin.

Neither that a man exercise his "free will" not to wear the clothes God gave them.

They were not forced to wear but provided to wear.

In line with your presentation, Did God force Adam  or it is the choice of Adam to sleep in the verse below:

21So the Lord God caused the man to fall into a deep sleep; and while he was sleeping, he took one of the man’s ribsg and then closed up the place with flesh. 22Then the Lord God made a woman from the ribh he had taken out of the man, and he brought her to the man

[dpogs]

Neither that a man exercise his "free will" not to wear the clothes God gave them.

They were not forced to wear but provided to wear.

In line with your presentation, Did God force Adam  or it is the choice of Adam to sleep in the verse below:

21So the Lord God caused the man to fall into a deep sleep; and while he was sleeping, he took one of the man’s ribsg and then closed up the place with flesh. 22Then the Lord God made a woman from the ribh he had taken out of the man, and he brought her to the man

Providing and forcing is two different level of action. God provided salvation and we decide whether to accept it or not.

"... for whosever believeth shall be saved..."
"... Ano man ang binigay sa akin ng Diyos ay lumalapit sa akin..."

GOD saved me but i never experienced that He force me to believe Him. God provided a clothing for me and i still have a choice to accept it or not by faith.

Regarding God making Adam fall asleep. I believe Adam want that also since Adam is lonely and need ng isang kasama.

[pTrader]

Providing and forcing is two different level of action. God provided salvation and we decide whether to accept it or not.

"... for whosever believeth shall be saved..."
"... Ano man ang binigay sa akin ng Diyos ay lumalapit sa akin..."

GOD saved me but i never experienced that He force me to believe Him. God provided a clothing for me and i still have a choice to accept it or not by faith.

Regarding God making Adam fall asleep. I believe Adam want that also since Adam is lonely and need ng isang kasama.

Who is the one who determined the companion for Adam? God or Adam?

[dpogs]

It is Adam's choice to accept or not the companiom provided for him.

God provoded and determined the perfect salvation for us, it is our choice whether to accept it or not.

Salvation is a gift from God and it is our decision to accept the gift or not.

Ang binigay ng Diyos kay Jesus ay "naniwala" at "lumapit" kay Jesus. Wala akong nabasa sa Bible na ang mga taong ibinigay ng Diyos ay sapilitang lumapit o sapilitang naniwala.

[bumblebee]

Ang binigay ng Diyos kay Jesus ay "naniwala" at "lumapit" kay Jesus. Wala akong nabasa sa Bible na ang mga taong ibinigay ng Diyos ay sapilitang lumapit o sapilitang naniwala.

If that's the case, san papasok yung predestination?

[pTrader]

It is Adam's choice to accept or not the companiom provided for him.

God provoded and determined the perfect salvation for us, it is our choice whether to accept it or not.

Salvation is a gift from God and it is our decision to accept the gift or not.

Ang binigay ng Diyos kay Jesus ay "naniwala" at "lumapit" kay Jesus. Wala akong nabasa sa Bible na ang mga taong ibinigay ng Diyos ay sapilitang lumapit o sapilitang naniwala.

So choice mo rin mamili ng biological parents?

[pTrader]

If that's the case, san papasok yung predestination?

yung case na yun, salvation by work, wala ngang predestination..