Topic: 60w/ch - is this "enough"?

[markcrenz]

Di kaya iba ang standards ng thx rating for those? Ang alam ko, iba iba din ang standard nila depending on the application ng speakers.

yup they adapted several standards para mas marami silang ma-certify. more certification fees, mas happy! 

[markcrenz]

WOW !!!

 pa share naman ng mga models na yun

marami sir. if they don't publish the distortion at rated power, sigurado mataas!  

teka OT na yata. sorry...

[DTNS]

teka OT na yata. sorry...

oo nga. hahaha!    tinatanong ko lang kung malakas na ang tunog pag 60W/channel ang AVR, napunta sa THX certification ang usapan. 

[markcrenz]

teka ikaw din pala nagsimula ng thx na yan 

hehe! thanks!   

naisip ko malakas na rin siguro ang 60w/ch. ang HTIB na Logitech Z-906 THX-certified, 67w/ch na. so malakas na rin siguro to.

[Dilbert7]

What is confusing about the HK156 specs is this:

Power Requirement   AC 230V, 50Hz–60Hz, 100W
Power Consumption (full power/idle)   540W / 250W rated

http://uk.harmankardon.com/harman-kardon-product-detail-uk/avr-156-.html


power required of 100W for Power consumption (full power) of 540W and idle power of 250W  ! Incredible! (read: ridiculous!  - see idle power)


No AVR is more than or less than sufficient. It has to consider the speaker to be used, and the space of application.

Using a speaker of 90 dB and above, the combo will sound loud in the space indicated. And since the bass power is more likely to be outsourced to a powered SUB, the speakers will be in small position which will not need full bass frequencies making the 60W at 1KHz (probably 40W at 100Hz?) a little bit acceptable.

If the 25A HIGH INSTANTANEOUs CURRENT is to be believe - then HK 156 is capable of dynamic headroom up to 5kW (   I^2 xR - huh!) - or 1kW/ch. OK, I give up on this!  What is HK up to nowadays? Does HK156 uses digital amps?


Practically, HK 156 is enough for a 90dB speakers, set as 'small'. A 60W/ch is dynamically useful up to 6W (97dB resulting loudness per speaker). Since the nature of typical sounds is basically spiky, the measurement of 60W/ch (I hope this is averaged power) 2 channels driven is fair enough to apply in 5-spiky power requirements of sounds!

[jlester87]

power required of 100W for Power consumption (full power) of 540W and idle power of 250W   ! Incredible! (read: ridiculous!   - see idle power)

Probably the default bias current setting is high that it is drawing 250W even at idle mode.

At full load, it has 55% efficiency (which is typical to a class AB amp), at 540w power consumption, when the amp outputs (60w x 5ch) 300w to the speakers, the other 240w is dissipated as heat

[romymartinez]

The "Paul Joppa 102 db rule" can be good strting point in estimating amp power - speaker sensitivity combo:

From Audio Asylum

"Posted by Paul Joppa on August 05, 1999 at 21:08:11:

While I certainly don't want to suggest that science is everything, there are two points about SET amps that are highly predictable:

1) They are usually low power. You want typically 102dB capability for fully satisfactory sound.

The amp adds 10*log(watts) dB to the speaker sensitivity. (base 10 logarithm) Some examples:


45 tube 2 watts = 3dB wants 99dB speaker
2A3 tube 3.5 watts = 5dB wants 97dB speaker
300B amp 8 watts = 9dB wants 93dB speaker
88dB speaker wants 14dB = 25 watts
90dB speaker wants 12dB = 16 watts


You can have lots of fun with less power, if your room is tiny and/or you like chamber music or little-girl-with-acoustic-guitar music, but this is the standard minimum.
2) Most SET amps are without feedback. Triode amps without feedback, SE or push-pull, have a damping factor of 2 or so, not the 50-1000 of heaviily fed-back sand amps. This means the bass resonances of the speaker are "loosened up" a little - expect the bass to change! Speakers whose bass is a little too quick and tight with a feedback amp are likely to come alive with a no-feedback amp, while flabby bass will just get worse."

[vhinx]

oo nga. hahaha!    tinatanong ko lang kung malakas na ang tunog pag 60W/channel ang AVR, napunta sa THX certification ang usapan. 

Nakaka lito at mahihilo ka nga... Ganito na lang, kung 60wrms per channel AVR gagamitin mo sa space na 18sqr. ba kamo ay Busog na sa lakas ng sounds mo dyan bro kahit na china o philippines made pa gamitin mo speakers isama mo pa active subs.

[JojoD818]

oo nga. hahaha!    tinatanong ko lang kung malakas na ang tunog pag 60W/channel ang AVR, napunta sa THX certification ang usapan. 

mabuti nga related pa din sa audio/HT yun THX... yun thread ng tube buffer sa tubes section napunta sa butter eh...