Topic: PC HDMI and 192khz/24-bit Audio

[Philander]

Can anyone confirm if an HDMI-capable Receiver can decode the raw 192khz/24-bit (or even 96khz/24) Audio from a PC or a Laptop?

So the output is high-resolution studio like audio.

The settings and connection is:
Laptop or PC with HDMI (set the audio using HDMI with 192/24 sample rate), connected via HDMI cable to the AVReceiver with HDMI input and the Receiver will process it as 192/24 bit audio (not down-converted to 48/24 bit or 44.1/24).

By using this connection/set-up, you are allowing the receiver to process the audio using its DAC/DSP chip (not DSP effects), thus getting the maximum audio resolution.

Even your lousy MP3s can be up-converted to 192-96/24 bit audio, and the audio difference is night and day.

I can do this my old Acer Laptop through SPDIF and with my Marantz (no HDMI). I want to know if this is possible with HDMI-equipped receiver.

Thanks.

[Stagea]

Can anyone confirm if an HDMI-capable Receiver can decode the raw 192khz/24-bit (or even 96khz/24) Audio from a PC or a Laptop?

So the output is high-resolution studio like audio.

The settings and connection is:
Laptop or PC with HDMI (set the audio using HDMI with 192/24 sample rate), connected via HDMI cable to the AVReceiver with HDMI input and the Receiver will process it as 192/24 bit audio (not down-converted to 48/24 bit or 44.1/24).

By using this connection/set-up, you are allowing the receiver to process the audio using is DSP chip (not DSP effects), thus getting the maximum audio resolution.

Even your lousy MP3s can be up-converted to 192-96/24 bit audio, and the audio difference is night and day.

I can do this my old Acer Laptop through SPDIF and with my Marantz (no HDMI). I want to know if this is possible with HDMI-equipped receiver.

Thanks.

Yes it is possible. Most AVRs I've encountered shut off processing when handling 192/24 however, as they're limited to processing data upto 96/24.

Since data from MP3 files is in floating point, encoding MP3s from sources superior to CDs and DVDs actually make sense (and playback in systems capable of handling higher resolutions can also help).

[Philander]

Yes it is possible. Most AVRs I've encountered shut off processing when handling 192/24 however, as they're limited to processing data upto 96/24.

Since data from MP3 files is in floating point, encoding MP3s from sources superior to CDs and DVDs actually make sense (and playback in systems capable of handling higher resolutions can also help).

Thanks for the confirmation, I can now retire my old receiver and start hunting HDMI-equipped receiver.

I wonder why most of the audio enthusiast here don't use this kind of audio set-up. I am using this since 2005 and the audio out is like HD quality, even my high-end SACD/DVD-Audio players has not match to the quality of the 96/24 audio

[Courage]

Can anyone confirm if an HDMI-capable Receiver can decode the raw 192khz/24-bit (or even 96khz/24) Audio from a PC or a Laptop?

So the output is high-resolution studio like audio.

The settings and connection is:
Laptop or PC with HDMI (set the audio using HDMI with 192/24 sample rate), connected via HDMI cable to the AVReceiver with HDMI input and the Receiver will process it as 192/24 bit audio (not down-converted to 48/24 bit or 44.1/24).

By using this connection/set-up, you are allowing the receiver to process the audio using is DAC/DSP chip (not DSP effects), thus getting the maximum audio resolution.

Even your lousy MP3s can be up-converted to 192-96/24 bit audio, and the audio difference is night and day.

I can do this my old Acer Laptop through SPDIF and with my Marantz (no HDMI). I want to know if this is possible with HDMI-equipped receiver.

Thanks.

My Yamaha AVR can decode 192-96 file via HDMI

[jackdee]

does the dsp-a1 can decode 192/24?

ano po ba maganda na cd player...

im using only jriver and plan to buy sound or maybe a cdp
i heard some cdp has a bit ..

meron akong laserdisc naka lagay 1bit ano po ibig sabihin ?

[Stagea]

Thanks for the confirmation, I can now retire my old receiver and start hunting HDMI-equipped receiver.

I wonder why most of the audio enthusiast here don't use this kind of audio set-up. I am using this since 2005 and the audio out is like HD quality, even my high-end SACD/DVD-Audio players has not match to the quality of the 96/24 audio

Because HDMI is a high jitter interface. It's based off DVI, with audio data included in the stream. With no dedicated lines for audio, audio data has to be encoded and decoded out of the combined data stream.

[Stagea]

My Yamaha AVR can decode 192-96 file via HDMI

The far majority can. However, some levels of DSP processing shut-off in most when receiving 192/24.

Try manipulating your settings while the AVR is fed with multi-channel 192/24.

[Philander]

My Yamaha AVR can decode 192-96 file via HDMI

SO even if you play MP3 in the laptop/pc and you set the audio out of the laptop to 192/24 bit, your Yamaha AVR can recognize it as 192/4 and will be able to play it?

[Philander]

does the dsp-a1 can decode 192/24?

ano po ba maganda na cd player...

im using only jriver and plan to buy sound or maybe a cdp

I am yet to see a CD player that allows to output of 96/24 audio, moreso the 192/24 using digital output.

They are always 44.1Khz/16-bit and for DVD-Video is 48/16-bit.

For DVD Audio is 96/24

[Courage]

SO even if you play MP3 in the laptop/pc and you set the audio out of the laptop to 192/24 bit, your Yamaha AVR can recognize it as 192/4 and will be able to play it?

In my testing, if you upsample via software the file to a higher bitrate, the Yamaha recognizes the sampling... so Yes..

[Philander]

Again remember that source need not to be 96/24 or 192/24 audio. As long as your HDMI from Laptop or PC is set-to out 96/24 or 192/24 sampling rates that you can use the AVR DAC to process the signal.

[Courage]

The far majority can. However, some levels of DSP processing shut-off in most when receiving 192/24.

Try manipulating your settings while the AVR is fed with multi-channel 192/24.

Hmmmm interesting.. Let me try this later when i get home... ..

[Philander]

In my testing, if you upsample via software the file to a higher bitrate, the Yamaha recognizes the sampling... so Yes..

No need to upsample via any software.

Set the HDMI Audio Out to 192/24 or 96/24

Again. Use any audio file (even lousy MP3 files), play it in VLC or Media Player or ANY audio player.

Your receiver will determine the audio being fed if its 192/24 or 96/24.

See reference picture (but this must be for HDMI out, sample image is for analog as I dont have a connected HDMI in my laptop)



This is for SPDIF Audio Out (not through HDMI:


Sample image in the net connected via LG Receiver HDMI:

[Philander]

Believe me people, sound difference is breathtaking (well for my Marantz DAC in particular, makes you wanna throw your expensive CD player, hahha).

Also, once you do this and in most cases it only supports 2ch audio. My Marantz will not even allow me to use DSP effects to make it psuedo 5.1. Just pure Stereo.

Meaning, even if your source is 2ch lpcm audio, DD 2.0, DD 5.1 or DTS 5.1, once you enable 96/24 or 192/24, it will only play back in high resolution stereo audio in either 96/24 or 192/24. Unless your SOURCE is 5ch 96/24 or 5ch 192/24 and your software (or even HW) player allows you to out those audio format digitally to be processed by the receiver.

[comet]

Thanks sir masubukan din

[Philander]

Thanks sir masubukan din

Yes, please do so.

What you need:
PC or Laptop with HDMI
HDMI Cable connected to
HDMI Receiver
VLC or ANY Media player (no upsampling software needed)
Any audio file (lousy MP3 as much as possible so you can hear the difference)

Configuration.
Set the HDMI Audio out of your PC or Laptop to enable 96/24 (or 192/24) as shown in the picture (Go to Control Panel, click/select Sound, at the Playback Tab, right click the HDMI audio set it to Default Device and right click again and select Properties, Go to Advance tab and enable  96/24 (or 192/24)).

Select the appropriate source from the Receiver.

Play back the file using VLC or any Media Player (no special settings needed), then hear the difference.

Your receiver should indicates that the audio file being fed is 96/24 or 192/24

[≧◉◡◉≦xrampage≧◉◡◉≦]

Brader Philander nacompare mo na ba using DAC same source if same output ba? Thanks

Mukhang magandang icompare sa setup ni sis courage itong setup na pc or laptop. 

[Courage]

Brader Philander nacompare mo na ba using DAC same source if same output ba? Thanks

Mukhang magandang icompare sa setup ni sis courage itong setup na pc or laptop. 

I have played FLAC's with 192 and 96 resolution so many times using my Laptop via HDMI connected to Yamaha.. It was very good pero di ako makuntento

I also tried playing NMT as my music source via HDMI playing same resolution.. it was OK..

Until i tried a dedicated Audio player NP30 connected to the Yamaha via Analog. It was heaven... I even bought  an external DAC and connect it to the NP30 then to Yamaha via Analog.. Thinking na baka may igaganda pa.. Ang hirap malaman nang difference nung wala ay may dac yung NP30. kung may improvement man.. very subtle.. at sa LFE area pa yung difference... Naisip ko tuloy parang napasubo ata ako sa DAC

So i tried another route..

Laptop ->USB-SPDIF Converter with Galvanic Isolation -> DAC-> Receiver Analog IN's..

Pag play na pag play ko nang file using J-Rivers, removing all types of processing from the softare and making sure Audio Path is Direct, PARANG NALAGYAN NANG HANGER ANG BIBIG KO he he he... AMazing details, amazing soundstage, amazing BASS.. amazing everything... NOW IM HAPPY... Kelangan ko lang talaga nang Lecheng Remote

[Philander]

Brader Philander nacompare mo na ba using DAC same source if same output ba? Thanks

Mukhang magandang icompare sa setup ni sis courage itong setup na pc or laptop.  

I did the following comparison (same source, A usual 44.1khz CD Audio, all connected to a Marantz Receiver).

My Acer Laptop via SPDIF set at 96/24 - Audio is superb
My Acer Laptop via SPDIF set at 44.1/16 - Audio is just usual
My Acer Laptop via its analog stereo out to analog stereo in of the AVR (regardless if the audio sampling rate is 44/16, 48/16, 48/24, 96/24, 192/24) - Audio is just usual
Pioneer SACD player via optical - Audio is just usual
Pioneer SACD player via coaxial - Audio is just usual
Pioneer SACD player via 2ch Analog - Audio is just usual
Pioneer SACD player via 6ch Analog (but connected only to the fronts for 2ch) - Audio is superb but still the 96/24 settings is better)
Sony FlagShip SACD player via optical/coaxial - Audio is just usual
Sony FlagShip SACD player via 2ch Analog Out - Audio is great but still the 96/24 settings is better)



Devices
Sony DVP-S9000ES SACD Player
Pioneer is Pioneer 676A MultiFormat Player
Marantz SR4300
Acer is 4736Z with optical out (with HDMI but my receiver does not have HDMI)


With those tests, I was able to compare the quality of Pioneer DAC (burrbrown and not), Acer DAC, Sony DAC and Marantz DAC

[Billabong]

We have compared PC -> Receiver and NMT -> Receiver vs PC -> Musiland DAC.

Malaking ganda nung ginamitan ng dedicated DAC. Matamlay ang tunog pag receiver lang ang nagde-decode.

Important din pala yung software na gagamitin sa PC. Malaking factor ito sa resulting sound quality.

[Philander]

Again, the set up I'm referring here does not need special software to upconvert as you just passthrough the 96/24 audio to be processed by the DAC of the receiver and it should read by you AVR as 96/24 signal (your AVR's display should indicate 96/24, otherwise you are still listening to 44.1/16)

[mak_mak]

Yes, please do so.

What you need:
PC or Laptop with HDMI
HDMI Cable connected to
HDMI Receiver
VLC or ANY Media player (no upsampling software needed)
Any audio file (lousy MP3 as much as possible so you can hear the difference)

Configuration.
Set the HDMI Audio out of your PC or Laptop to enable 96/24 (or 192/24) as shown in the picture (Go to Control Panel, click/select Sound, at the Playback Tab, right click the HDMI audio set it to Default Device and right click again and select Properties, Go to Advance tab and enable  96/24 (or 192/24)).

Select the appropriate source from the Receiver.

Play back the file using VLC or any Media Player (no special settings needed), then hear the difference.

Your receiver should indicates that the audio file being fed is 96/24 or 192/24

very nice..masubukan nga po...

[≧◉◡◉≦xrampage≧◉◡◉≦]

I have played FLAC's with 192 and 96 resolution so many times using my Laptop via HDMI connected to Yamaha.. It was very good pero di ako makuntento

I also tried playing NMT as my music source via HDMI playing same resolution.. it was OK..

Until i tried a dedicated Audio player NP30 connected to the Yamaha via Analog. It was heaven... I even bought  an external DAC and connect it to the NP30 then to Yamaha via Analog.. Thinking na baka may igaganda pa.. Ang hirap malaman nang difference nung wala ay may dac yung NP30. kung may improvement man.. very subtle.. at sa LFE area pa yung difference... Naisip ko tuloy parang napasubo ata ako sa DAC

So i tried another route..

Laptop ->USB-SPDIF Converter with Galvanic Isolation -> DAC-> Receiver Analog IN's..

Pag play na pag play ko nang file using J-Rivers, removing all types of processing from the softare and making sure Audio Path is Direct, PARANG NALAGYAN NANG HANGER ANG BIBIG KO he he he... AMazing details, amazing soundstage, amazing BASS.. amazing everything... NOW IM HAPPY... Kelangan ko lang talaga nang Lecheng Remote

Pero yung setup mo default? Compare mo nga yung settings sa taas with your current setup?

[Stagea]

Again, the set up I'm referring here does not need special software to upconvert as you just passthrough the 96/24 audio to be processed by the DAC of the receiver and it should read by you AVR as 96/24 signal (your AVR's display should indicate 96/24, otherwise you are still listening to 44.1/16)

Windows Vista and 7 use an audio stack that works on floating point data. This is how it mixes sound from different applications, then converts it back to integer for your sound adapter (in this case, your AVR). The operations that it applies to the data that passes through causes losses along the way.

I suggest trying an application that can output utilizing Wasapi Exclusive Mode to bypass some of the subsystems (if you're using HDMI). This will pass the audio stream in a less altered form.

Upsampling will not gain resolution from a lower resolution recording, though different upsampling methods can sound different (and some may prefer one over another).

[Courage]

Pero yung setup mo default? Compare mo nga yung settings sa taas with your current setup?

I already did, actually ganun nga yung setup ko before.. Just using HDMI of Laptop, connected to Receiver and using the receiver's DAC.. The sound is good..

Pero mas better nung gumamit ako dedicated Audio player, using players DAC

Mas naging Ok nung yung Laptop ko ginamit kong Transport using J River as Player, V-Link192 Converter, Rega DAC to Yamaha..

[Philander]

Actually I am not in any way referring to upsampling here. I am just forcing to let the source to ouput 96/24 via digital so that we will utilize the AVR's DAC of 192/24 or 96/24 capability.

That is why I said no special software to use.

I hope I am clear on that.

[Courage]

Actually I am not in any way referring to upsampling here. I am just forcing to let the source to ouput 96/24 via digital so that we will utilize the AVR's DAC of 192/24 or 96/24 capability.

That is why I said no special software to use.

I hope I am clear on that.

That process actually upsamples the digital file or the signal. If it's not upsampled it should remain to its original signal and the AVR should get whatever the original sampling rate of the file is 44.1hz -> 44.1hz.

Upsampling is also forcing a 44.1 signal to higher hz..di ba?

[Philander]

That process actually upsamples the digital file or the signal. If it's not upsampled it should remain to its original signal and the AVR should get whatever the original sampling rate of the file is 44.1hz -> 44.1hz.

Upsampling is also forcing a 44.1 signal to higher hz..di ba?

I am agreeing with you on this. But I am more of referring the upsampling using any upsampling software.

Firstly we dont know what happens in the AVR's DAC; how it process the sound when it receives the 96/24 signal. It could be upsampled by the AVR's DAC, it could be it output other signal, it maybe that AVR is only saying that the file being fed is 96/24 but it did not specifically show or tell us how it is being processed, you get what I mean?

Why dont we let the other users try this set-up and let them hear the difference if there's any.

[Philander]

In my testing, if you upsample via software the file to a higher bitrate, the Yamaha recognizes the sampling... so Yes..

Have you tried my method, by not using any upsampling software and just let the Windows driver use 96/24 or 192/24?

[Courage]

Have you tried my method, by not using any upsampling software and just let the Windows driver use 96/24 or 192/24?

I tried it but i never tried the windows settings, i just let it pass whatever resolution of the digital files is.. 44.1, 96 and 192...

For me passing Audio thru hdmi upsampled or not is just ok... I have a collection of good 96/24 files so no need upsampling there ... i just let it pass thru the HDMI thru receiver using it's DAC...and it's still just ok compared to how i'm currently connected now...

In fact i even compared the sound of my PS3 playing 44.1hz music connected via HDMI and via it's optical port. Mas maganda tunog nang music sa Optical vs HDMI, i just used the HDMI sa PS3 so i can watch a movie with HD track...

I like the sound better when i used a dedicated Media player and use its internal dac(Wolfson)...

But nothing beats as my ear is hearing it the sound coming from USB with converter to my Rega DAC then to receiver... But its just me... Other people who hears it might disagree with me.. Will see this saturday