Topic: DVD player vs. CD player?

[ProtegeManiac]

Are there any CD playerss with a sub-out? searched the net but I can only find DVD's. I already have one, a run-of-the-nill Pioneer with 18bit processing. I've read the other threads and seems like I might get better quality with a real hi-fi CD player, BUT, while I'm adding a stereo amp, I want to retain my active sub without buying another component (ie, processor/crossover/dividing network), at least not yet.

[ProtegeManiac]

just checked my DVD player...its 24bit DAC, but it has no sub out too...If Im using an integrated amp with this, is there a way to be able to use my active sub with this?

[av_phile1]

The 24-bit DAC on DVDs only works for DVD signals encoded at 24/192 resolution.  It means the DAC can accommodate 24-bit samples from your decoded DVD with those digital sample sizes.  You can see 18-bit to 20-bit processing in CD players, but these just reflects the common trend among latter CD makers to use higher bit conversion to reduce the quantization errors and improve noise floors that can be objectionable with the early generation CD players using 16-bit converters.   It doesn't mean you're getting true 18-bit or 20-bit audio performance.  CD-audio remains 16-bit. 

The LFE output from DVD players is there precisely because the source DVD format is encoded with LFE information.  CD audio wasn't designed for this.   But you can use powered subwoofers for your CD-music even when using integrated amps and players without sub-out.   There are three ways I know in your case.

(1)  You must use a powered subwoofer with HIGH LEVEL speaker input.  This way, you can parallel the subwoofer to both your L and R speaker connections.  The signals will be low-passed by the subwoofer's crossover.  There shouldn't be a problem with impedances as the paralleled subwoofer has a very high impedance in the high level input to affect the total impedance.

(2)  You can connect your integrated to the subwoofer's high level input and connect your main L and R speakers to the subwoofer's SPEAKER SATELITE output.  The subwoofer's internal crossover will act to filter out the lows from the main speakers and retain the lows for itself.

(3)  You can connect the Integrated's L and R TAPE RECORD OUT fixed line levels to your subwoofer's low-level L and R RCA line input.   The subwooker will just low-pass the pertinent signals.  But since this signal is often fixed, you have to control the volume independently at the subwoofer controls.   But ofcourse you can just set the preferred level only once. 

In options (1) and (3) the main speakers will be sounding at full range.  If the subwoofer crossover is set too high, the sub may reinforce the bass of  your main speakers and sound more boomy overall. You need to  play around with phase and crossover filters on the subwoofer for what would sound best for you with your main speakers. 

[sillyputty]

how about using the sub out of a dvda/sacd players? these players have bass management built into the player so you should be able to use them even with cds. can anybody confirm if this is possible?

[ProtegeManiac]

av_phile1,

thanks for the crash course. I'll just use Y connectors on the L-R RCA's. Just got back from a mall and I stopped by the JBL showroom, they said my sub might not have a high pass filter (since it's not on the manual), so even option 2 would have my stereo channels playing full range.  but they'll double check with old files as they've stopped production.

how about using the sub out of a dvda/sacd players? these players have bass management built into the player so you should be able to use them even with cds. can anybody confirm if this is possible?

I think they're digital surround.  I've been using the sub-out of the shelf system INTO the LFE input (as it was set-up this way when I bought them from abenson's, stupid me), then last night I read the manuals thoroughly, turns out the receiver's not an LFE output, so I've been sending analog signal into a digital input that bypasses the lowpass filter . here's the wierd part (shows how little I know): when I watched "Bad Byoys II", the sub made the helicopter rotor noise crawl from the front to the rear of the room, with the analog subout to the LFE input. I tried it after doing the right, and the "crawl" fake surround didn't happen.

[av_phile1]

how about using the sub out of a dvda/sacd players? these players have bass management built into the player so you should be able to use them even with cds. can anybody confirm if this is possible?

Not all universal players have bass management fpr SACD or DVD-A.  And not all will output an LFE for CD playback.  I do recall my Rainbow and Promac generic players as being able to send bass via the LFE analog out.    My current Yamaha DVD-A player can do so but only via digital output.  Using its analog 5.1 output, there's no LFE out on CD playback.