Author Topic: Epson S4 (Read 2446 times)

atomicat10 · « **on:** Dec 20, 2006 at 09:21 AM »

Got one yesterday at the HIVE aka AVLS Makati and tried it on last night, bright and beautiful.

I just projected on a white crappy wall and I think I can do without a screen for now because the difference is not night and day.

Marc aka AV Integrator, of the Hive should win the sales person of the year! Not only did he give the S4 on a superb deal but agreed to demo other projectors (BenQ w100, Epson TW10) as well. Courteous and professional, he gave pinoydvd memebers (I met another member who bought the last W100 unit earlier in the AM and not to mention Sir Devo, his former client) excellent reasons to buy AV items from their establishment.

The choice for a non-HT dedicated projector, might turn off some but I had to make a compromise between my HT needs and the opportunity the S4 gives me for work and other presentation purposes.

Epson S-series is a proven performer on presentations. S4, the latest model is the brightest so far at 1,800 (under rated) lumens. The replacement lamp price is excellent at 10k and warranty is 2 years (lamp has 6 mos./500 hrs.)

Although has poor contrast ratio (over rated at 500:1) and the wretched SDE viewing at near distance, these can both be compensated by minimizing ambient light and adjusting my sweet spot farther from the wall, I mean screen

.

Video performance is more than ok for me when viewing the Quicktime HD teaser trailer of 300 (a "contrast-demanding film based on a graphic novel by Frank Miller). The lumens pumped out the beauty of gold, silver and other metallic colors on the costumes, jewelries, throne and spears while the 3LCD tech painted the richness of crimson on the Spartans capes. The blacks were unexpectedly "good" (a very subjective term).

The brightness and color accuracy of the S4 and its 3LCD technology (a solid state design compared to DLP which relies on "moving" colour wheels) is a no brainer choice for me who has to find the marriage of presentation prowess and more than adequate video capability in one budget friendly box.

Will post pics later.

CocoBoy · « **Reply #1 on:** Dec 20, 2006 at 10:27 AM »

Congrats sir. So you did see the EMP-TW10 perform also? I was supposed to have reserved the w100 that was taken that day but I didn't make it on time to get to AVLS to demo/buy. Good reviews on the S4 just the same and Marc did mention someone getting the Benq and the epson. He recommended also the TW10.

Bregards,

Coco

atomicat10 · « **Reply #2 on:** Dec 20, 2006 at 10:47 AM »

Sir just get the W100 if it's for a dedicated HT. TW10 though only 38k is an old model and not yet 3LCD.

I just knew you were the one who reserved one unit because of your location.

I saw the W100 DLP really produces smoother " film-like" video has two sets of component inputs and a digital interface via DVI.

Its body is white, plasticky (flimsy, sorry guys) but smaller compared to the S4's metallic, bulkier but more rigid design.

On the upside, S4 has a built-in sliding lens cover which is quite sleek and functions as an AV mute.

W100, check it out and adjust everything properly it has that cinema feel to it.

Bring your benchmark DVD disc.

nerveblocker · « **Reply #3 on:** Dec 20, 2006 at 10:56 AM »

Nice choice sir atomicat! I am very happy with my EMP-S3 and you just need some adjustments to suit to your room environment. I am using economy mode to lengthen the bulb life but still has adequate brightness. By calibrating it with Avia I have very much happy with its performance. With the relatively reasonably priced replacement bulb, this is a performer with cheap maintenance i.e. not limiting your viewing pleasure for fear of shelling out big moolah for a replacement bulb.

Best results would be hooking it up with an HTPC. Enjoy your new toy bro!

atomicat10 · « **Reply #4 on:** Dec 20, 2006 at 11:08 AM »

Doc, I only got the S4 because of your excellent review as well as countless others on its predecessor the S3.

I almost went with the S3, Mark of the Hive had one left for 38k but someone beat me to it first.

Maybe we have the same tastes for video which is true to the specs uncompromised brightness and the Epson S-series, I believe has and will keep us watching and enjoying our favorite hobby.

nerveblocker · « **Reply #5 on:** Dec 20, 2006 at 11:12 AM »

Quote from: atomicat10 on Dec 20, 2006 at 11:08 AM

Doc, I only got the S4 because of your excellent review as well as countless others on its predecessor the S3.

I almost went with the S3, Mark of the Hive had one left for 38k but someone beat me to it first.

Maybe we have the same tastes for video which is true to the specs uncompromised brightness and the Epson S-series, I believe has and will keep us watching and enjoying our favorite hobby.

Tama ka dyan bro! To each his own.....

atomicat10 · « **Reply #6 on:** Dec 20, 2006 at 11:24 AM »

One theory I have is that bright, stimulating and crisp video can give you that second wind after a day's work while darker dispalys and output can be quite depressing and gloomy.

I switched to econo (low) brightness mode from high and I can't seem to get the difference

As if it didn't changed brightness but was able to prolong the lamp life (I hope) in the process.

Hot Product Award
http://www.projectorreviews.com/Manufacturers/epson/PowerliteS4/index.asp

Editor's Choice
http://laptopmag.com/Review/Epson-PowerLite-S4.htm

rmpmla · « **Reply #7 on:** Dec 20, 2006 at 11:41 AM »

Congrats sir on your new projector

.

sarap talaga manood pag BIG screen.

jerix · « **Reply #8 on:** Dec 20, 2006 at 11:51 AM »

sirs: how about the 4:3 scale ratio of the S4 --can u comment on the effects of the scale ratio if playing a 16:9 disc.. tnx

atomicat10 · « **Reply #9 on:** Dec 20, 2006 at 12:00 PM »

Sir it behaves pretty much the same as other 4:3 PJs do. You will see black bars up and down. You will achieve widescreen albeit smaller display which is easily managed by the S4 and its short throw design meaning the farther the unit, the larger display is achieved compensating for its non-widescreen nature.

I believe there are more difficult problems when viewing native 4:3 source (desktop, classics, tv specially sports and concerts/musical events) on a native 16:9 projectors and not the other way around.

Of course, I may be wrong

.

atomicat10 · « **Reply #10 on:** Dec 20, 2006 at 12:08 PM »

Quote from: rmpmla on Dec 20, 2006 at 11:41 AM

Congrats sir on your new projector .

sarap talaga manood pag BIG screen.

Tama ka sir, first of all tahimik lahat kasi stunned. Second you can justify the amount of volume all the speakers produce because you have an equally outrageous video display.

Kung marami lang akong moolah, I would have gotten your PJ and not be starting this thread.

Since you came from DLP maybe you can share the experience on your transition to the bright side.

jerix · « **Reply #11 on:** Dec 20, 2006 at 04:39 PM »

Quote from: atomicat10 on Dec 20, 2006 at 12:00 PM

Sir it behaves pretty much the same as other 4:3 PJs do. You will see black bars up and down. You will achieve widescreen albeit smaller display which is easily managed by the S4 and its short throw design meaning the farther the unit, the larger display is achieved compensating for its non-widescreen nature.

I believe there are more difficult problems when viewing native 4:3 source (desktop, classics, tv specially sports and concerts/musical events) on a native 16:9 projectors and not the other way around.

Of course, I may be wrong .

ok sir, bro whatever. Follwo-up lang, does that S4 cut the side areas and leave the width of the 16:9 video to fit or it will just shrink the entire 16:9 further to fit into that 4:3 screen leaving a larger up and down black bars ? thanx. it seems that the 4:3 aspect ratio is the only issue i have with the epson s4 so far. So if i will be cleared up with this, i may go also for the S4.

It would also be very helpful if you share your comparative assessment especially picture quality of HT pj like the benq w100, etc. with the S4.

rmpmla · « **Reply #12 on:** Dec 20, 2006 at 08:51 PM »

Quote from: atomicat10 on Dec 20, 2006 at 12:08 PM

Since you came from DLP maybe you can share the experience on your transition to the bright side.

Picture quality of DLP projector is not that bad. it has better contrast compared to old LCD projector. the screen door effect is minimal. at native resolution, the text display on windows desktop are exact on the pixel and no misconvergence. the only downside is the rainbow effect particularly on dark scene. minsan nakikita ko yung rainbow minsan naman hindi.

as for the AX-100, surprisingly, no SDE even if you are just a foot or two from the screen. contrast is excellent. black is displayed nearly black and not gray. very bright. however, i noticed that text display on windows desktop is not as sharp as with DLP. also misconvergence is present but acceptable, hindi raw maiiwasan ito kasi ito yung alignment nung 3 LCD.

the DLP i have is a 4:3 800X600 native reso and i use a70"X70" screen. kaya nung nag-switch ako sa 1270 X 720 using a 70" X 70 " screen, my initial reaction - AYY... lumiit yung screen size

atomicat10 · « **Reply #13 on:** Dec 20, 2006 at 09:08 PM »

Quote

ok sir, bro whatever. Follwo-up lang, does that S4 cut the side areas and leave the width of the 16:9 video to fit or it will just shrink the entire 16:9 further to fit into that 4:3 screen leaving a larger up and down black bars ? thanx. it seems that the 4:3 aspect ratio is the only issue i have with the epson s4 so far. So if i will be cleared up with this, i may go also for the S4.

It would also be very helpful if you share your comparative assessment especially picture quality of HT pj like the benq w100, etc. with the S4.

ok, you didn't get it.

Let me explain it this way, you have watched a dvd presented on 16:9 ratio (widescreen) on a 4:3 pc monitor either crt or lcd, right? You ever noticed that without changing any setting on your dvd player (softwares like powerdvd, windvd etc.), you will get/see its original widescreen presentation BUT it will not fill up the screen.

That is what I meant when I said that you will see black bars up and down BUT you will see the ENTIRE picture and the video will not be cropped or chopped on the SIDES just to fill the entire screen as long as you keep the dvd's original aspect ratio (you can alter this as you may know).

The black bars at the top and the bottom will surely give you a smaller (yet complete) display BUT that is where the S4 compensates. Its short throw capability gives you a huge display in short distances and the farther you place the unit the bigger the video gets MEANING all the video size it lost for not being a native 16:9 projector is once again gained because it can now equalize or even outperform the video size a native 16:9 projector can give when placed at the same distance.

It can give such a huge display that those black bars would be negligible.

Again the S4 will not "cut the sides" unless you pan and scan, use the zoom settings or any other settings that messes up the original aspect ratio.

Yes, it will "shrink the entire 16:9" and you better prepare to see the black bars but in my case with the S4 the black bars are negligible.

If I may repeat, a 16:9 material will look better on a 4:3 projector than a 4:3 material on a native 16:9 projector. You can read this to have "a better view"

http://www.projectorcentral.com/formats.htm

atomicat10 · « **Reply #14 on:** Dec 20, 2006 at 09:13 PM »

Quote

the DLP i have is a 4:3 800X600 native reso and i use a70"X70" screen. kaya nung nag-switch ako sa 1270 X 720 using a 70" X 70 " screen, my initial reaction - AYY... lumiit yung screen size

Sir, I'm bothered by this. Ano yung lumiit yung image o yung 70" x 70" screen?

jerix · « **Reply #15 on:** Dec 21, 2006 at 08:02 AM »

Sir atom -- alright tnx i got that right.

M still trying to absorb these technical chit chats and m learning fast

rmpmla · « **Reply #16 on:** Dec 21, 2006 at 08:10 AM »

Quote from: atomicat10 on Dec 20, 2006 at 09:13 PM

Sir, I'm bothered by this. Ano yung lumiit yung image o yung 70" x 70" screen?

sa umpisa eh nanibago ako. kasi ang 4:3 na windows desktop display on a 70"X70" screen, the projected image is about 70"X52" or 87" diagonal. now for a 16:9 the desktop display on a 70"X70" - 70"X39" or a diagonal of 80".
but i also realiized that when watching movie via HTPC, the full screen is displayed on widescreen kaya sa 800X600 native reso ay may black/gray bar on top and bottom. pag 1280X720 native reso, the widescreen movie is displayed in full screen and without the black bar on top and bottom.
in effect, when watching widescreen movie/video, the pixels use on the 800X600 becomes lesser because of the black bars on top and bottom screen. while, for the 1280X720 it is displayed as it is, kasi widescreen na siya. observation ko lang po ito, so you can correct me on this

atomicat10 · « **Reply #17 on:** Dec 21, 2006 at 08:44 AM »

Quote

It would also be very helpful if you share your comparative assessment especially picture quality of HT pj like the benq w100, etc. with the S4.

The first time I saw the w100 in action was in the Hive. It was projecting a demo disc and the I was able to catch the the LOTR feature. My first impression was something might be wrong because the video was crappy. I knew it wasn't configured/adjusted right because this projector is supposed to be an excellent performer right off the bat! I was really surprised the guy (fellow pdvd member) bought the last unit without even seeing its full potential. The unit was hooked to a sony dvd player via component and the screen was DaLite. In other words I was "disappointed" and proceeded to demo the S4.

The following morning, we "opened shop". The guy who supposedly got the last W100 came back to really get it this time coz the Hive didn't accept cheques he had hoped to pay with the previous day meanwhile my S4 was still in Cubao

I finessed the guy to at least demo the last W100 before getting it so I, I mean we

can have a better look at it. We were on the same viewing room (Hive's got two), same player, same demo material, same connections. From the get go I tried to adjust the 2 dials (focus and zoom, I presume) found on top of the unit and this time I think we were able see how great (for the price) it can perform as advertised.

NO screen door effect (SDE), smoother film-like video and quite bright even with the rear lights on. Contrast was excellent and even managed to paint a a near respectable picture from a double feature (2 in 1) bootleg (DVD5) copy of Van Helsing/Walking Tall. (I told you to bring your own benchmark disc)

For the minimal time I was able to test it, I wasn't able see rainbows. Heck, if only there was a unit left, my selfish side would have tempted me to get it instead of the S4, good thing that was the last.

I came back for my S4 later on the afternoon and during the lull I started to contemplate, W100 or S4. I made a score card and this is how it went:

S4 W100

LUMENS

CONTRAST

RESOLUTION

PRICE

LAMP PRICE

VIDEO

PRESENTATION

FEATURES

BUILT

MAX POWER

LAMP LIFE

WEIGHT

SIZE

RELIABILITY

AFTER SALES SERVICE

EASE OF USE

REMOTE CONTROL

THROW DISTANCE

CONNECTIONS

DESIGN

CARRYING BAG

NOISE

SPEAKERS

atomicat10 · « **Reply #18 on:** Dec 22, 2006 at 07:56 AM »

One more feature-Pixelworks DNX ICs

http://www.pixelworks.com/dnx/flash.html

jerix · « **Reply #19 on:** Dec 22, 2006 at 09:52 AM »

Quote from: atomicat10 on Dec 21, 2006 at 08:44 AM

The first time I saw the w100 in action was in the Hive. It was projecting a demo disc and the I was able to catch the the LOTR feature. My first impression was something might be wrong because the video was crappy. I knew it wasn't configured/adjusted right because this projector is supposed to be an excellent performer right off the bat! I was really surprised the guy (fellow pdvd member) bought the last unit without even seeing its full potential. The unit was hooked to a sony dvd player via component and the screen was DaLite. In other words I was "disappointed" and proceeded to demo the S4.

The following morning, we "opened shop". The guy who supposedly got the last W100 came back to really get it this time coz the Hive didn't accept cheques he had hoped to pay with the previous day meanwhile my S4 was still in Cubao

Bro very good review -- this helps a lot
I finessed the guy to at least demo the last W100 before getting it so I, I mean we can have a better look at it. We were on the same viewing room (Hive's got two), same player, same demo material, same connections. From the get go I tried to adjust the 2 dials (focus and zoom, I presume) found on top of the unit and this time I think we were able see how great (for the price) it can perform as advertised.

NO screen door effect (SDE), smoother film-like video and quite bright even with the rear lights on. Contrast was excellent and even managed to paint a a near respectable picture from a double feature (2 in 1) bootleg (DVD5) copy of Van Helsing/Walking Tall. (I told you to bring your own benchmark disc)

For the minimal time I was able to test it, I wasn't able see rainbows. Heck, if only there was a unit left, my selfish side would have tempted me to get it instead of the S4, good thing that was the last.

I came back for my S4 later on the afternoon and during the lull I started to contemplate, W100 or S4. I made a score card and this is how it went:

   S4 W100

LUMENS

CONTRAST

RESOLUTION

PRICE

LAMP PRICE

VIDEO

PRESENTATION

FEATURES

BUILT

MAX POWER

LAMP LIFE

WEIGHT

SIZE

RELIABILITY

AFTER SALES SERVICE

EASE OF USE

REMOTE CONTROL

THROW DISTANCE

CONNECTIONS

DESIGN

CARRYING BAG

NOISE

SPEAKERS

avintegrator · « **Reply #20 on:** Dec 22, 2006 at 02:29 PM »

Quote from: jerix on Dec 22, 2006 at 09:52 AM

sir, kumusta na? balitaan kita pag dumating na ung benq w100 para ma side by side natin with other brand of projector na carry namin.

nerveblocker · « **Reply #21 on:** Dec 23, 2006 at 11:09 PM »

Sir atomicat, you can also use the remote as a remote mouse by connecting your PC to the PJ using a USB cable.

atomicat10 · « **Reply #22 on:** Dec 24, 2006 at 01:54 PM »

Quote from: nerveblocker on Dec 23, 2006 at 11:09 PM

Sir atomicat, you can also use the remote as a remote mouse by connecting your PC to the PJ using a USB cable.

remote mousing.

Exactly.

jerix · « **Reply #23 on:** Jan 10, 2007 at 08:16 AM »

Bro atom can you post screen shots of the S4 please .. tnx