Hi guys, I just got my self an LCD and Plasma panel and was wondering what you use to calibrate them? Is there a special way or system to do this, and is it the same for both Plasma and LCD? Where do you get this stuff? One more thing is there a break-in period for this? Thanks :)
Anybody who can lend me a software for TV calibration? ;D ;D ;D
If you're anywhere near BF Pque, I have a DVD Video Essentials disc. PM me for further details if your interested.
If you're anywhere near BF Pque, I have a DVD Video Essentials disc. PM me for further details if your interested.
Basic
You can do a lot to improve your picture using the simple adjustments found on all televisions. Taking the steps below will make the picture look more realistic and closer to what the director intended.
Room lighting
Since most people turn down the lights to watch a movie, our recommendations are designed to deliver a better picture in rooms with controlled lighting. Unless you have a big-screen projector or you're sitting at the minimum viewing distance, you shouldn't watch movies in complete darkness--it can cause eyestrain. For bright plasmas and smaller direct-view sets, the ideal setup is to place a dim light directly behind the TV and leave the rest of the room dark. Look for special daylight bulbs that glow at 6,500 degrees Kelvin. You should also prevent any light in the room from reflecting off the TV, as glare will hamper image fidelity. Watching at night is best, but if you watch during the day, thick curtains will really improve the picture.
Before you make any of the adjustments detailed below, set room lighting as if you were about to watch a movie. For viewing in brighter environments, we recommend you use one of the picture presets, such as Standard, Sports, or Vivid, and reserve your custom settings for dark rooms.
Brightness
What it is: Also called black level, brightness actually adjusts how dark the black sections of the picture appear.
What it does: Excessive brightness can result in a two-dimensional, washed-out look with reduced color saturation. Images with brightness set too low lose detail in shadows, and distinctions between dark areas disappear in pools of black.
How to set it: After connecting your DVD player using the highest-quality input available, insert a DVD that has letterbox bars above and below the image, and find a scene that has a roughly equal amount of light and dark material. Turn up the control all the way, then decrease until the letterbox bars begin to appear black, as opposed to dark gray. If you notice a loss of shadow detail--for example, when people's eyes disappear into the depths under their brows--then you've set brightness too low. Some plasma, LCD, DLP, and LCoS TVs won't ever look black, so you'll need a setup disc to properly configure their brightness.
Contrast
What it is: Also called picture or white level, contrast controls the intensity of the white parts of the image and determines the overall light output of the display.
What it does: Contrast is usually set extremely high by default because it makes images look brighter in the store. High contrast can obscure details and distort lines in the image, cause eyestrain in dim rooms, and shorten the lifespan of tubes and plasma elements. Setting contrast too low robs the image of impact.
How to set it: Display a still image from DVD of a white object with some visible details--such as someone wearing a white button-up shirt or a shot of a glacier from the Ice Age DVD. Adjust the control up all the way, then reduce it until you can make out all the details in the white (such as buttons on a shirt or cracks in the ice). In general, TVs look best when contrast is set between 30 and 50 percent.
Color
What it is: Also called saturation, this control adjusts how intense the colors look.
What it does: When there's too much color, the set looks garish and unrealistic. It's most noticeable with reds, which are often accentuated (pushed) by the TV's color decoder. On the other hand, too little color diminishes the impact of the picture, making it look drab. Setting color to zero results in a black-and-white image.
How to set it: If available, first set the color temperature control to the warmest option as described below. Then find an image of someone with light, delicate skin tones, preferably a close-up of a face, on a DVD. Turn up the color control until it looks like the person has sunburn, then reduce it until the skin looks natural, without too much red. If the rest of the colors look too drab, you can increase color slightly at the expense of accurate skin tones.
Other controls
Tint: Unless you're using one of the DVDs mentioned in the Intermediate section to set it properly, this control is best left at the midway point.
Sharpness: This adds artificial edges to objects, which sometimes helps with soft cable signals but almost always mars the already sharp image from a DVD. Reduce it to zero unless you detect visible softening along the edges of text; if you do, increase it until the edges appear sharp again.
Edge enhancement: Also called VSM or SVM for scan-velocity modulation, set this control to Off if possible.
Color temperature: This important control affects the entire palette of colors. Select the Warm or Low option, which should come closest to the NTSC standard of 6,500 degrees Kelvin.
Generally, the image looks best for DVD with picture enhancements such as autocolor, autoflesh tone, autocontrast, noise reduction, and other proprietary processing modes turned off. DVD image quality is good enough that these modes usually do more harm than good.
Video Essentials
(DVD International, 1997)
Upside: Wide array of reference test patterns; varied montage of images.
Downside: Difficult to navigate; test patterns not adequately explained.
Best for: Experts who want reference-quality patterns and are already familiar with basic calibration procedures.
The first setup DVD available, Video Essentials is still the gold standard for professional calibrators and other experts who are intimately familiar with its labyrinthine navigation. Created by video consultant Joe Kane, its patterns and excellent video/film montage have tested thousands of monitors--but they're not easy for beginners to use. People who want less of a learning curve should stick to newer, less arcane discs.
At long lasts, my TV was calibrated by the guys from Sight and Sounds. What can I say? Well, there was a lot of improvement. The skin tone and color of the people on the screen is much better. Unlike before na may pagka pink ng kaunti. And the most important thing is di na masakit sa mata. Before kasi after watching for a couple of hours, masakit na sa mata. Now it is much better. Thanks sir Vic. Now I know that SnS has the best service in town.
Thanks for the nice complements. Enjoy your TV.
Another very satisfied customer from Sights and Sounds.
Sir do you have picture calibration service? If yes how much will you charge? Thanks
Can these calibration devices / softwares be utilized by a non-tech person? The entry level Sypder looks tempting but how often are you gonna use it - that's the question...
(http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/515FNK0KADL._AA280_.jpg)
Click > Spyer2 (http://www.amazon.com/ColorVision-Spyder2-Express-Win-Mac/dp/B000ES4PYU/ref=sr_1_110?ie=UTF8&s=pc&qid=1201672247&sr=1-110)
(http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/31EN6GKK1FL._AA200_.jpg)
Click > Spyder2 Pro (http://www.amazon.com/ColorVision-S2P100-Spyder2PRO-Win-Mac/dp/B000ES6K4I/ref=cm_cr_pr_sims_t)
The entry level Spyder2 Express, puede ata for non-pro bro. Checked the details on the site and it stated:
From the Manufacturer
Calibrate your display--just like professionals. Spyder2express calibrates monitors in three easy steps--simply plug it in, specify your display type, and it does the rest, automatically calibrating your monitor or laptop. Check the before-and-after. You'll see the improvement!
Product Description
ColorVision Spyder2 Express offers photographers, designers, and gamers the best color experience on screen. With just a few steps, you'll get accurate, reliable and consistent color. The quick, easy, and accurate monitor calibration delivers true-to-life flesh tones, well-defined shadows and realistic highlights. It's a must-have for photographers, designers, gamers, and anyone who wants accurate color on screen.
Hmmm...at under $70, seems worth the try ::)
mga dudes meron ako AVIA home theatre guide for sale... ;)
Can these calibration devices / softwares be utilized by a non-tech person? The entry level Sypder looks tempting but how often are you gonna use it - that's the question...
(http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/515FNK0KADL._AA280_.jpg)
Click > Spyer2 (http://www.amazon.com/ColorVision-Spyder2-Express-Win-Mac/dp/B000ES4PYU/ref=sr_1_110?ie=UTF8&s=pc&qid=1201672247&sr=1-110)
(http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/31EN6GKK1FL._AA200_.jpg)
Click > Spyder2 Pro (http://www.amazon.com/ColorVision-S2P100-Spyder2PRO-Win-Mac/dp/B000ES6K4I/ref=cm_cr_pr_sims_t)
Can these calibration devices / softwares be utilized by a non-tech person? The entry level Sypder looks tempting but how often are you gonna use it - that's the question...
(http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/515FNK0KADL._AA280_.jpg)
Click > Spyer2 (http://www.amazon.com/ColorVision-Spyder2-Express-Win-Mac/dp/B000ES4PYU/ref=sr_1_110?ie=UTF8&s=pc&qid=1201672247&sr=1-110)
(http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/31EN6GKK1FL._AA200_.jpg)
Click > Spyder2 Pro (http://www.amazon.com/ColorVision-S2P100-Spyder2PRO-Win-Mac/dp/B000ES6K4I/ref=cm_cr_pr_sims_t)
Is this calibrator thing really effective? Kasi based on experienced ibaba ang mga picture calibration of every type of sources, such as dvd and TV, Just like TV broadcast, there are channels that have different picture image compared to other channels. You still have to make adjustments when you change channels to suit the image to your taste. Tapos may ambient light factor pa...unless you have a dedicated hometheater that have a controlled lighting anytime of the day. You still have to make adjustments every now and then to your taste. You cant just leave evrything to the gadget. In my opinion, as long as you understand what the controls are intended for and its effect when adjusted, you dont really need to buy a picture calibrator to attain best picture image of your TV. Trust your eyes and make the real world as reference when making adjustment.
I suspect you are very correct that different TV channels require different picture adjustments. For TV, I think that you can just use AVIA or Video Essentials.
For DVD viewing, a more sophisticated video calibration done by a pro might be useful. However, it can cost you a lot of money. Maybe P10k.
In any case, even with a properly-calibrated set, it is still useful to adjust the controls per film, depending on the particular film. Some are over-exposed, others under-exposed, etc. Kaya lang, fine-tuning na lang yun.
the spyder 2 express is mainly for pc use and creates accurate color ICC profiles for use in programs such as adobe photoshop. Great for photo editing!!! I purchased one myself from theaterworks. I believe colorvision has a spyder version specifically for calibrating TVs.
Hi,
my client told me today that you have to down load HCFR to your pc then you'll be able to use it for your plasma, they have calibrated hitachi and samsung already since they got it last week. And so for they told me it works out fine. I dont have one myself due to i trust my eyes w/my judgement. But i'll wait for our units to arrive again and i'll open one.
I'll give you an update once i get hold of the units next week. But try to download the HCFR 1st, cause the spyderTV is also using the same tool only the program is different.
regards,
jeff
just got this from the net. follow the ff:
Get the Spyder2 express, Use the probe that comes with the package, which is the same as Spyder TV probe.
Then download HCFR software which is much better than Spyder software. Installed it in your computer
Download and burn the iso file from HCFR on DVD.
Play the DVD on your player and start calibration.
Prepare to spend quite a bit of time, but time spent is worth it.
hope this helps sir. ;)
jeff
Thank you for the info!
I have a Spyder2Express because of my DSLR hobby. I'm also on the verge of buying an LCD TV. I'll certainly give this a try.
Mga sirs,
I was able to download the english version of HCFR pls ff this link and down load Software Version 2.0.1 (8mb)
http://www.homecinema-fr.com/ColorHCFR/index_en.php
after download then burn it to dvd then you can use your spyder probe together w/this program. ;)
If anyone bought a spyder calibration & used it for their Panasonic 32LX77 - pwede nyo kaya i-share sa akin yung settings? Baka lang naman kung okay lang sa inyo ;D
i think it would not work because the calibration depends on the lighting environment and the dvd player. each unit has different settings...even though you have the same tv and dvd player still wouldn't work because you have different environment...
Mga sirs,
I was able to download the english version of HCFR pls ff this link and down load Software Version 2.0.1 (8mb)
http://www.homecinema-fr.com/ColorHCFR/index_en.php
after download then burn it to dvd then you can use your spyder probe together w/this program. ;)
This is what i saw inside, but you have to download it 1st. Di ko pa kabisado, i'm still learning it. :D
(http://i116.photobucket.com/albums/o28/pe_jefferson/DSC00692.jpg)
True enough - but I was merely gunning the idea for testing purposes and not taking it as gospel. Besides, if I dont like it, pwede naman cguro bumalik sa default eh :D
Halos perfect sir ah. :)
Hi mrm,
Thanks for your effort in sharing your calibration experience and knowledge here. May I suggest you also try calibrating the PV70 and Pio DV600 combination? There are alot of members here (including me), who are using this combination.
Thanks!
Hi mrm,
Thanks for the settings you posted for Pana pv42 and Pio dv600. I tried your settings on my pana and pio, but I found the image to be too dark and too soft, also the color is too bright and too yellow for my taste. I wonder why your spyder2 colorimeter and hcfr calibration system recommended the settings above, it is really not appealing (subjective?). Maybe each unit require different calibration settings, so even if we have the same hardware, I cannot apply your settings to my hardware.
For purpose of comparison, I listed below my current settings which I find really very good to my eyes. I arrived on this setting using THX Optimizer (embedded in the Starwars and LOTR dvd) and Sound and Vision Calibration disc. Note that I have not touch the Pana service menu:
Pana PV42: about 500++ hours use when calibration was done
Mode: Cinema
Contrast: 70
Brightness: 65
Color: 42
Sharpness: 60
Tint: 3 clicks towards right
Color Temp: Cool
Color Set: Mid
Color Mgmt: On
Mpg NR: Off
Pio DV600: All init settings in 0, HDMI color set to Full RGB
Can you please try my settings and check the resulting graph, just to see how it compares to your graph.
Thank you. :)
hi sir marl-1,
Nice looking graphs on your second try. it's good to hear that you almost got it on your second try, me I had more than
10 try's a before I was able to get the results I want. Your CIE diagram looks almost ok sir, way better than mine.
Will also try some retest to improve on my CIE when I'm not busy because it's very time consuming nga. maybe it's because we
are still just learning it. And also do some retest on the Pana and pio 600 combo.
Sir it would also be nice when you have time to share the settings on your DLP and oppo for the results you showed, for those
who have the same setup as you and have them try it and post their feedback.
thanks for sharing.
noticed that when i increase the brightness... the blacks become grey. i tried offsetting this by lowering the contrast down a bit but i still get grey and not black. im trying to find the brightest picture for dark scenes to show more detail without messing up the blacks.
Try adjustiing with the help of a calibration disc.
If you're still not satisfied with black levels, then you have probably reached the limit of your TV's capability. Decreasing the brightness produces black crush (loss of black level details), but increasing brightness produces gray black levels.
sir san po kayo nakakuha ng mga program na pang-calibrate...di ko kasi maramdaman yung pagka-HD nung pana 32lx77 na binili ko e. di ko naman madala ulit sa sights and sounds since malayo pa ko...laguna pa po kasi ako. pls help mga sir...yung po ba avia na program lang kelangan ko? then user friendly ba yun? hoping for your quick and informative replies mga master..thanks!!!
sir san po kayo nakakuha ng mga program na pang-calibrate...di ko kasi maramdaman yung pagka-HD nung pana 32lx77 na binili ko e. di ko naman madala ulit sa sights and sounds since malayo pa ko...laguna pa po kasi ako. pls help mga sir...yung po ba avia na program lang kelangan ko? then user friendly ba yun? hoping for your quick and informative replies mga master..thanks!!!
sir san po kayo nakakuha ng mga program na pang-calibrate...di ko kasi maramdaman yung pagka-HD nung pana 32lx77 na binili ko e. di ko naman madala ulit sa sights and sounds since malayo pa ko...laguna pa po kasi ako. pls help mga sir...yung po ba avia na program lang kelangan ko? then user friendly ba yun? hoping for your quick and informative replies mga master..thanks!!!
For example in the RGB graph what setting should you adjust if let's say the Red is oversaturated, same goes for Gamma, color temp and etc.Hi,
I Or does this simply mean that opening up the service menu is mandatory for calibrating TVs.It is not mandatory to open the service menu. It it case to case basis ( i think). On my setup I did not change any service menu codes, to achieve
Right now my TV has a PC mode and that's the setting that I want to calibrate and I'm a little worried since I don't see any tint or gamma adjustments in the settings menu and I don't want to risk voiding my warranty for tampering with the service menu.On some TV models they have individual adjustments for the RGB colors. If you have those then you may not need
Thanks for the input but I'm really confused as to what tests I should run with my HCFR and Spyder 2, does it only have to be the greyscale tests or do I still have to test the others like near white, near black, primaries & secondaries etc?
Hi,
Where can we buy spyder2 here in the phils.? how much? thanks.
If anyone bought a spyder calibration & used it for their Samsung 32R81B...
pwede nyo kaya i-share sa akin yung settings? kung okay lang po sa inyo.
Thanks
mga master, san po kaya ako makakabili ng mga color filter? pls...TIA!!!
I just realized that it's a really time-consuming endeavor. My 1st try took 4 hours, didn't even get close. My 2nd try around 5 hours, came up with some good results.
@pchin hi sir, may I know what is your tv and dvd player and their detailed settings you used to achieve your results.thanks
@pchin hi sir, did you selected this before you started the calibration on the HCFR:
Upon launching the HCFR application you'll be prompted a couple of times: select 'DVD manual' and 'Spyder II' if you're using a Spyder 2 colorimeter
Select References from the Preferences menu and ensure HCFR is using D65 white and REC 709 colourspace as a reference model and Gamma reference
at 2.22
@pchin hi sir,
From your graph what we should be most concerned are the RGB and Color Temperature graph.That is were the big problem lies.
From the RGB graph we can see that there is a huge discrepancy between the three colors below the 60% mark, that is why the delta E
is nowhere seen below that. When there is a discrepancy between the three colors the delta E gets bigger. Ideally we have to have them
at least close to each as much as possible and the delta E below 6 or much better if we can get 4.
2. Gamma calculation
Which one do I select?
The default is "Display Gamma with black compensation". Do I leave this alone?
I just disregard the result of the calibration tools and used my previous personal calibration. Now I felt that my investment in the calibration tools were just a waste of money... :(
I definitely agree with LETOR and bukoy... I bought AVIA, Sound & Vision and THX Glasses calibration tools to calibrate my Pana Plasma but the result looks "too bright colors" for my eyes. So I ended up recalibrating based on my own eyes perception, which if tested by AVIA, Sound & Vision and THX Glasses will give "failed" or "not passed" grades! I just disregard the result of the calibration tools and used my previous personal calibration. Now I felt that my investment in the calibration tools were just a waste of money... :(
I was about to send you a PM about that sir,
glad you posted your observation about it,...
Thanks...
I just use a free THX Optimizer. I need test patterns only for brightness and tint. For other criteria, I can calibrate without the help of test patterns.
In my view, calibration tools are necessary for inexperienced owners.
But for the more experienced users, calibration tools can be useful as a starting point. After that, settings should still be finalized manually.
Post ko dito Mark.......
As part of improvements in my HT, I had it professionally calibrated. It was my first time to have some professional help regarding calibration, and it was done by fellow kabalen sir alvinthx2.
Alvin concentrated first on the video calibration of my Panasonic AE2000, as I was tasked by him to put some bass traps before he could do the audio calibration.
His software, Datacolor Colorfacts, first analyzed my default settings on my PJ. The initial RGB color tracking analysis revealed that I have high levels of blue, and low levels of red. He tweaked the color management menu of my PJ, and after some tweaking, he was able to correct the RGB levels of my PJ.
(http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2348/2391849653_96f0d0b208.jpg?v=0)
color tracking analysis chart, after calibration, showing the near perfect levels of RGB
(http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2225/2392682562_84ffa62685.jpg?v=0)
color temperature tracking analysis chart, after calibration. Alvin adjusted it to 6484k, wala pang 1% off sa ideal color temperature of 6504k or D65.
(http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2140/2392682916_5133f6faf2.jpg?v=0)
Luminance tracking across greyscale level, near perfect rin....
Alvin said that most PJs are overly saturated in their default color settings. But it results in unnatural skin and color tones, which is unrealistic. After some demo material, and some films I am familiar were shown, I was truly satisfied with what Alvin has done. The differences might not be huge to the untrained eye, but this calibration showed me how having the right levels of colors, greyscale, and color temperature contributes in having the best PQ possible out of my equipment. ;)
and the Before and After Screenshots
(http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2387/2394318311_631097bd04.jpg?v=0)
(http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2075/2395152538_d0b52eb824.jpg?v=0)
(http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2340/2395152124_81d656eeca.jpg?v=0)
(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3042/2395151732_d4d19e64e0.jpg?v=0)
(http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2132/2394316435_4c8b5bb547.jpg?v=0)
Notice how the before shots are cooler, or have high levels of blue color. Much better skin tones on the right. ;)
Congrat Marvin for a nicely calibrated HT...near perfect! ;)
Here's a link to the popular
GREYSCALE & COLOUR CALIBRATION FOR DUMMIES
Perfect for non-techie people. :)
Is this guide for me?
This guide is for the home theater enthusiast who wants to get the absolute best picture out of their TV or projector. It will show you how to obtain the most accurate colours possible on any display regardless of technology (CRT, LCD, DLP, SXRD, LCOS, etc.). No prior knowledge or understanding of greyscale or colour calibration is required. Even if you have absolutely no understanding of what CIE, D65, or colorimetry means, you'll be able to calibrate your greyscale and colours correctly. In fact, you may not even know what "greyscale calibration" is at all! That's fine! We'll explain why it's important along with exactly what tools are needed and how to use them. Read on and learn how and why proper greyscale and colour calibration is regarded as one of (if not the) most important calibration anyone should perform on their TV or projector for optimal picture quality.
http://www.curtpalme.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=10457
here in my computer screen, the difference is subtle, but i believe when in front of your huge screen sir munskie, the difference must surely be very noticeable. the whites and skin tone are much more natural.
On my computer monitor (CRT), I can see a big difference. But I really think I can adjust the "before" shots to the "after" shots myself on a plasma, without professional calibration.
Great inputs!
Please keep them coming. I want to draft a conclusion based on your comments.
Based on the comments so far, results will depend on the display used. Calibration is useful for projectors, but not so much for plasma panels.
On my computer monitor (CRT), I can see a big difference. But I really think I can adjust the "before" shots to the "after" shots myself on a plasma, without professional calibration.
More comments, please. If you already have a good eye, will you still need professional calibration for a plasma or LCD?
Post ko dito Mark.......
As part of improvements in my HT, I had it professionally calibrated. It was my first time to have some professional help regarding calibration, and it was done by fellow kabalen sir alvinthx2.
Alvin concentrated first on the video calibration of my Panasonic AE2000, as I was tasked by him to put some bass traps before he could do the audio calibration.
His software, Datacolor Colorfacts, first analyzed my default settings on my PJ. The initial RGB color tracking analysis revealed that I have high levels of blue, and low levels of red. He tweaked the color management menu of my PJ, and after some tweaking, he was able to correct the RGB levels of my PJ.
(http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2348/2391849653_96f0d0b208.jpg?v=0)
color tracking analysis chart, after calibration, showing the near perfect levels of RGB
(http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2225/2392682562_84ffa62685.jpg?v=0)
color temperature tracking analysis chart, after calibration. Alvin adjusted it to 6484k, wala pang 1% off sa ideal color temperature of 6504k or D65.
(http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2140/2392682916_5133f6faf2.jpg?v=0)
Luminance tracking across greyscale level, near perfect rin....
Alvin said that most PJs are overly saturated in their default color settings. But it results in unnatural skin and color tones, which is unrealistic. After some demo material, and some films I am familiar were shown, I was truly satisfied with what Alvin has done. The differences might not be huge to the untrained eye, but this calibration showed me how having the right levels of colors, greyscale, and color temperature contributes in having the best PQ possible out of my equipment. ;)
and the Before and After Screenshots
Notice how the before shots are cooler, or have high levels of blue color. Much better skin tones on the right. ;)
However, if you are talking about greyscale and color temperature, you definitely need instruments because it will be impossible to do this by eye alone. And in my experience, the difference can be huge. You can take a look at the "before" and "after" calibration pics of Munskie's pj at the HT Gallery and you will note a huge difference.
napansin ko lang, when i used avia2 dvd to calibrate my 32" lcd tv on my ps3 connected thru hdmi, hindi ko magalaw ung "hue" settings ng tv... naka-grey siya, weird ba un o ganun talaga kapag hdmi connection?
Hue setting will grey out if HDMI connection gamit mo. You can adjust this only if component or composite connection gamit mo.. This is the case for my Samsung DLP TV.
comparing the calibrated display on dvd vs hd/bluray playback, may difference ba? on another hand, if you are going to play HD on your display, kelangan pa bang i cablirate?
but as any standard, it might not be acceptable to some. as they say there is no perfect standard.
personally, if i can afford it, professional help is the way to go. if we can't have or afford it (like me! ;D ;D ;D) then i try to get cheaper tools available (avia, thx optimizer etc) to atleast get the results. but in the end its still our own personal taste that will dictate if the result of the calibration (professional or diy) is acceptable to us.
Based on the comments so far, results will depend on the display used. Calibration is useful for projectors, but not so much for plasma panels.
I just use a free THX Optimizer. I need test patterns only for brightness and tint. For other criteria, I can calibrate without the help of test patterns.
In my view, calibration tools are necessary for inexperienced owners.
But for the more experienced users, calibration tools can be useful as a starting point. After that, settings should still be finalized manually.
Sir Barrister,
I've heard that the THX Optimizer is available as extra on some DVD movies - please confirm if this correct. Also please give some sample popular DVD titles with the THX Optimizer if that is the case... I actually bought the THX blue film glasses, but still do not have the software to calibrate my plasma.
TIA
I've heard that the THX Optimizer is available as extra on some DVD movies - please confirm if this correct. Also please give some sample popular DVD titles with the THX Optimizer if that is the case... I actually bought the THX blue film glasses, but still do not have the software to calibrate my plasma.
Calibration involves adjusting the GAIN and BIAS of the 3 primary colors. This can be done with the right software and a Spectrophotometer. Not all meters are the same, the more expensive PR650 by PhotoResearch Lab can cost around 1 million pesos. It's accuracy is second to none. I have tried Spyder's meter and the results are very different from the Gretag Macbeth Eye1Pro meter that I am using now.
Lots (maybe all?) THX DVD's. For example, all the Star Wars DVD's.
Does this mean that a Spyder calibration is useless because of its questionable accuracy?
That makes a lot of sense, sir streetsmart.
Thanks also to sir alvinthx2 for the great post.
Sir streetsmart is right. It's found on THX-certified DVDs released since 2000. Popular titles are Star Wars and Indiana Jones.
But note that THX Optimizer includes only the most basic calibrations. And according to THX, it's also disc-specific, meaning that you are supposed to use that particular Optimizer only for the movie found on the same disc. Don't ask me why. I don't get it either ;D.
... And I thought the Spyder was state-of-the-art equipment :P.
Does this mean that a Spyder calibration is useless because of its questionable accuracy?
Great inputs!
Please keep them coming. I want to draft a conclusion based on your comments.
Based on the comments so far, results will depend on the display used. Calibration is useful for projectors, but not so much for plasma panels.
On my computer monitor (CRT), I can see a big difference. But I really think I can adjust the "before" shots to the "after" shots myself on a plasma, without professional calibration.
More comments, please. If you already have a good eye, will you still need professional calibration for a plasma or LCD?
I fnd this site very useful & easy to follow the step by step instructions. :)
GREYSCALE & COLOUR CALIBRATION FOR DUMMIES
http://www.curtpalme.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=10457
is there a software for the spyder2express for mac? ???
Yes there is :)
is there a software for the spyder2express for mac? ???
very hard question indeed, "must have" or "nice to have"... for PhP12k where should this one belong?
said better than the spyder2 : http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=958099 (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=958099)
i1display 2: http://www.xrite.com/product_overview.aspx?ID=788 (http://www.xrite.com/product_overview.aspx?ID=788)
actually, after having more than two years in PDVD the line between wants and needs are somewhat grey to me already :o ;D
so which is which, spyder or eye-one?
Ha ha ha...If you think you'll be always using the gadget then it should be "A Must Have" but if you'll be using it once, twice or thrice then you'll just keep it for the rest of its life then its "A Nice To Have".
IMO, after familiarization how the gadget works and how does a finely calibrated screen picture looks, our eyes and brain will learn from that experience and can work together to perform adjustments without the aide of said equipment...then you can now say...goodbye spyderman.
The spyder2express you bought should come with a compatible Mac OS right?
I fnd this site very useful & easy to follow the step by step instructions. :)
GREYSCALE & COLOUR CALIBRATION FOR DUMMIES
http://www.curtpalme.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=10457
btw, what dvd patterns did you use? the author used the hd basics for the calibration, i wonder if the avia 2 disc is as realible as the hd basics?
Ha ha ha...If you think you'll be always using the gadget then it should be "A Must Have" but if you'll be using it once, twice or thrice then you'll just keep it for the rest of its life then its "A Nice To Have".
IMO, after familiarization how the gadget works and how does a finely calibrated screen picture looks, our eyes and brain will learn from that experience and can work together to perform adjustments without the aide of said equipment...then you can now say...goodbye spyderman.
Actually you can't do that, you will actually be messing up the picture if you try to adjust Hidden menu controls. these are the one that are adjusted when you do a GREYscale calibration. They are not the same as the 5 readilly available controls that are accessible via remote.
Controls that may be adjusted via Pro calibration:
RED Bias/CUT
Green Bias/CUT
Blue Bias/CUT
R Gain
G GAin
B Gain
secondary color Cyan, Magenata, Yellow
Saturation, Brightness, Hue for each secondary color
Gamma settings (low middle , high) and for each individual primary color
Color Gamut
Dynamic Range (Black and White Crush)
DELTA E
These are just some of the controls and values that have to be adjusted. Oh, did I say each of these reacts with the other controls? Now without instruments ,how can you set all of these optimally?
very hard question indeed, "must have" or "nice to have"... for PhP12k where should this one belong?
said better than the spyder2 : http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=958099 (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=958099)
i1display 2: http://www.xrite.com/product_overview.aspx?ID=788 (http://www.xrite.com/product_overview.aspx?ID=788)
actually, after having more than two years in PDVD the line between wants and needs are somewhat grey to me already :o ;D
so which is which, spyder or eye-one?
for me calibration is essential, now whether you want to do it yourself (via this entry level spyders or just plain disc calibration via avia) or have someone do it is up to you. now regarding the cost of the equipment. personally, if my screen set-up is going to stay with me atleast 3-4 years i think i would rather hire a person to do it for me. but if you are really an enthusiast which change video gears in less than 2 years, and you can afford it, maybe you should by this stuff.
i have asked an a/v store (represented here in pdvd) kung how much ang calibration, they use the spyder pro and for us members its 2.5k a pop.
then pag p.j. set-up mo, maybe you should ask for sir alvinthx2 services. ;D ;D ;D
master alvin, binasa ko ung "Kal's Guide" ung huli at advanced calibration, calibrates the secondary colors... di ba ung hue iyon? pero kapag sa hdmi connection naka-grey naman ung hue... so kelangan sa hidden menu ako kakalikot?
Sir E-reply and Sir Nemesis,
I would just like to make a suggestion. Not of all of us would have access to a calibration tool. It would be of help to PDVD members if you could post the settings after calibration of the most popular models that you are selling. It would also be better if you can post settings after calibration on different room lighting - dark, semi, and well-lighted room.
We can use the settings as reference ... since those are professionally calibrated, it should not be much far-off if copied on the same model of equipment. Perhaps a new thread can be started containing purely the settings of different models, as an example it would only contain the following info -
Brand:
Model No.:
Contrast:
Brightness:
Colour:
Tint:
Temperature:
Room Lighting Conditions:
Hours of Usage or Date of Purchase:
I indicated date of purchase cause hours of usage I think, is only viewable through service panels that ordinary end-users could not access. Posting on settings would not be limited to E-reply and Nemesis, as we have our expert members and enthusiast members in the forum as well.
In addition -- each display is unique. Even same brand, same manufacturer, same model. That's why the calibration is also unique to each display.
Actually you can't do that, you will actually be messing up the picture if you try to adjust Hidden menu controls. these are the one that are adjusted when you do a GREYscale calibration. They are not the same as the 5 readilly available controls that are accessible via remote.Do you mean that this equipment have internal/electrical connection with monitor to make adjustments with the inaccessible or hidden menus as these are not the same with those found in the remote? Or should you we know somebody from the dealership that knows the codes how to access the hidden menus?
Controls that may be adjusted via Pro calibration:
RED Bias/CUT
Green Bias/CUT
Blue Bias/CUT
R Gain
G GAin
B Gain
secondary color Cyan, Magenata, Yellow
Saturation, Brightness, Hue for each secondary color
Gamma settings (low middle , high) and for each individual primary color
Color Gamut
Dynamic Range (Black and White Crush)
DELTA E
These are just some of the controls and values that have to be adjusted. Oh, did I say each of these reacts with the other controls? Now without instruments ,how can you set all of these optimally?
Do you mean that this equipment have internal/electrical connection with monitor to make adjustments with the inaccessible or hidden menus as these are not the same with those found in the remote? Or should you we know somebody from the dealership that knows the codes how to access the hidden menus?
In addition -- each display is unique. Even same brand, same manufacturer, same model. That's why the calibration is also unique to each display.
If this is the case, does it means that the brand/manufacturer has a poor quality control? It is true that each unit is unique as compared to other same units in the same brand and model, but the difference or uniqueness should be not so great that the quality of one will be better (or worst) than the others. Isn't it that each unit is assembled in accordance to a specific standard for that model? And if a unit does not pass the standard it will be rejected and bumped-off the assembly line. In summary, if a brand or manufacturer strictly follows a certain standard in their assembly line, each model they produce should be of the same quality, a "clone" of the original prototype of that model.
sa mga sirs:
hindi po kaya ma-void ang warranty if calibration was done using software like spyder, etc??
no it won't becuase you don't open up the tv anyway, the gadget is just attached to the screen itself to get the reading. tweaking of the settings is done through the set's menu naman kaya there is nothing done to the tv that woulg void its warrranty.
some audio/video stores like s&s actually do free calibration after the 100 hours viewing as an added value service. ;D
no it won't becuase you don't open up the tv anyway, the gadget is just attached to the screen itself to get the reading. tweaking of the settings is done through the set's menu naman kaya there is nothing done to the tv that woulg void its warrranty.
some audio/video stores like s&s actually do free calibration after the 100 hours viewing as an added value service. ;D
In my situation, I agree. I both have a plasma and a PJ. The improvement in the calibrated PQ is so much noticeable in the huge screen. Ive tried a basic DIY calibration in my plasma thru AVIA, and the improvement was subtle. And it was really hard doing calibration with those color filters.
if you bought you tv from sights and sounds, avail of their free spyder calibration. it really made a difference with my lcd
i want also to avail of their free calibration... kaso dadalhin kasi unit sa shop... tinatamad lang ako hehehehe
sana pwede home service :)
If you bought your unit from S&S, you are entitled to get 1 free calibration, all you have to do is inform them of your schedule, and they'll visit you at your most convenient time. They even visited me here in Nueva Ecija for my calibration.
Cheers
Sir!
Ask ko lang po if SnS do calibration service to unit not purchase with them? tska if pede home service?
Salamat po! ;D
@Vic:
kelan kaya uli magagawi mga bata mo dito? gusto ko sana magpa-calibrate ;D
Sir i have a 32" Sony W series however i didn't purchase it at SnS can i avail of your service? Thanks!
-Ditto-
We charge P3K for TV calibration within Metro Manila.
Getting your HDTV's colors right takes more than good eyesight
Most TV sets are shipped out from the factory with color, brightness and contrast turned up too high. This creates unnatural pictures, plus of course, it could either damage the TV panel with burn-in or shorten the life of your TV due to overly bright lighting level.
To depend on the naked eye in adjusting the TV picture settings is a hit or miss affair. To get a right picture, we need scientific method like Spyder colorimeter TV calibration. Spyder scientifically calculates the correct adjustments to brightness, contrast, color, tint and temperature. This solution optimizes your viewing experience in the following:
I fully agree with your statement that you need more than your eyes to properly calibrate a display. I also agree that the default settings of most displays are not accurate. You need the right equipment, patterns and software to calibrate correctly.
With respect to brightness, contrast, color and tint, however, in my experience, you only need test patterns to get them right. You can get these patterns in THX movies (such as Star Wars) or calibration discs such as Avia and Video Essentials. I don't think you need a colorimeter.
You will definitely need a colorimeter for color temperature but I am wondering if you do detailed grayscale calibration. Can the displays you mention adjust the RGB bias/gain, without having to go into the Service Menu? Or when you say "temperature," are you actually referring to some rough adjustments like "Vivid," "Cinema," "Normal" or whatever?
I fully agree with your statement that you need more than your eyes to properly calibrate a display. I also agree that the default settings of most displays are not accurate. You need the right equipment, patterns and software to calibrate correctly.
With respect to brightness, contrast, color and tint, however, in my experience, you only need test patterns to get them right. You can get these patterns in THX movies (such as Star Wars) or calibration discs such as Avia and Video Essentials. I don't think you need a colorimeter.
You will definitely need a colorimeter for color temperature but I am wondering if you do detailed grayscale calibration. Can the displays you mention adjust the RGB bias/gain, without having to go into the Service Menu? Or when you say "temperature," are you actually referring to some rough adjustments like "Vivid," "Cinema," "Normal" or whatever?
The Spyder software does not have provision to calibrate the gray scale and/or RGB bias/gain. Spyder also relies on the pre-set TV temperature.
I fully agree with your statement that you need more than your eyes to properly calibrate a display. I also agree that the default settings of most displays are not accurate. You need the right equipment, patterns and software to calibrate correctly.
With respect to brightness, contrast, color and tint, however, in my experience, you only need test patterns to get them right. You can get these patterns in THX movies (such as Star Wars) or calibration discs such as Avia and Video Essentials. I don't think you need a colorimeter.
You will definitely need a colorimeter for color temperature but I am wondering if you do detailed grayscale calibration. Can the displays you mention adjust the RGB bias/gain, without having to go into the Service Menu? Or when you say "temperature," are you actually referring to some rough adjustments like "Vivid," "Cinema," "Normal" or whatever?
Boss, I have the complete Star Wars DVD box set where can I find the test patterns?
Tnx
streetsmart how about adjusting it thru my htpc (software)? can this yield the same result like that of the color calibration?
Sir, on each disc, you can go to set-up, then there is an icon THX Optimizer, just select the icon and instructions will be given for audio and video test.
i am interested with the answer of this.. :)oo nga bro eh .. since we could adjust the colors and stuff thru the software which ordinary lcd and crt monitors can handle .. :D
streetsmart how about adjusting it thru my htpc (software)? can this yield the same result like that of the color calibration?
Frankly, I am not familiar with HTPC's but my suspicion is this - In order to do a grayscale calibration, you need 4 things:with this explanation bro i think the htpc can do/push it, but in the end calibration really needs a sensor .. :)
1) Test patterns such as those on Video Essentials or THX DVD's
2) A sensor such as Spyder (or better, EyeOne) to essentially capture the intensity of red, green and blue on the test patterns. The sensor should be connected to a PC
3) On the PC, there should be a software which communicates with the sensor and displays the data captured by the sensor to the PC screen
4) A means to manipulate the RGB bias/gain in your TV or projector
An HTPC may have the test patterns and the software but you still need an external sensor.
The test pattern from videocards are not reliable as they are not pre calibrated or are not certified. The best pattern are from high end video generators like the accupel hdg4000 and sencore vp403.ok but i was simply saying, kaya ng video card mag produce ng kulay na kapareho ng calibrated tv ..
ISF and THX certified calibrators do not use HTPC as their pattern source.
With regards to the spyder sensor, it can be useful for basic calibration but not for critical Greyscale calibration. From my experience with this sensor, the values derived are sometimes more than 10% off the reading made by the I1pro. I am dreaming of the X rite hubble or the Photo research pr 655 as my premium sensor, unless I win the Lotto, the thought will stay in dreamland.
ok but i was simply saying, kaya ng video card mag produce ng kulay na kapareho ng calibrated tv ..
With regards to the spyder sensor, it can be useful for basic calibration but not for critical Greyscale calibration. From my experience with this sensor, the values derived are sometimes more than 10% off the reading made by the I1pro.
Hi to the people at SnS! :)
before (matagal na eh around 3mos ago siguro) I went to your store and asked if you calibrate tvs not bought from your store sabi nung nakausap ko hinde daw hehe.. so you charge 3k within metro manila? wala na ba discount? hehe ;D
In the list I made above, I suspect that the video card can handle #4 - it can manipulate the RGB bias/gain. But you still need items 1 to 3. In particular, you need a sensor.
hi streetsmart, what if let say i just want to "copy" your calibrated unit without the sensor/device. can we simply place the 2 tv side by side, then ill just tweak mine thru my software up until they, well sortof look "identical". :D
Not possible, for several reasons.
1. The TV's will have to be identical. Different TV models will have different pq capabilities.
2. Even if the TV's are identical, they will each require a unique calibration because each unit is different from the other. Furthermore, after every few hundred hours of usage, you need to redo the calibration. Calibration is not a one-time task.
3. Without a sensor, it is nearly impossible to get the right color mix. There are just too many variables.
Sirs,
Newbie question on calibration - I'm planning to buy Spyder TV or EyePro. I'd just like to ask if I can calibrate my tv using either one by just modifying the items on the standard menu, and not modifying any settings on the service menu.
TIA
My friend and I are contemplating on buying the Spyder II, but the calibration steps are intimidating!
Spyder and EyePro have the same function. They are both sensors. The only difference is that EyePro is more accurate and also more expensive.
If your TV allows you to adjust RGB bias/gain, brightness/contrast etc. (dami kasi terms yun but basically, you should be able to adjust the levels of red, blue and green for the black level and white level) through your standard menu, then that's fine. Otherwise, you need to use the Service Menu through a sequence of buttons on the remote, which you should be able to easily discover through the web.
In any case, if you are careful, the Service Menu is often better because typically, the steps are finer.
Sir, thanks for the feedback, follow-up question lang ... i'm using a Panasonic 42pv8 - can i calibrate the unit using just the standard menus?
TIA
Sir, thanks for the feedback, follow-up question lang ... i'm using a Panasonic 42pv8 - can i calibrate the unit using just the standard menus?
TIA
Hello,
I'm a bit confused. So if I purchase a spyder or eye-one, then I need to connect my LCD TV to a PC or Laptop? Then how do I go about adjusting whatever needs adjusting? via the PC? or through LCD TV controls?
btw, anybody know where I can buy eye-one?
Thanks for the link
btw, is calibrating a one time thing? or does it need to be done monthly on a regular basis?
monthly sir. :)
Di naman. Unless you use your display 10 or more hours per day. Every few months pa siguro. ;D
Typically, you need to re-do the calibration after a few hundred hours of usage.
Here's a very good link which explains the calibration procedure:
http://www.curtpalme.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=10457
What's the logic behind calibrating your tv every few months? Unfortunately, I don't have a calibrator to calibrate my TV when I want to, that is why my tv was calibrated only once. That was after buying it from one of the 'suking tindahan' here in PDVD. It would be a year since my tv was calibrated but I think PQ is still great 'til now or should I call them again to re-calibrate the tv? :)
The problem is that as the lamp of the display ages, the balance of the red, green and blue colors is also affected. I have seen displays which are perfectly calibrated but after a few months, the calibration is way off. After a year, you can be pretty sure that the calibration needs to be re-done.
If you are referring to the calibration done by the "suking tindahan" here, I am really not sure if they do a thorough gray-scale calibration. As an alternative, I would strongly suggest that you just get one of the calibration discs such as Video Essentials (or even a THX DVD such as Star Wars) and use the patterns there for basic calibration of brightness, contrast, color and tint. That will be a cheap solution. For a full calibration, you will need a sensor such as Spyder or Eye-One.
Thanks for the info sir street. :)
I don't know how thorough the calibration was, :) but they also used a Spyder calibrator. I have read many good things about 'Video Essentials' and such, but are they very easy to understand and use?
Thanks for the info sir street. :)
I don't know how thorough the calibration was, :) but they also used a Spyder calibrator. I have read many good things about 'Video Essentials' and such, but are they very easy to understand and use?
Nasubukan nyo na sa audio visual driver magpa ISF calibration?
Yes, nasubukan ko na. Incredibly good.how much they charge sir?
how much they charge sir?