Topic: Why analog?

[edgarryan]

Just thought I'd start a thread about this topic, since the last turntable topic is more than 120 days old.  My family had a turntable before (National, I think), and that's where we played our records.  In the 1990's, the stylus was replaced, but unfortunately, after a short while, it got lost (got caught in the rag while being cleaned, most probably).  The next turntable, a Kenwood, which I am trying to revive now, suffered the same fate.  Perhaps due to the digital revolution, we simply switched to CDs instead of maintaining the turntable and looking for those parts which are fast becoming unavailable.

Because of PinoyDVD, I again decided to go the analog route, buying a second-hand Hitachi Lo-D HT462 turntable while at the same time looking for a cartridge and stylus for the Kenwood P-26.  And I've been staying in my room all night after work listening to the records which were either in the family collection before or were bought in Quiapo and Tiendesitas recently.  Most of the newly acquired vinyls usually skip in places, but I can't complain. 

I just want the other analog enthusiasts here to share why they still keep and listen to their turntables. Also, where do you get your records and gears?  I really want to expand my collection.  Might also install a turntable in the office just so I can enjoy analog the whole day.  Hehehe.

As for me, I find the sound coming from vinyl better.  Violins and voices are more alive.  I don't mind the pops and crackles, since that's part of the territory.  I would be more irritated if those sounds came from a CD. 

[onedown]

lots of reasons why some people stick to analog. most stick to vinyl because they find its sounds better than vinyl. in addition to the sound quality, some find the ritual of maintaining a turntable [aligning, etc] therapeutic. in my case, there's another reason why i have a table--there are some albums that aren't available on cd--at least locally.

for vinyls and analog gear, register at www.wirdestate. com and check out the marketplace.

[edgarryan]

True, a lot of albums are still not available on CD.

I'm a member of WS, but I find the website difficult to navigate.  Perhaps I'm looking at the wrong section, but I can't find the Marketplace.  Not like in PDVD, it's so much easier to look for the items you want.

[onedown]

try hanging around at ws more often. you'll get to know the other members better, as well as get used to its layout.

[edgarryan]

I guess that's what I have to do.  It's just very different from PDVD.

[onedown]

for vinyls, you can try visiting bebop records at the basement of makati cinema square, or vinyl dump at cubao expo.

some music one and astro have a few sealed titles [the former also have pre-owned records]. you can also try fully booked at the fort area for sealed vinyls.

[edgarryan]

for vinyls, you can try visiting bebop records at the basement of makati cinema square, or vinyl dump at cubao expo.

some music one and astro have a few sealed titles [the former also have pre-owned records]. you can also try fully booked at the fort area for sealed vinyls.

Thanks!  Malamang, mas mura sa Cubao Expo.  Nagtanong na ako sa Astro, wala daw eh.  Di naman ako nagagawi sa The Fort.

[onedown]

still on vinyls, try sending superman a message. i believe he regularly visits this site.

[Superman]

As for me, I find the sound coming from vinyl better.  Violins and voices are more alive.  I don't mind the pops and crackles, since that's part of the territory.  I would be more irritated if those sounds came from a CD. 

...there you go, sir! Welcome (back) to the world of ANALOG!

[Superman]

still on vinyls, try sending superman a message. i believe he regularly visits this site.

Salamt bai sa endorsement mo! Ayo ayo!

[Superman]

True, a lot of albums are still not available on CD.

I'm a member of WS, but I find the website difficult to navigate.  Perhaps I'm looking at the wrong section, but I can't find the Marketplace.  Not like in PDVD, it's so much easier to look for the items you want.

You can check this out:

http://www.wiredstate.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=105&t=13296&p=151348#p151348

Check also the Sponsors' Thread and Marketplace/Member's Trading Corner Thread/s.

http://www.wiredstate.com/forum/viewforum.php?f=103

http://www.wiredstate.com/forum/viewforum.php?f=107

Regards!

[edgarryan]

Thanks for the tips!  Saw your ad there.  Tignan ko kung ano magustuhan ko.  Hehehe.

[edgarryan]

I had a very pleasant surprise today.  Went to Quiapo, opposite Isetann along Quezon Boulevard, and found a shop which had used records for sale.  Got a few records for P1K.  Been playing them tonight, and the quality is very good.  So far, no skips.  Very, very happy with my purchase!

[onedown]

congrats on your find!

[edgarryan]

Thanks!

[reynold]

I had a very pleasant surprise today.  Went to Quiapo, opposite Isetann along Quezon Boulevard, and found a shop which had used records for sale.  Got a few records for P1K.  Been playing them tonight, and the quality is very good.  So far, no skips.  Very, very happy with my purchase!

How much per record bro? and what's the name of the store? Thanks and enjoy Analog

[odyopayl]

True, a lot of albums are still not available on CD.

I'm a member of WS, but I find the website difficult to navigate.  Perhaps I'm looking at the wrong section, but I can't find the Marketplace.  Not like in PDVD, it's so much easier to look for the items you want.

I just want to give impression why you still need Analog? If you are a classic lover a standard or even a music lover, you will notice old songs are still the best and they are very pleasant to listen. I am not a pure Analog Lover but I prefer to have both Analog and digital Set-up. Now the question is Why?
Simply, original Analog recordings are best heard on Vinyls, anything transferred from Analog to digital sounds S--KS.
However, now a days most of the recording are originally recorded on Digitals and I can say they sound very good

Digital Cameras exceeded the quality of Analog Camera in terms of resolutions. Imagine your Film printed pictures and scan it for a digital copy they are  Crap right because of the conversion.

Analog is analog digital is digital

[edgarryan]

How much per record bro? and what's the name of the store? Thanks and enjoy Analog

Got the LPs for P100 a piece.  Then humingi ako ng libreng isa.  Hehehe. I don't know the name of the store, pero merong nakalagay na sign sa harap na bumibili sila ng PS2 games.

[edgarryan]

I just want to give impression why you still need Analog? If you are a classic lover a standard or even a music lover, you will notice old songs are still the best and they are very pleasant to listen. I am not a pure Analog Lover but I prefer to have both Analog and digital Set-up. Now the question is Why?
Simply, original Analog recordings are best heard on Vinyls, anything transferred from Analog to digital sounds S--KS.
However, now a days most of the recording are originally recorded on Digitals and I can say they sound very good

Digital Cameras exceeded the quality of Analog Camera in terms of resolutions. Imagine your Film printed pictures and scan it for a digital copy they are  Crap right because of the conversion.

Analog is analog digital is digital

Good thing I love standards.  Hehehe.  Sabi nga nila, unprocessed foods are better.  Unprocessed sounds are better also.

[odyopayl]

Good thing I love standards.  Hehehe.  Sabi nga nila, unprocessed foods are better.  Unprocessed sounds are better also.

Have you tried Listening to Norah Jones Vinyl and Norah Jones CD? I believe this one recorded on Digital and Process to make an Analog copy

[Stagea]

Digital Cameras exceeded the quality of Analog Camera in terms of resolutions. Imagine your Film printed pictures and scan it for a digital copy they are  Crap right because of the conversion.

Medyo off-topic. I think film qualifies as chemical, instead of analogue. In terms of absolute color depth and dynamic range, digital is still far from film at a comparable format. The exposure latitude of film is just so good (especially for negatives... slide film is a bit more exacting). In terms of line resolution or high contrast resolving power, digital is getting there (at least with smaller formats). In larger formats (medium, and especially large formats), film (or plates) still dominate because of cost and the fact that these are used in applications when quality is preferred over convenience. The output is then fluid mounted and drum scanned, if a great digital output is desired.

Of course in the consumer sphere, digital cams have almost completely eclipsed chemical cams because of convenience. This is because you can see the output right away, there is no need for processing, you can change sensitivity on the fly, and there's one less consumable.

[odyopayl]

Medyo off-topic. I think film qualifies as chemical, instead of analogue. In terms of absolute color depth and dynamic range, digital is still far from film at a comparable format. The exposure latitude of film is just so good (especially for negatives... slide film is a bit more exacting). In terms of line resolution or high contrast resolving power, digital is getting there (at least with smaller formats). In larger formats (medium, and especially large formats), film (or plates) still dominate because of cost and the fact that these are used in applications when quality is preferred over convenience. The output is then fluid mounted and drum scanned, if a great digital output is desired.

Of course in the consumer sphere, digital cams have almost completely eclipsed chemical cams because of convenience. This is because you can see the output right away, there is no need for processing, you can change sensitivity on the fly, and there's one less consumable.

mmmmmm I remember when I'm still young Movie posters are done on manual painting Now a days, beacuse of high resolution camera, bigger posters are like real. I almost got an accident to Angel L posters at C5 overpass

[Stagea]

LOL, yup. It's so much easier to just print posters nowadays.

I remember people used to hang from ropes (or build a scaffolding) to paint the large billboards in front of SM North Edsa.

[av_phile1]

Just a thought from recent posts here:

An analogue system is an analogous representation of the real thing. Hence, the name.  Film is analogue because you have the image analogously captured by an chemical procedure that gets represented on a film  Same with music.  Sound is analogously captured by an electro-mechanical process represented by the grooves on a LP.  The entire reality is captured and its representation has similarities with the real thing.  That's is why the representation is analogous.   There is no encoding done.  

In contrast, digital is a quantized binary representation of the real thing.  So you have an image quantized into pixels each represented by a set of 0s and 1s.  Same with music.  The waveform is quantized into binaries.  The entire reality is captured but there's nothing in the representation of 0s and 1s to suggest the real thing, unless decoded.   In short, there's no analogous representation.

The reason why digital overtook film is simply the attainment of critical mass in economies of manufacturing. For virtually 90% of the market for photography, digital has achieved the same picture quality the masses can get from their point and shoot film cameras. That's enough.  The masses have no need to harness the full dynamic range of film because their camera's can't do it anyway.  Getting instant gratification from seeing the pictures you took is just icing on the cake.  Nobody cares about getting instant results if the results are crappy. That's why Polaroid failed to take off.  But it helped, including the fact that no other paid consumables are necessary.

For the 5% of the market, these are your professionals and enthusiasts who took a long time adapting digital simply because the best DLSR were still far from the best film-based SLRs.  It's really all about quality. But now, the pictures taken from the two are nearly indistinguishable. You only need to check out the glossy magazines and their photoshoots  have been done using digital. Even discovery and national geographic magz.  The advantage of film remains, but in terms of cost of production, any added advantage is just too incremental to be significant.    Here is where the value feature of convenience comes in and tilted the favor to digital.  Because with quality now on nearly equal terms, the no-film convenience of digital and instant gratification weighed in heavily.  

[Stagea]

Sorry, I was thinking more about analogue electronics where you work with a continuously variable / continuous range electric signal (such as a CCD). Digital electronics use discrete levels (frequently in two states, to represent the common binary data).

The market above small format (beyond the "full frame" size) is where chemical cams still dominate. People who shoot using medium and large formats are already inconvenienced with the lack of availability of camera parts/accessories, the physical bulk of these formats, and the overall cost to build a system based on these cams.

Thus the applications of these cams are typically limited to those with very high demands in terms of picture quality. At this level, I don't think they care so much about processing, mounting and scanning.

[Stagea]

I kind of don't agree that point and shoots can't take some of the advantages of film into the picture. It's just that most P&S users don't look (or care) for those differences.

For example: If a picture of a contrasty scene is taken (such as a bright sky against a mountain with sharp shadows), film will have enough dynamic range to reveal details in the sky (such as clouds and the blue hue) while showing the darkened features and flora in the shadows. Digital cams will typically show a sky washed in white, and shadows that are mostly black. Adjusting to get the sky or the shadows right will further sacrifice the other.

[shuttertrigger]

I find different enjoyment in Analog. Feels good to see the LP turning and listening to its music. But I enjoy both analog and digital. Same thing with photography, I always use my DLSR but sometimes, hinahanap ko pa rin mag shoot ng film. Iba pa rin kasi eh. Innovative change is not slowing down, it speeds up and we should be ready. But it is really good to back to analog once in a while...

[edgarryan]

Pag music, I prefer analog.  Pag video, mas ok sa akin ang digital.