Topic: The Religion Thread

[jas]

With regards to the Bible, I have to add that different people interpret it differently. Even within Christianity itself, different groups interpret, define and follow the Bible in dissimilar and even opposing ways. Ironically and unfortunately, I think this is also a cause for some to argue, fight and dispute.

[dpogs]

With regards to the Bible, I have to add that different people interpret it differently. Even within Christianity itself, different groups interpret, define and follow the Bible in dissimilar and even opposing ways. Ironically and unfortunately, I think this is also a cause for some to argue, fight and dispute.

even the Word of God can be twisted by Satan... God directly commanded adam and eve not to eat the fruit ... pero ano ang ginamit ng serpent to deceive adam and eve.. the Word of God mismo paano pa kaya ang Bible which is written Word of God...

malalaman mo naman ang fake christian religion
- any so called christian ekek na nagtuturo na ang salvation ay sa pamamagitan ng paggawa ng mabuti ay fake
- any professing christian na sinasamba mas binibigyan ng importansya ang mother kesa sa Son of God ay fake
- any professing christian na nagsasabing gumawa kayo ng mabuti para kayo'y maligtas ay fake
- any professing christian na nagsasabing magpabautismo kayo para maligtas ay fake
- any professing christian na nagsasabing gumawa lang ako ng mabuti ay maliligtas na ako ay fake
- any professing christian na nagsasabing pumatay kayo ng mga makasalanan ay fake
- any professing christian na nagsasabing ang aming apostol ang magliligtas sa inyo ay fake
- any professing christian na nagsasabing kailangan ko lang gumawa ng mabuti para maligtas ay fake

ang main topic ng Bible ay Jesus Christ, from alpha to omega, simula hanggant dulo - Jesus Christ

why would you tell your people na gawin mo ang isang bagay para maligtas eh sinabi na mismo ng Bible - Jesus the way, the truth, and the life... walang makakalapit sa Diyos Ama... maliban na lamang kung dadaan kay Jesus Christ...

people are desperate... people knows that at the end they will die... this is where false prophet false christianity will take advantage... bakit nila ituturo na si Jesus Christ ang tagapagligtas eh wala sila mapapakinabangan... kaya ang sasabihin nila... gumawa ka ng mabuti para ikay maligtas tapos yan na... madami nang mga listahan ano gagawin ng member para maligtas - mag abuloy, magbenta ng lupa tapos donate sa church, magsindi ng kandila araw araw (malaking business yan kandila - kaya pansin mo dami business sa labas ng simbahan), ibigay ang katawan para sa pagsanib ng ispiritu, pumatay ng mga hindi naniniwala sa paniniwala nila, sunugin ang mga heretics at kung ano ano pa...

bilang may pagmamalasakit - huwag kayong makikinig sa mga taong nagsasabi sila ang may tunay na paniniwala kung ang sasabihin nila sa iyo ay --- "GAWIN MO ang mga bagay na ito para ikaw ay maligtas"

but if that person always talk about Jesus Christ, how good and merciful is Jesus Christ, and in his/her life Jesus Christ is manifested, and acknowledge that he/she is sinner before God and can do nothing without Christ and talked about how Jesus Christ freed him/her from bondage of sins... then that person is true Christian based on his//her testimony about salvation and Jesus Christ..

[Nelson de Leon]

sorry but i do not subscribe to this crap.....

i believe that we were created perfect and inherently good.....
that we were just influenced by events and circumstances in our lives....

So as a creation of God, do you consider yourself perfect and good?

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[Nelson de Leon]

With regards to the Bible, I have to add that different people interpret it differently. Even within Christianity itself, different groups interpret, define and follow the Bible in dissimilar and even opposing ways. Ironically and unfortunately, I think this is also a cause for some to argue, fight and dispute.

You are correct sir. Kaya one of the ways to check if the interpretations are s correct is:

1. Does the interpretation aligned or not in conflict with the other parts or verses in the Bible

2. Does the interpretation glorify God?


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[Nelson de Leon]

May i suggest a different thread for Christianity AND the Bible is okay lang? Para we can address specific concerns?

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[jjjeronimo]

even the Word of God can be twisted by Satan... God directly commanded adam and eve not to eat the fruit ... pero ano ang ginamit ng serpent to deceive adam and eve.. the Word of God mismo paano pa kaya ang Bible which is written Word of God...

malalaman mo naman ang fake christian religion
- any so called christian ekek na nagtuturo na ang salvation ay sa pamamagitan ng paggawa ng mabuti ay fake
- any professing christian na sinasamba mas binibigyan ng importansya ang mother kesa sa Son of God ay fake
- any professing christian na nagsasabing gumawa kayo ng mabuti para kayo'y maligtas ay fake
- any professing christian na nagsasabing magpabautismo kayo para maligtas ay fake
- any professing christian na nagsasabing gumawa lang ako ng mabuti ay maliligtas na ako ay fake
- any professing christian na nagsasabing pumatay kayo ng mga makasalanan ay fake
- any professing christian na nagsasabing ang aming apostol ang magliligtas sa inyo ay fake
- any professing christian na nagsasabing kailangan ko lang gumawa ng mabuti para maligtas ay fake

ang main topic ng Bible ay Jesus Christ, from alpha to omega, simula hanggant dulo - Jesus Christ

why would you tell your people na gawin mo ang isang bagay para maligtas eh sinabi na mismo ng Bible - Jesus the way, the truth, and the life... walang makakalapit sa Diyos Ama... maliban na lamang kung dadaan kay Jesus Christ...

people are desperate... people knows that at the end they will die... this is where false prophet false christianity will take advantage... bakit nila ituturo na si Jesus Christ ang tagapagligtas eh wala sila mapapakinabangan... kaya ang sasabihin nila... gumawa ka ng mabuti para ikay maligtas tapos yan na... madami nang mga listahan ano gagawin ng member para maligtas - mag abuloy, magbenta ng lupa tapos donate sa church, magsindi ng kandila araw araw (malaking business yan kandila - kaya pansin mo dami business sa labas ng simbahan), ibigay ang katawan para sa pagsanib ng ispiritu, pumatay ng mga hindi naniniwala sa paniniwala nila, sunugin ang mga heretics at kung ano ano pa...

bilang may pagmamalasakit - huwag kayong makikinig sa mga taong nagsasabi sila ang may tunay na paniniwala kung ang sasabihin nila sa iyo ay --- "GAWIN MO ang mga bagay na ito para ikaw ay maligtas"

but if that person always talk about Jesus Christ, how good and merciful is Jesus Christ, and in his/her life Jesus Christ is manifested, and acknowledge that he/she is sinner before God and can do nothing without Christ and talked about how Jesus Christ freed him/her from bondage of sins... then that person is true Christian based on his//her testimony about salvation and Jesus Christ..

No offense, I admire your faith in what you believe in, but itong ganitong mindset na "my belief is absolutely true while you are absolutely wrong" is exactly the reason why we do not have peace on Earth.

[dpogs]

No offense, I admire your faith in what you believe in, but itong ganitong mindset na "my belief is absolutely true while you are absolutely wrong" is exactly the reason why we do not have peace on Earth.

its what the Bible says... the Bible says salvation is only through Jesus Christ... the reason why we dont have peace is basically because of that... people dont believe that Jesus alone can save ... and people with ulterior motive will take advantage of this...

bakit mo sasabihin sa isang tao na para maligtas ay kailangan nyang gumawa ng mabuti? (take note... ang mabuti sa atin ay maaring masama sa iba)

para sa mga extremist... to kill heretics considered doing goods... to kill those who oppose in their belief considered doing good... dyan pumapasok bakit walang peace sa ating bansa... Satan is very successfull deceiving people, crating chaos, creating war, conflicts... to sway people for what is the Bible teaching - Jesus alone can save....

the cause of fall = pride
satan rebel against God becuase of pride - Lucifer assumes that he is better than God
adam and eve decieve by Satan because of pride - i can be God if eat that fruit... i will obtain the knowledge and be like God
human fall because of pride - we cant accept that we are inherently sinner, we think that we are good enough to approach God, we think that by doing certain things we dont need God.. i can obtain nirvana why believe in Christ... kung ako hindi magnanakaw siguro patatawarin ako ng Diyos = pride... di naman ako kasingsama ng mga rapist/murder bakit ako parurusahan ng Diyos = pride
human pride = hindi natin matanggap tanggap na we are in fault of everything

alam naman natin... maraming false prophets... maraming false religion sa ngayon... hanap lang pera, power, lust, etc... i give you parameter paano masasabing bulaan ang isang taong nagsasabing christianity based on the Bible alone... ang mga bulaang propeta/religion ay mga taong nagsasabing christian sila pero Jesus Christ is not the center of their salvation.


the main reason why there is no peace on Earth - human mind and soul is corrupted since adam and eve fall... Satan is the prince of this world... the current ruler of this world... Satan create chaos/war/hatred to deter human from the truth - Jesus alone is the Salvation

pag merong kumatok sa inyong pintuan at ang ituturo sa inyo ay kailangan nyong umanib sa amin para kayo'y maligtas - dont entertain them bakit ka nila irerequire na sumanib sa kanila para maligtas?
pag merong kumatok sa inyong pintuan at ang ituturo sa inyo ay kailangan mong magbigay ng pera/offerring para kayoý maligtas - dont entertain them bakit invovle ang pera?

when it comes to Christianity the Bible is the absolute truth - walang ibang itinuturo ang Bibliya kungdi God's perfect plan for salvation - Jesus Christ alone

[jjjeronimo]

the thing is, probably more than half of the population on the planet is of a different religion.  And probably more than one half of Christianity is not of the same denomination as you.  And many of those people also believe that they are already part of the "one true religion".  Other than the numerous Christian sects, you have Muslims, Buddhists, Jews, etc.  Sabihan mo sila in absolute terms na yung sekta niyo lang ang ma-save and you have the recipe for a religious confrontation.

I have no intentions of going into a religious debate here.  Just laying down the facts.  Million na ang namatay dahil diyan sa conflict ng  paniniwala.

[Own7]

its what the Bible says... the Bible says salvation is only through Jesus Christ... the reason why we dont have peace is basically because of that... people dont believe that Jesus alone can save ... and people with ulterior motive will take advantage of this...

bakit mo sasabihin sa isang tao na para maligtas ay kailangan nyang gumawa ng mabuti? (take note... ang mabuti sa atin ay maaring masama sa iba)

para sa mga extremist... to kill heretics considered doing goods... to kill those who oppose in their belief considered doing good... dyan pumapasok bakit walang peace sa ating bansa... Satan is very successfull deceiving people, crating chaos, creating war, conflicts... to sway people for what is the Bible teaching - Jesus alone can save....

the cause of fall = pride
satan rebel against God becuase of pride - Lucifer assumes that he is better than God
adam and eve decieve by Satan because of pride - i can be God if eat that fruit... i will obtain the knowledge and be like God
human fall because of pride - we cant accept that we are inherently sinner, we think that we are good enough to approach God, we think that by doing certain things we dont need God.. i can obtain nirvana why believe in Christ... kung ako hindi magnanakaw siguro patatawarin ako ng Diyos = pride... di naman ako kasingsama ng mga rapist/murder bakit ako parurusahan ng Diyos = pride
human pride = hindi natin matanggap tanggap na we are in fault of everything

alam naman natin... maraming false prophets... maraming false religion sa ngayon... hanap lang pera, power, lust, etc... i give you parameter paano masasabing bulaan ang isang taong nagsasabing christianity based on the Bible alone... ang mga bulaang propeta/religion ay mga taong nagsasabing christian sila pero Jesus Christ is not the center of their salvation.


the main reason why there is no peace on Earth - human mind and soul is corrupted since adam and eve fall... Satan is the prince of this world... the current ruler of this world... Satan create chaos/war/hatred to deter human from the truth - Jesus alone is the Salvation

pag merong kumatok sa inyong pintuan at ang ituturo sa inyo ay kailangan nyong umanib sa amin para kayo'y maligtas - dont entertain them bakit ka nila irerequire na sumanib sa kanila para maligtas?
pag merong kumatok sa inyong pintuan at ang ituturo sa inyo ay kailangan mong magbigay ng pera/offerring para kayoý maligtas - dont entertain them bakit invovle ang pera?

when it comes to Christianity the Bible is the absolute truth - walang ibang itinuturo ang Bibliya kungdi God's perfect plan for salvation - Jesus Christ alone

Why use “extremist” to assert your point regarding “what’s right or wrong?”
They dont believe in the bible, in fact, if you ask them the bible itself is
What’s causing the chaos since it’s their main belief it was written by mortals
Instead of god. To them kuran is the only book written by god.

I pointed it out because if you talk about “right and wrong”, then use those
Who subricribe to the bible as basis. meaning, christians point of view. It is
Only then each of us can have a clearer view of right and wrong.


Fyi, parang sinabi mo na hindi baleng hindi ka mabuting tao basta acknowledge/
Believe/accept mo na christ is the savior? And you’re  good to go?

[dpogs]

Why use “extremist” to assert your point regarding “what’s right or wrong?”
They dont believe in the bible, in fact, if you ask them the bible itself is
What’s causing the chaos since it’s their main belief it was written by mortals
Instead of god. To them kuran is the only book written by god.

exteremist doest only belong to other religion... merong mga so called christian sec that so extrem na outside of their religion they are willing to kill in exchange of their soul salvation.
pwede din nating masabi na... any religion that will require you to do "good" to obtain salvation ay malaking warning na para masabing isa sila sa mga nacreate na religion to create chaos and confusion sa mundo... goind good is subjective depende sa tradition at environment na kinabibilangan...

I pointed it out because if you talk about “right and wrong”, then use those
Who subricribe to the bible as basis. meaning, christians point of view. It is
Only then each of us can have a clearer view of right and wrong.


Fyi, parang sinabi mo na hindi baleng hindi ka mabuting tao basta acknowledge/
Believe/accept mo na christ is the savior? And you’re  good to go?

When it comes to salvation you dont have anything to do... on the premise that we are all sinners... regardless how good we are in the eyes of human... in the eyes of God we are all sinners...
It is written in the Word of God that no one cometh to the Father except thru Jesus Christ

to answer your question... YES... in the first place wala naman talanga mabuting tao sa mata ng Diyos ... and if you have (take note) true repentance and acceptance of Jesus Christ as Savior the Sprit of God will manifest in your life as you progress in your life with Jesus Christ... as you grow in faith you also grow in "works" meaning GOd's righteousness will naturally manifest in your life and sorroundings.

Remember the two criminals besides Jesus Christ crucification... the one said... "If thou be Christ, save thyself and us." <his only concern is physical salvation - maalis sila sa pagkakapako>  but the other one said... 

"Dost not thou fear God, seeing thou art in the same condemnation? And we indeed justly; for we receive the due reward of our deeds: but this man hath done nothing amiss." <this is the acknowledgement that truly they deserved great punishment. he acknowledge that he is sinner> and then the next sentence of the other criminal is

"Lord, remember me when thou comest into thy kingdom." <this he acknowledge that he needed a saviour. and believe that Jesus will brim him to Kingdom/heaven. this is spiritual salvation his concern is his soul>

please take note what Jesus said to the criminal "Verily I say unto thee, To day shalt thou be with me in paradise." --- Jesus never mentioned are you good enough? Jesus never ask the criminal - what good things did you do here on earth? or Jesus never said "before you go with me to kingdom you need to follow ten commandement"... when Jesus saw the mans'repentance and belief on Him from that moment... Jesus forgave and assured him of kingdom that is what we called assurance of salvation... once God forgave you of your sins God will never remember your sins anymore past, present and future... because God never see you as sinner anyomre... what God saw in your heart is Jesus Christ... kaya hindi totoo iyong sinasabi ng iba na kami lang ang makakapunta sa langit kasi kami lang ang mabuti, di kami nagnanakaw, wala kamig galit sa kapwa kaya kami lang aakyat sa langit... the Bible ssaid only the "righteous" can go to heaven... pero sino itong mga righteous - those who acknoledge that they are sinner before God and thus need a savior and then accepted Jesus Christ as their Lord and Personal savior only then can God change their status from sinner to righteous..

that is the standard set by God... Jesus Christ alone... in God's standrd you only need to aknowledge youré a sinner and indeed need a savior and then believe and have faith that Jesus died on the cross raise from the dead after three days and now is in heaven as your Lord and persoanl savioir...

[tony]

that is the standard set by God... Jesus Christ alone... in God's standrd you only need to aknowledge youré a sinner and indeed need a savior and then believe and have faith that Jesus died on the cross raise from the dead after three days and now is in heaven as your Lord and persoanl savioir...

remember there are billions of people belonging to other religions, Buddists, Islamist, Cunfucionists, etc. etc.... so they do not matter at all???

[deuce]

And what about all the people on earth who lived and died before the birth of Christ? It was impossible for them to embrace Christ as Savior, simply because He was not born yet. So did they all go to hell?

[noob]

pink floyd: 

“So, so you think you can tell
Heaven from hell?”

[dpogs]

Abel and Cain

way beyond humanity - makikita natin how Satan create chaos and human's heart corruptred heart disobedient to God... God requires blood sacrifice for our sins atonement... the ultimate sacrifice sinless, pure, perfect blood = Jesus Christ blood... by faith Abel sacrifice lamb - symbolized blood sacrifice = God's perfect plan of salvation = JEsus Christ but Cain choose other sacrifice = human effort (dito pa lang meron nang hindi pagkakasundo ) na nagresulta sa pagkamatay ni Abel ...

God promise adam and eve that there will be first born who will crash Satan and adam and eve believe God kaya sinuutan ng Diyos si adam and eve ng sheepskin ... (remember after adam and eve fall they clothed themselves leaves and twigs - this is humans effort to obtain salvation)... kaya ng sinuutan ng Diyos ng sheep skin is adam and eve theres blood sacrifice... by faith they follow God...

throughout old testament ... the topic of salvation is Jesus Christ... blood sacrifice... altar of sacrifice... lamb sacrifice (lamb - symbolize pure, sinless)... to be able to escapre the angel of death (killing all firstborn) you need to put lamb blood and the angel of death will pass over you...

And what about all the people on earth who lived and died before the birth of Christ? It was impossible for them to embrace Christ as Savior, simply because He was not born yet. So did they all go to hell?

remember there are billions of people belonging to other religions, Buddists, Islamist, Cunfucionists, etc. etc.... so they do not matter at all???

Romans 1:17-23
For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith. For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness; Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them. For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse: Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened. Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools, And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things.

[dpogs]

pink floyd: 

“So, so you think you can tell
Heaven from hell?”

We have the Bible as the guide... mas lalo na ngayon... kung saan ang information ay readily available... wala talaga excuse ang tao.

[deuce]

dpogs, you did not answer my question. If salvation is only possible through Jesus Christ, what about all the people on earth who lived and died before the birth of Christ? It was impossible for them to embrace Christ as Savior, simply because He was not born yet. So were they all consigned to hell?

[TinkerTailor]

If the literal interpretation is that Jesus is the only way then you're out of luck if you were born into another faith.

Here's my comment re the same matter in a friends FB post about religion:

Religion is oftentimes just conceit sir.... What else can you call the belief that others are damned while you are saved- and this because those deemed to be destined for eternal suffering happen to have been born to a people who have as many gods as there are creatures or born to a race who consider the forces of nature worthy of worship.
No logic at all to the exclusive ideas of salvation sir. Worse, it breeds nothing but strife.

[dpogs]

dpogs, you did not answer my question. If salvation is only possible through Jesus Christ, what about all the people on earth who lived and died before the birth of Christ? It was impossible for them to embrace Christ as Savior, simply because He was not born yet. So were they all consigned to hell?

Roman 1:17-23 - salvation still the same its thru Jesus Christ by faith... God revealed His perfect plan of salvation to Adam and Eve - and it is evident kung paano nila itinuro ito kay Abel and Cain... from them to please God there must be blood sacrifice (symbolize the coming sacrifice of Jesus Christ)... and by faith Abel belived and nagsacrifice sya ng firstbone of his flock (blood sacrifice) and offer it to God... and those who didnt believe and have been decieved by Satan... the Bible said that God revelation is evident in His creation... "For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith. For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness; Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them. For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse: "

but because of human's heart was corrupted God's revelation to them about salvation they exchange the revalation to image of animals, creeping things, etc .. and if through God's revelation thay realized that they are sinners and indeed need of saviour and believe that God will save them (na walang kapalit na gagawin)... our heart is just too corrupted that God's reveliation though creation ay hindi natin maintindihan though deep in our heart my longing pero our mind twisted it kaya nagkakaroon ng mga santo, anito, or other forms of gods.... well sa tulong na din ni Satan kaya nagkaroon ng madaming religion

[deuce]

This is all very well for the ancient Israelites, who knew about Adam, Eve, Cain, Abel, Abraham. But what about the ancient Sumerians, or the people of the Zhou dynasty, who never heard of them?

This is my beef in your belief: that it reserves salvation to a very narrow segment of humanity, and excludes millions who, through no fault of their own, never even heard of christianity, especially before the birth of Christ and the publication of the bible.

[dpogs]

"For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness; Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them. For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:.."


God's judgement and mecy have been revealed to all human (both righteous and unrighteous)... but then they turn God's revelation to their own interpratation

"And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things."

for example sumerian - they believed in many kins of gods... their belief either have been passed thru generation back to adam and eve but then got corrupted along the way... or they recieved God's revelation but because of Satan's deceivesenes or human's heart corrupt then they turnéd God's image to other kind of gods... ang isang tao na ipinangaak ng walang religion or walang nakamulatang belief... will eventually realize just by observing his/her environment that there is a greater power behind all of these things... deep in their heart God is knocking... revealing His wrath and mercy... and its up to them whether by faith they will believed that that greater power existing will save them...

we dont have any excuse.. lalo na sa atin dito sa Pilipinas

now that you've heard the Gospel... God's judgement and mercy... and God's pefect salvation... ngayon at narinig mo nat nabasa... ano ang iyong magiging hakbang?

will you humble yourself before God and accept that you're a sinner and not worthy of God's mercy? Will you have faith that Jesus alone can atone your sins and forgive all of your sins?

[tony]

Jesus was a man for others, that is the standard by which i asses a self proclaimed Christians....

to me a  true Christian will never tolerate corruption, stealing and kiliing....

[jjjeronimo]

This is why we have wars...

Religion is not the problem per se.  Rather, it is the intolerance of the (so-called) religious...