Author Topic: Iglesia Ni Cristo - 100years of God's blessings  (Read 213098 times)

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Offline panzimus

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Re: Iglesia Ni Cristo - 100years of God's blessings
« Reply #840 on: Sep 03, 2015 at 09:57 PM »
bakit parang nalilimitahan nag freedom ng tao sa INC?

Offline ABCmotorparts

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Re: Iglesia Ni Cristo - 100years of God's blessings
« Reply #841 on: Sep 03, 2015 at 11:01 PM »
My past GF was an INC, hindi kami nagkatuluyan kasi sabi ni ex dati ay pati daw pamilya nya ay matitiwalag pag sumama sya sa akin...

Sorry ha, pero isang malaking kulto na pinamumunuan ng isang nagsasabing sya ay sugo ng ama ang grupo na ito...

Na lumawak ng todo ang kapangyarihan...

Offline raptor

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Re: Iglesia Ni Cristo - 100years of God's blessings
« Reply #842 on: Sep 04, 2015 at 02:18 AM »
My past GF was an INC, hindi kami nagkatuluyan kasi sabi ni ex dati ay pati daw pamilya nya ay matitiwalag pag sumama sya sa akin...

Sorry ha, pero isang malaking kulto na pinamumunuan ng isang nagsasabing sya ay sugo ng ama ang grupo na ito...

Na lumawak ng todo ang kapangyarihan...

kulto talaga, may private army pa at grupo ng hired killers
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Offline ninjababez®

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Re: Iglesia Ni Cristo - 100years of God's blessings
« Reply #843 on: Sep 04, 2015 at 07:45 AM »
I wonder about those that are recently engaged na isang Iglesia and the other is from another faith.  After this display by the Iglesia faithful, may mga kasalan kaya na di matutuloy because ayaw na magpa convert nung isa?
IMO bro mas madali pa para sa isang believer mag pa convert.  same thing happened to my friend, devoted RC magulang nya at sya pero di naman sya nahirapan mag adjust kasi nga naman, god is god daw.  mas kawawa atheist sa ganyan.
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Offline praktikal

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Re: Iglesia Ni Cristo - 100years of God's blessings
« Reply #844 on: Sep 04, 2015 at 08:40 AM »
kulto talaga, may private army pa at grupo ng hired killers

ganyang ganyan din ang matagal ko ng naririnig. kesyo takot kumontra o kumalas kasi baka mapahamak ang buhay. no choice sila. andun yung uneasy sila esp pag pinuntahan na sa bahay. kung totoo man yan aba'y nasaan ang freedom ng tao?

naalala ko tuloy ang tungkol kay binay na dati sa sabi sabi ko lang narinig ang mga kwento tungkol sa mga condo units, bahay at iba pang raket. ngayon isiniwalat na sa media at may pruweba pa.

anyways, yung four way test ng rotary is good enough para i-remind ang tao paano mamuhay ng maayos.

Offline pao9307

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Re: Iglesia Ni Cristo - 100years of God's blessings
« Reply #845 on: Sep 04, 2015 at 08:58 AM »
All these flies in the face of what I personally think is one of Christ's greatest gifts to mankind,free will.

Offline Cruzader1986

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Re: Iglesia Ni Cristo - 100years of God's blessings
« Reply #846 on: Sep 04, 2015 at 09:22 AM »
My past GF was an INC, hindi kami nagkatuluyan kasi sabi ni ex dati ay pati daw pamilya nya ay matitiwalag pag sumama sya sa akin...

Sorry ha, pero isang malaking kulto na pinamumunuan ng isang nagsasabing sya ay sugo ng ama ang grupo na ito...

Na lumawak ng todo ang kapangyarihan...

buti na lang di natipuan ng manyakis na ministro ex mo. Ex ng kaibigan ko, gf nya ay natipuan ng matanda na ministro (mga 50s), mid-20s pa yung dalaga.
3 choices binigay

1) Pakasal sa pangit at matandang ministro
2) Pakasal kaagad sa ibang INC member (poblema di INC kaibigan ko rin)
3) Umalis sa INC (meaning pati pamilya papaalisin)

Offline Quitacet

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Re: Iglesia Ni Cristo - 100years of God's blessings
« Reply #847 on: Sep 04, 2015 at 09:32 AM »
On pag-ayaw sa INC: Anyone can leave anytime. You can either make a written statement so the Church and the local officials will not be blamed later if your name is removed from the roster of members, or you can just absent yourselves from church activities especially worship services but this will be the long process to take since you will be visited by local officials to advise you. If you say "ayaw mo na", they will advise you still to make a written statement if talagang ayaw mo na. There are reasons kasi na failure to attend worship services are due to problems like unemployment wherein in most cases the officers and the church will help you look for employment.

On a member marrying a non-member: The INC follows the OT and NT on inter-faith marriages that's why same faith marriage is the only on allowed. OT talks about Israelites being forbidden to marry non-Israelites because of the issue of having different faiths (worshipping other Gods). Books Exodus, Deuteronomy, Ezra, Nehemias and Malachi talk about these. Of course made an exemption to this when he married a non-Israelite but it is an exemption rather than the rule.

In the NT, 1 and 2 Corinthians briefly talks about this as well. Of course one may argue NOW that since a Catholic and an INC are both Christians, then there's no problem since the Bible talks about Christians and Pagans inter-faith marriage not Sect and a different sect. We have to realize that there are no different sects then and only one group of faithfuls. Today different Christian sects espouse different set of beliefs thus the INC applying the inter-faith marriage towards INC and other religions (regardless of Christianity-affiliation)

My question to Catholics is this: Does the Catholic Church approve of and allow, say an INC man (born into INC and have not received Catholic baptism) to marry in Catholic Church and a Catholic woman without requiring the INC to receive Catholic baptism first, therefore receiving and espousing Catholic faith thus receiving membership in the Catholic Church? If your answer is NO, then I rest my case. If the man needs to be baptized into Catholicism first, then what is the difference in the principle between INC and RC?

While I understand that expulsion and excommunication is not practised now by RC, it does not mean it is not part of its dogma.

I understand that a lot of INC teaching and practices seem a bit odd for many people outside looking into the organization. This is one of the reasons why there are a lot of misconceptions about the church. I do not blame people for talking bad about the Church especially after what just recently happened. The Church is not perfect insofar as it is governed by imperfect men.

But in order to understand it, one do not simply study it in the Internet fora or social media.

People say the Church is only about membership so it can generate a lot of tithes, etc. The irony is, if one say Catholic approach us and say I want to join your Church, he needs to listen to doctrines first, then have to attend worship services and meetings for about six months (without absences except for unavoidable reasons), then afterwards, he will be tested/examined via an interview if he truly knows the doctrines, and then he will be asked to sign a non-compulsion statement that he is joining the Church not for any other reason but because he believes and has faith in its doctrines. Tithing is forbidden in INC yet many people believes we practice them. Some people ridicule us by not eating blood not realizing it is biblical. In fact many say members are forbidden to own bibles (not true) but it is them who do not know that blood-eating is forbidden in the bible as it is not considered food and it symbolizes the life and the life that Jesus gave for man's redemption.

If we only care about numbers why go to that long tedious process, and statistics will show a high percentage of those who undergo these processes can not withstand the rigors of it, and then they stop. What I am driving at is that membership in the Church (like any other organization) is propelled by faith in its doctrines and rules. If you do not agree with the teachings, then do not join it.

On bloc-voting: This is probably the most difficult part of the doctrine to explain to non-members. Bloc-voting is not the center and end of the Unity doctrine of the Church. Like any other Church, the INC holds the unity doctrine but to a different extent compared to many. The INC is united in everything, yes including voting. Let me use an example an analogy of how this works. (Disclaimer, I will be exaggerating) Say you join an organization, sabihin na nating pdvd, and there is this one senator saying okay, let's legalize piracy since we cannot stop it here in the Phils. the PDVD community decided to make a stand and decided we will not support this candidate but instead we will support his opponent who is against this senator. As a group we support one and we despise the other. but come voting time, you are alone in the precinct. you can vote for anyone you want to. This is the same with the INC, we do not report back who we voted for. they do not audit us. Yes we are united. but we are individuals too. in the pdvd example if after voting ricky posted here, sorry guys, i voted for Senator Pirated. He will not be banned here but I am sure he will get the ire of some other members. Because pdvd policy do not have an expulsion policy for that. But it has an expulsion policy for certain acts. If you are against it, then don't join pdvd. In INC if you say after voting, i did not vote for Pnoy. You may be expelled because INC has a policy on this. You don't like this policy? Do not join. You are willing to accept this policy? You may join subject to procedures.

My point is this, I understand you don't like some doctrines of the INC and that's why you did not join it. And yes, you may attack them. But I am inviting everyone before anyone makes a complete opinion on the subject (INC), why not study it closer. LIsten to its teachings. There are no strings attached.

Thank you to those who understand and thank you also to those who criticize. We may have different beliefs that lead us sometimes to disrespect the beliefs, but my belief is that I can still respect you as persons though I may not share your beliefs.

Thanks.
« Last Edit: Sep 04, 2015 at 09:35 AM by Quitacet »

Offline Quitacet

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Re: Iglesia Ni Cristo - 100years of God's blessings
« Reply #848 on: Sep 04, 2015 at 09:34 AM »
buti na lang di natipuan ng manyakis na ministro ex mo. Ex ng kaibigan ko, gf nya ay natipuan ng matanda na ministro (mga 50s), mid-20s pa yung dalaga.
3 choices binigay

1) Pakasal sa pangit at matandang ministro
2) Pakasal kaagad sa ibang INC member (poblema di INC kaibigan ko rin)
3) Umalis sa INC (meaning pati pamilya papaalisin)


Sorry to say but this is not biblical if this is indeed true. The remedy to this is very simple. SAY NO!

My wife was courted by a minister before we got married. she simply said NO. that was the end of it.


Offline Servus

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Re: Iglesia Ni Cristo - 100years of God's blessings
« Reply #849 on: Sep 04, 2015 at 10:13 AM »
On pag-ayaw sa INC: Anyone can leave anytime. You can either make a written statement so the Church and the local officials will not be blamed later if your name is removed from the roster of members, or you can just absent yourselves from church activities especially worship services but this will be the long process to take since you will be visited by local officials to advise you. If you say "ayaw mo na", they will advise you still to make a written statement if talagang ayaw mo na. There are reasons kasi na failure to attend worship services are due to problems like unemployment wherein in most cases the officers and the church will help you look for employment.

long process pa rin yan they will still try to bother you baka sakaling "magising ka pa". if you want an easy way out ng walang paliwanagan, kumuha ka ng transfer then ilagay mo malayong lokal na tatransfer-an, tapos tapon mo na yong transfer paper mo. i did it 8 years ago and very effective. parents ko lang yong nagtry na kumausap sa akin.

Offline Quitacet

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Re: Iglesia Ni Cristo - 100years of God's blessings
« Reply #850 on: Sep 04, 2015 at 10:16 AM »
long process pa rin yan they will still try to bother you baka sakaling "magising ka pa". if you want an easy way out ng walang paliwanagan, kumuha ka ng transfer then ilagay mo malayong lokal na tatransfer-an, tapos tapon mo na yong transfer paper mo. i did it 8 years ago and very effective. parents ko lang yong nagtry na kumausap sa akin.


pwede din to.

Offline kidlat08

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Re: Iglesia Ni Cristo - 100years of God's blessings
« Reply #851 on: Sep 04, 2015 at 10:51 AM »
On pag-ayaw sa INC: Anyone can leave anytime. You can either make a written statement so the Church and the local officials will not be blamed later if your name is removed from the roster of members, or you can just absent yourselves from church activities especially worship services but this will be the long process to take since you will be visited by local officials to advise you. If you say "ayaw mo na", they will advise you still to make a written statement if talagang ayaw mo na. There are reasons kasi na failure to attend worship services are due to problems like unemployment wherein in most cases the officers and the church will help you look for employment.

On a member marrying a non-member: The INC follows the OT and NT on inter-faith marriages that's why same faith marriage is the only on allowed. OT talks about Israelites being forbidden to marry non-Israelites because of the issue of having different faiths (worshipping other Gods). Books Exodus, Deuteronomy, Ezra, Nehemias and Malachi talk about these. Of course made an exemption to this when he married a non-Israelite but it is an exemption rather than the rule.

In the NT, 1 and 2 Corinthians briefly talks about this as well. Of course one may argue NOW that since a Catholic and an INC are both Christians, then there's no problem since the Bible talks about Christians and Pagans inter-faith marriage not Sect and a different sect. We have to realize that there are no different sects then and only one group of faithfuls. Today different Christian sects espouse different set of beliefs thus the INC applying the inter-faith marriage towards INC and other religions (regardless of Christianity-affiliation)

My question to Catholics is this: Does the Catholic Church approve of and allow, say an INC man (born into INC and have not received Catholic baptism) to marry in Catholic Church and a Catholic woman without requiring the INC to receive Catholic baptism first, therefore receiving and espousing Catholic faith thus receiving membership in the Catholic Church? If your answer is NO, then I rest my case. If the man needs to be baptized into Catholicism first, then what is the difference in the principle between INC and RC?

While I understand that expulsion and excommunication is not practised now by RC, it does not mean it is not part of its dogma.

I understand that a lot of INC teaching and practices seem a bit odd for many people outside looking into the organization. This is one of the reasons why there are a lot of misconceptions about the church. I do not blame people for talking bad about the Church especially after what just recently happened. The Church is not perfect insofar as it is governed by imperfect men.

But in order to understand it, one do not simply study it in the Internet fora or social media.

People say the Church is only about membership so it can generate a lot of tithes, etc. The irony is, if one say Catholic approach us and say I want to join your Church, he needs to listen to doctrines first, then have to attend worship services and meetings for about six months (without absences except for unavoidable reasons), then afterwards, he will be tested/examined via an interview if he truly knows the doctrines, and then he will be asked to sign a non-compulsion statement that he is joining the Church not for any other reason but because he believes and has faith in its doctrines. Tithing is forbidden in INC yet many people believes we practice them. Some people ridicule us by not eating blood not realizing it is biblical. In fact many say members are forbidden to own bibles (not true) but it is them who do not know that blood-eating is forbidden in the bible as it is not considered food and it symbolizes the life and the life that Jesus gave for man's redemption.

If we only care about numbers why go to that long tedious process, and statistics will show a high percentage of those who undergo these processes can not withstand the rigors of it, and then they stop. What I am driving at is that membership in the Church (like any other organization) is propelled by faith in its doctrines and rules. If you do not agree with the teachings, then do not join it.

On bloc-voting: This is probably the most difficult part of the doctrine to explain to non-members. Bloc-voting is not the center and end of the Unity doctrine of the Church. Like any other Church, the INC holds the unity doctrine but to a different extent compared to many. The INC is united in everything, yes including voting. Let me use an example an analogy of how this works. (Disclaimer, I will be exaggerating) Say you join an organization, sabihin na nating pdvd, and there is this one senator saying okay, let's legalize piracy since we cannot stop it here in the Phils. the PDVD community decided to make a stand and decided we will not support this candidate but instead we will support his opponent who is against this senator. As a group we support one and we despise the other. but come voting time, you are alone in the precinct. you can vote for anyone you want to. This is the same with the INC, we do not report back who we voted for. they do not audit us. Yes we are united. but we are individuals too. in the pdvd example if after voting ricky posted here, sorry guys, i voted for Senator Pirated. He will not be banned here but I am sure he will get the ire of some other members. Because pdvd policy do not have an expulsion policy for that. But it has an expulsion policy for certain acts. If you are against it, then don't join pdvd. In INC if you say after voting, i did not vote for Pnoy. You may be expelled because INC has a policy on this. You don't like this policy? Do not join. You are willing to accept this policy? You may join subject to procedures.

My point is this, I understand you don't like some doctrines of the INC and that's why you did not join it. And yes, you may attack them. But I am inviting everyone before anyone makes a complete opinion on the subject (INC), why not study it closer. LIsten to its teachings. There are no strings attached.

Thank you to those who understand and thank you also to those who criticize. We may have different beliefs that lead us sometimes to disrespect the beliefs, but my belief is that I can still respect you as persons though I may not share your beliefs.

Thanks.

As a fellow INC member, you said what's exactly in my mind. Thanks sir Quitacet.

Offline SiCkBoY

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Re: Iglesia Ni Cristo - 100years of God's blessings
« Reply #852 on: Sep 04, 2015 at 10:53 AM »
IMO bro mas madali pa para sa isang believer mag pa convert.  same thing happened to my friend, devoted RC magulang nya at sya pero di naman sya nahirapan mag adjust kasi nga naman, god is god daw.  mas kawawa atheist sa ganyan.


I think I would have to disagree.  While it is true that both are of the same belief that there is only one God and that God is God, para sa akin na isang Catholic, mahirap tanggapin na yun mga kasapi lang sa faith ko ang pupunta sa langit.  I was raised to view God as a loving God, regardless of race, creed, faith, religion, etc.

Will I be able to love a God that only favors the Catholics for instance?  I don't think so.  Mahirap yun.  God is God.  Wala sya dapat vested interest in any of these.
« Last Edit: Sep 04, 2015 at 10:54 AM by SiCkBoY »

Offline tony

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Re: Iglesia Ni Cristo - 100years of God's blessings
« Reply #853 on: Sep 04, 2015 at 11:04 AM »
I think I would have to disagree.  While it is true that both are of the same belief that there is only one God and that God is God, para sa akin na isang Catholic, mahirap tanggapin na yun mga kasapi lang sa faith ko ang pupunta sa langit.  I was raised to view God as a loving God, regardless of race, creed, faith, religion, etc.

Will I be able to love a God that only favors the Catholics for instance?  I don't think so.  Mahirap yun.  God is God.  Wala sya dapat vested interest in any of these.

amen to this....
Jesus asks us to love one another as we love Him....no ifs and buts about this....
so that if you hurt your fellow man in any manner, then you really are not loving Jesus...
no two ways about this...
how do we defend our freedom? by the truth when it is assaulted by Marcos lies....

Offline Nelson de Leon

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Re: Iglesia Ni Cristo - 100years of God's blessings
« Reply #854 on: Sep 04, 2015 at 11:09 AM »
amen to this....
Jesus asks us to love one another as we love Him....no ifs and buts about this....
so that if you hurt your fellow man in any manner, then you really are not loving Jesus...
no two ways about this...

Love your enemies pa nga di ba?

Offline tony

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Re: Iglesia Ni Cristo - 100years of God's blessings
« Reply #855 on: Sep 04, 2015 at 11:17 AM »
Love your enemies pa nga di ba?

agape....

"when a roman soldier slaps you on the left cheek, give him the right cheek...
if he asks you to carry a load for him a kilometer, carry it another kilometer...."

"when someone gives you bread, will you repay it with stones?"

we were brought up with these teachings....

but today we see preachers telling members, "siksik, liglig at umaapaw" na yaman....
magbigay ka lang ng ikapu....

ang nangyari sa mga members na sanggunian ng Iglesia, hindi pa nga inaabutan ng sampal,
ng pre-emptive strike na....kahit labag sa mga turo nila ang pagsali sa strikes at rallies....
how do we defend our freedom? by the truth when it is assaulted by Marcos lies....

Offline dpogs

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Re: Iglesia Ni Cristo - 100years of God's blessings
« Reply #856 on: Sep 04, 2015 at 11:22 AM »
Gaya nga ng sinabi ko dati pa sa kabilang thread: ang palatandaan na ang isang simbahan ay bulaan kung ang doktrina nila ay nagsasabing "maliligtas lamang ang kaanib ng aming iglesia/simbahan"... Eh kung ikaw naniwala na sa ganyan at naisapuso mo na ang ganyang turo aba eh gagawin mo lahat di ka lang matiwalag.

Sana naman hindi ganito ang turo ng INC.
There is none righteous, no not one.

Offline Quitacet

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Re: Iglesia Ni Cristo - 100years of God's blessings
« Reply #857 on: Sep 04, 2015 at 11:31 AM »
I think I would have to disagree.  While it is true that both are of the same belief that there is only one God and that God is God, para sa akin na isang Catholic, mahirap tanggapin na yun mga kasapi lang sa faith ko ang pupunta sa langit.  I was raised to view God as a loving God, regardless of race, creed, faith, religion, etc.

Will I be able to love a God that only favors the Catholics for instance?  I don't think so.  Mahirap yun.  God is God.  Wala sya dapat vested interest in any of these.

yet salvation exclusivity is a doctrine of RC. as pointed out by barrister, the latin extra eccelsiam nulla salus doctrine is embraced and is a dogma of RC.

while it may not be emphasized, or taught now. it still is RC's doctrine.

I do not fault RC for it. All sects embrace it otherwise there's no need for joining one if you can be saved anywhere.

The reason why people get uncomfortable with a sect's doctrine of say exclusivity is sometimes simply because the person doesn't realize his organization embraces the same doctrine.

Even Christ is exclusive in the sense na if you don't believe in Him, you'll not be saved (except for some instances like what barrister and I agreed on - no law-nosin principle). One can also argue here na, ang sama naman ng Dios, nilalang nya tao pero impyerno lang pala bagsak. Kawawa naman mga Buddhists, Taoists, etc.


Offline SiCkBoY

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Re: Iglesia Ni Cristo - 100years of God's blessings
« Reply #858 on: Sep 04, 2015 at 11:39 AM »
yet salvation exclusivity is a doctrine of RC. as pointed out by barrister, the latin extra eccelsiam nulla salus doctrine is embraced and is a dogma of RC.

while it may not be emphasized, or taught now. it still is RC's doctrine.

I do not fault RC for it. All sects embrace it otherwise there's no need for joining one if you can be saved anywhere.

The reason why people get uncomfortable with a sect's doctrine of say exclusivity is sometimes simply because the person doesn't realize his organization embraces the same doctrine.

Even Christ is exclusive in the sense na if you don't believe in Him, you'll not be saved (except for some instances like what barrister and I agreed on - no law-nosin principle). One can also argue here na, ang sama naman ng Dios, nilalang nya tao pero impyerno lang pala bagsak. Kawawa naman mga Buddhists, Taoists, etc.



Hindi ako mahilig sa mga ganito eh so I had to Google it.  Ang alam ko lang is kung ano ang nakagisnan ko.  It turns out na Vatican II pala yun nakagisnan ko.  Baka iba yung turo noon pero iba na ang tinuro sakin.  I don't think may Catholic priest today na magsasabi na Catholics lang ang maliligtas.

It is evident, therefore, the Roman Catholic Church has dramatically shifted her position on the doctrine of salvation. In reality she teaches today that people of any faith (or, perhaps, none) can be saved by means of religious sincerity, because this is in effect anonymous Christianity.

http://www.justforcatholics.org/catholicism_today.htm
« Last Edit: Sep 04, 2015 at 11:41 AM by SiCkBoY »

Offline tony

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Re: Iglesia Ni Cristo - 100years of God's blessings
« Reply #859 on: Sep 04, 2015 at 11:44 AM »
the doctrine of exclusivity is man made, not of God, and therefore easily superseded by man....
just because some one in the RC wrote such things in the very distant past,
does not mean it is relevant till today, such thinking has no place in today's modern world...

exclusivity is wrong no matter who uttered it....
« Last Edit: Sep 04, 2015 at 11:51 AM by tony »
how do we defend our freedom? by the truth when it is assaulted by Marcos lies....

Offline SiCkBoY

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Re: Iglesia Ni Cristo - 100years of God's blessings
« Reply #860 on: Sep 04, 2015 at 11:47 AM »
If my religion will say na kami lang ang maliligtas, I will walk away from it. 

Everyday, I bring my daughter to school.  She's in nursery.  So she plays with her classmates before the start of class.  Nakakatuwa panoorin ang mga bata. 

How will I be able to sleep at night... how will I be able to live with myself, if my belief is that those lovely kids she plays with are going to hell?  Simply because they are of different faith?
« Last Edit: Sep 04, 2015 at 11:48 AM by SiCkBoY »

Offline Quitacet

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Re: Iglesia Ni Cristo - 100years of God's blessings
« Reply #861 on: Sep 04, 2015 at 11:51 AM »
Hindi ako mahilig sa mga ganito eh so I had to Google it.  Ang alam ko lang is kung ano ang nakagisnan ko.  It turns out na Vatican II pala yun nakagisnan ko.  Baka iba yung turo noon pero iba na ang tinuro sakin.  I don't think may Catholic priest today na magsasabi na Catholics lang ang maliligtas.

It is evident, therefore, the Roman Catholic Church has dramatically shifted her position on the doctrine of salvation. In reality she teaches today that people of any faith (or, perhaps, none) can be saved by means of religious sincerity, because this is in effect anonymous Christianity.

http://www.justforcatholics.org/catholicism_today.htm

If that is the case then there's no issue if say a thousand other religions embrace exclusivity doctrine because in RC's point of view naman pala, everyone will be saved. If RC is correct, then even the exclusivists will be saved. if one exclusivist sect is correct, dun lang magkakaproblema ang RC. RC in itself should not be bothered by other exclusivist sects.

But then again, for purists, they might say, so people before Vatican II died espousing a different doctrine and thus, beliefs. If that doesn't mean anything, so is other group having a different set of beliefs that might not be in-line with RC's current ones.


Offline SiCkBoY

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Re: Iglesia Ni Cristo - 100years of God's blessings
« Reply #862 on: Sep 04, 2015 at 11:52 AM »
If that is the case then there's no issue if say a thousand other religions embrace exclusivity doctrine because in RC's point of view naman pala, everyone will be saved. If RC is correct, then even the exclusivists will be saved. if one exclusivist sect is correct, dun lang magkakaproblema ang RC. RC in itself should not be bothered by other exclusivist sects.

But then again, for purists, they might say, so people before Vatican II died espousing a different doctrine and thus, beliefs. If that doesn't mean anything, so is other group having a different set of beliefs that might not be in-line with RC's current ones.


You missed my point, actually.  My point is Reply 872.
« Last Edit: Sep 04, 2015 at 11:53 AM by SiCkBoY »

Offline Quitacet

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Re: Iglesia Ni Cristo - 100years of God's blessings
« Reply #863 on: Sep 04, 2015 at 11:53 AM »
If my religion will say na kami lang ang maliligtas, I will walk away from it. 

Everyday, I bring my daughter to school.  She's in nursery.  So she plays with her classmates before the start of class.  Nakakatuwa panoorin ang mga bata. 

How will I be able to sleep at night... how will I be able to live with myself, if my belief is that those lovely kids she plays with are going to hell?  Simply because they are of different faith?

Nope. That's why in the INC children are not baptized. They do not sin. They are not yet capable of religious faith. Children are heaven-bound no matter what her/his parents' religion is.

Offline Quitacet

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Re: Iglesia Ni Cristo - 100years of God's blessings
« Reply #864 on: Sep 04, 2015 at 11:54 AM »
You missed my point, actually.

No I didn't.

you said RC once embraced exclusivity doctrine.

Now it doesn't anymore.


and this catholic website has a different take on Vatican II exclusivity doctrine:

Necessary for Salvation

As we have seen, God introduced salvation to the world through his chosen people, the Jews. God’s revelation to the Jews found its fulfillment in Christ, the Messiah, who established the Catholic Church. The grace necessary for salvation continues to come from Christ, through his Church. Those who innocently do not know and embrace this might still attain salvation but those who knowingly and willingly choose to reject it, reject salvation on God’s terms.

The Catechism (once again quoting Lumen Gentium) summarizes all this as follows:


Basing itself on Scripture and Tradition, the Council teaches that the Church, a pilgrim now on earth, is necessary for salvation: the one Christ is the mediator and the way of salvation; he is present to us in his body which is the Church. He himself explicitly asserted the necessity of faith and baptism, and thereby affirmed at the same time the necessity of the Church which men enter through baptism as through a door. Hence they could not be saved who, knowing that the Catholic Church was founded as necessary by God through Christ, would refuse either to enter it or to remain in it. (CCC 846)



this is the Catholic view of the no-law-no-sin principle I mentioned.

« Last Edit: Sep 04, 2015 at 11:57 AM by Quitacet »

Offline tony

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Re: Iglesia Ni Cristo - 100years of God's blessings
« Reply #865 on: Sep 04, 2015 at 11:56 AM »
as long as those people believed that Jesus is the only way to the Father in heaven....
everything else do not matter more than this......
how do we defend our freedom? by the truth when it is assaulted by Marcos lies....

Offline SiCkBoY

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Re: Iglesia Ni Cristo - 100years of God's blessings
« Reply #866 on: Sep 04, 2015 at 11:56 AM »
Nope. That's why in the INC children are not baptized. They do not sin. They are not yet capable of religious faith. Children are heaven-bound no matter what her/his parents' religion is.

Again, you missed my point.

May colleague ako.  We work hard.  We talk about our work-related issues.  Sometimes we have lunch together, sometimes not.  We talk about our families all the time. He's a nice guy.  A devoted family man, from what I can tell.

How will I be able to sleep at night... how will I be able to live with myself, if my belief is that he and his lovely family are all going to hell?  Simply because they are of different faith?

Offline dpogs

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Re: Iglesia Ni Cristo - 100years of God's blessings
« Reply #867 on: Sep 04, 2015 at 11:57 AM »
If my religion will say na kami lang ang maliligtas, I will walk away from it. 

Everyday, I bring my daughter to school.  She's in nursery.  So she plays with her classmates before the start of class.  Nakakatuwa panoorin ang mga bata. 

How will I be able to sleep at night... how will I be able to live with myself, if my belief is that those lovely kids she plays with are going to hell?  Simply because they are of different faith?

The reason we are going to hell is
- not because we have different faith
- not because we didnt believe in God
- not because we never heard the Gospel
- not because we mever read the Bible

It is because we sin against God, we are sinners before God.
There is none righteous, no not one.

Offline Quitacet

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Re: Iglesia Ni Cristo - 100years of God's blessings
« Reply #868 on: Sep 04, 2015 at 11:58 AM »
Again, you missed my point.

May colleague ako.  We work hard.  We talk about our work-related issues.  Sometimes we have lunch together, sometimes not.  We talk about our families all the time. He's a nice guy.  A devoted family man, from what I can tell.

How will I be able to sleep at night... how will I be able to live with myself, if my belief is that he and his lovely family are all going to hell?  Simply because they are of different faith?

let another Catholic answer that:

http://www.catholic.com/magazine/articles/what-no-salvation-outside-the-church-means

Offline SiCkBoY

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Re: Iglesia Ni Cristo - 100years of God's blessings
« Reply #869 on: Sep 04, 2015 at 12:05 PM »
let another Catholic answer that:

http://www.catholic.com/magazine/articles/what-no-salvation-outside-the-church-means

I am talking about my own personal belief.  What I am saying is, I won't be able to live with myself if my personal belief is that my friends are all going to hell.  I've been a Catholic all my life and wala kahit sinong pari ang nagsabi sakin na salvation only lies within Catholicism.  What I quoted above is what I know and what was taught to me.

Again, if the Catholic Church will preach to me that only Catholics are going to heaven, I will walk away.  I don't go to church anymore, but I was a Knight of the Altar for several years when I was younger.  Kahit kelan, walang nagsabi ng ganyan.