Topic: PSVANE tubes anybody? And/or any other bang for buck tubes :)

[meat_eater]

Anybody here with 1st hand experience on using PSVANE tubes?

Like most newbies on tubes, Ive been reading on some stuff in the net and came across these:

PSVANE 12AX7


PSVANE 12AU7


PSVANE EL34/6CA7


I know it's common knowledge that NOS tubes are better than current production ones, but with NOS tube prices going nowhere but up, and supplies going nowhere but down, I thought maybe there's hope in current production tubes, hence the question.

Hope to hear from you guys, particulary those who have had extensive experience with tubes.

Cheers

[juanbote]

Current production tubes haven't caught up yet with NOS tubes in terms of quality, but certainly a day will come when they can be even better.

For availability and pricing, PSVANE tubes and other current production tube are worth trying out on your tube amp.

A tube amplifier without tubes is just a mere power supply. Tube amplifiers are made to sing music be it pleasant to the ears or not.

Please post your sonic experience with the PSVANE tubes.

[♡ lvcdg23™ ✌]

I think these are available in Audio Amplified in Libis...

[meat_eater]

I think these are available in Audio Amplified in Libis...

Ohh nice Will give them a call soon.. Thanks sir.

[♡ lvcdg23™ ✌]

Ohh nice Will give them a call soon.. Thanks sir.

Pareview na din sir kung sakali makakuha kayo

[meat_eater]

Pareview na din sir kung sakali makakuha kayo

Sige sir

Sana merung naka try na dito na mag bigay ng insights nila

[Voltraizer]

I know it's common knowledge that NOS tubes are better than current production ones, but with NOS tube prices going nowhere but up, and supplies going nowhere but down, I thought maybe there's hope in current production tubes, hence the question.

i have NOS tubes and some new production tubes that i bought.
it would be not be quite accurate to say NOS tubes are better than current production . when one say one is better than the others-- they should say why it is so

NOS are expensive because of rarity and collectibility.(law of supply and demand) Ownership of such items makes one proud, since to them the sound produced by such NOS also are  rare.(that's what we call "pride of ownership" and "bragging rights"), though yes, there are NOS tubes that sounds great...but there are also new production tubes that sounds great too... BUT , the thing is-- there are lots of NOS tubes around that sounds mediocre when installed in one's  audio system... same thing with new ones-
so, the general statement or sweeping statement  that NOS are better than current production tubes doesn't hold true in these cases.
 depending on  who's giving the review, Detailed sound to some becomes Talas sa tenga while Warm sound means ngongo to others. We should also take note of the music preference of the reviewer.
i still doubt the idea that NOS tube can not be cloned. We live in the modern world of computers and with high tech facility around and given the advanced state of science and technology we have today (and btw, it's almost 2013-so happy new year!), it would be easy for any factory with modern facility, to clone any tubes (made in the copong-copng era like the 1950s and 60's ), if the objective is to copy the SQ character , using reverse-engineering.

Also,We should take note of who is giving a review. The best source are buyer's reviews .
They don't have to push stocks for sale.
(Sellers may be bias with what stocks they have to sell , be it new production or nos.)

a lot of consumer review say psvane tube are that good!

i heard psvanne peanut tubes on my friend's integrated amp , and sure, they sound great.
but it has other tubes  as well. i haven't heard others for comparo... might be the combination.

the thing is--i already ordered them anyway,and waiting for the 12ax/au's to arrive

[meat_eater]

i have NOS tubes and some new production tubes that i bought.
it would be not be quite accurate to say NOS tubes are better than current production . when one say one is better than the others-- they should say why it is so

NOS are expensive because of rarity and collectibility.(law of supply and demand) Ownership of such items makes one proud, since to them the sound produced by such NOS also are  rare.(that's what we call "pride of ownership" and "bragging rights"), though yes, there are NOS tubes that sounds great...but there are also new production tubes that sounds great too... BUT , the thing is-- there are lots of NOS tubes around that sounds mediocre when installed in one's  audio system... same thing with new ones-
so, the general statement or sweeping statement  that NOS are better than current production tubes doesn't hold true in these cases.
 depending on  who's giving the review, Detailed sound to some becomes Talas sa tenga while Warm sound means ngongo to others. We should also take note of the music preference of the reviewer.
i still doubt the idea that NOS tube can not be cloned. We live in the modern world of computers and with high tech facility around and given the advanced state of science and technology we have today (and btw, it's almost 2013-so happy new year!), it would be easy for any factory with modern facility, to clone any tubes (made in the copong-copng era like the 1950s and 60's ), if the objective is to copy the SQ character , using reverse-engineering.

Also,We should take note of who is giving a review. The best source are buyer's reviews .
They don't have to push stocks for sale.
(Sellers may be bias with what stocks they have to sell , be it new production or nos.)

a lot of consumer review say psvane tube are that good!

i heard psvanne peanut tubes on my friend's integrated amp , and sure, they sound great.
but it has other tubes  as well. i haven't heard others for comparo... might be the combination.

the thing is--i already ordered them anyway,and waiting for the 12ax/au's to arrive

Point well taken

Hope to hear from you sir when those peanut PSVANE tubes arrive... I'm quite interested in those as well, at least the small ones first... From what I saw in the net, I think this PSVANE tubes dont come cheap.

Thanks sir and Happy New Year!!

Cheers!!

[ATJr.]

Current production tubes haven't caught up yet with NOS tubes in terms of quality, but certainly a day will come when they can be even better.

that is why i'd rather use TV tubes than use these china tubes....

before i get flamed, i would say a designer worth his salt will design tube amps based on what is available....if you have a pasvane tube, so be it, optimise your circuit based on that tube...

if my amp sounds different each time i change tubes, i get depressed, that means that i failed....

btw, my Shuguang EL34 pp amp rocks....my opinion of chinese tubes changed because of that.... i am going to try the 6550 and KT88 tubes on that amp...

i heard psvanne peanut tubes on my friend's integrated amp , and sure, they sound great.
but it has other tubes  as well. i haven't heard others for comparo... might be the combination.

you are on the money there attorney, always a voice of reason...........an amp is not made up of just the 12ax7 or 12au7 alone, you have the opt there as well, the OPT alone is the single deal maker or breaker.....i have yet to see audiophiles rolling opt's....


Finally, why spend money on an amp that you will need to spend more money to get the sound right? to you liking, why not just buy those tubes and build the amp using those parts? there are tube rollers, capacitor/resistor changers why no OPT changers as well?

 

[meat_eater]

that is why i'd rather use TV tubes than use these china tubes....

before i get flamed, i would say a designer worth his salt will design tube amps based on what is available....if you have a pasvane tube, so be it, optimise your circuit based on that tube...

if my amp sounds different each time i change tubes, i get depressed, that means that i failed....

btw, my Shuguang EL34 pp amp rocks....my opinion of chinese tubes changed because of that.... i am going to try the 6550 and KT88 tubes on that amp...

you are on the money there attorney, always a voice of reason...........an amp is not made up of just the 12ax7 or 12au7 alone, you have the opt there as well, the OPT alone is the single deal maker or breaker.....i have yet to see audiophiles rolling opt's....


Finally, why spend money on an amp that you will need to spend more money to get the sound right? to you liking, why not just buy those tubes and build the amp using those parts? there are tube rollers, capacitor/resistor changers why no OPT changers as well?

 

No need to get flamed on this one sir. I, like most of the guys here, read on and research on this common hobby that we all share. Subjective as it is, in one way or another - there is still some science involved in it, or a dark art perhaps... Whatever it's called. Insights, opinions and experiences from you guys - the experts, are very much appreciated. It's like an educated opinion

Some would roll tubes, some caps, some would even do it with amps and speakers...For some, it gets very expensive, and for some - not much... It's all part of the fun anyway... At the end of the day, were all happy and enjoying music (and movies), in whatever way it sounds.

Cheers to all and Happy New Year!!

More audio stuff for all of us this 2013

[Voltraizer]

we know for a fact tha psvane tubes are chinese-made!
and there's a lot of good reviews regarding these tubes....

btw, my Shuguang EL34 pp amp rocks....my opinion of chinese tubes changed because of that.... i am going to try the 6550 and KT88 tubes on that amp..

if this is the same EL 34 amp i heard at the last hifi show @dusit, aba.. it's a great sounding amp...
maganda  tumunog ito, tony..me narinig pa nga akong nagsabi ..asan yun  subwoofer?!!!

i have shuguang EL 34 too...Good sounding tube yet reasonably priced .(provides a different flavour
with the mullards i have)

btw, since we are talking about chinese tubes...let me quote something i found on the net years ago.

we know many audiophiles consider the WE300B tube as the holy grail of tubes!
one good product of shuguang is their 300Bs whch has been rebranded/ relabelled several times
by different companies
a case in pt, shuguang 300B is the same tube relabelled as valve art as per tubestore.com
http://thetubestore.com/300btypes.html
also from http://www.jacmusic.com

Valve Art 300 B
A perfect copy of the WE 300B. I noted the filaments are exceptionally powerful even at lowered temperature. I can almost say for sure, they still use the ancient recipe for Thorium-doted filament Coating. (Older form of Barium coating). For the factory workers, this is a dangerous material, and this is not allowed to be used in Europe and the USA since many years now. Whatever their secret, the filaments work great. Don't worry... thorium is used in every NOS tube, and there is just a micro trace in a finished tube.
High Resolution image <Images/300B-Valve-Art.JPG>

labor laws in the US are strict when it comes to the use of dangerous substance like thorium unlike in China so what this means is
that if thorium content is used in every 1950 western electric 300B tubes then Chinese firm have no problem using the same substance in cloning that tube.
i suspect ,the new production WE300B (US- made) might have a different recipe than the old 1950WE 300B. .. and if chinese shuguangs have the same recipe, your guess is good as mine.

you are on the money there attorney, always a voice of reason...........an amp is not made up of just the 12ax7 or 12au7 alone, you have the opt there as well, the OPT alone is the single deal maker or breaker.....i have yet to see audiophiles rolling opt's..

i assent. the quality of OPT is indeed a single deal maker or breaker...
that's why a friend of mine bought some premium priced opt@hk.

eh pano kung OTL    ,, amp rolling mode na
happy new year bro!

[JojoD818]

i have yet to see audiophiles rolling opt's....

I knew a few who rolled their opt's with James and Tamura opts. In my opinion, huge difference and excellent investment.

[ATJr.]

if this is the same EL 34 amp i heard at the last hifi show @dusit, aba.. it's a great sounding amp...
maganda  tumunog ito, tony..me narinig pa nga akong nagsabi ..asan yun  subwoofer?!!! 

with a Russian 6j9(ef180/6688 equivalent) and a Japanese(hitachi) 6CG7 how can one go wrong? i guess the Russian and Japanese can push the Chinese around.....

[ATJr.]

I knew a few who rolled their opt's with James and Tamura opts. In my opinion, huge difference and excellent investment.

let us not forget that there are Hashimoto and Lunhdall traffos as well.....

yes, i agree that those OPT's are better than the OPT's originally supplied in the Chinese amps.....aba, Edrel and Mang Rey can make better OPT's given that M6 type cores are still available in our local surplus core market....Edrel's Z11 cores are tops, i use them in some of my OPT builds, a bit pricey though...

last year i had a chance to repair a KT88 branded PP power amp, nalubog sa baha, so opening the cased OPT revealed a core with 1 inch center leg, this the type of OPT i used in my 6LU8 pp amp......my EL34 pp amp used 1 3/4 inch cores, the Dynaco ST70 btw used a 1 1/8 inch core in the A470 OPT, this is a well regarded OPT mind you....

[ATJr.]

i assent. the quality of OPT is indeed a single deal maker or breaker...
that's why a friend of mine bought some premium priced opt@hk.

eh pano kung OTL     ,, amp rolling mode na
happy new year bro!

hehehe....happy new year attorney......i might just make your wish come true.....just awaiting some parts from china....

amp rolling....yes i agree, i ussually recomend T-amps nowadays as a second amp, parang atsara, pag naumay sa tubes T-amp naman....

i built one for a guy that owned a 2A3 single ended amp and he said the T-amp sounded like his SET....

[JojoD818]

let us not forget that there are Hashimoto and Lunhdall traffos as well.....

yes, i agree that those OPT's are better than the OPT's originally supplied in the Chinese amps.....aba, Edrel and Mang Rey can make better OPT's given that M6 type cores are still available in our local surplus core market....Edrel's Z11 cores are tops, i use them in some of my OPT builds, a bit pricey though...

last year i had a chance to repair a KT88 branded PP power amp, nalubog sa baha, so opening the cased OPT revealed a core with 1 inch center leg, this the type of OPT i used in my 6LU8 pp amp......my EL34 pp amp used 1 3/4 inch cores, the Dynaco ST70 btw used a 1 1/8 inch core in the A470 OPT, this is a well regarded OPT mind you....

Well I was going there actually, support Edrel's trannies, he knows his stuff real well.

Those encapsulated trannies I repaired moons ago are total crap! Sa iyo 1" pa nakita mo, eto 7/8" lang and it's used in a PP EL34!!! Kakainis ano? Wag na natin post ang brand.

I know about the A470, I have a pair of original ones but if I were to build another tube amp it will surely be using Edrel's.

Teka Happy New Year pala sa iyo tony at sa lahat ng tubero!

Kampay!

[ATJr.]

jojo bumati ka rin sa diyaudio.......

[Voltraizer]

hehehe....happy new year attorney......i might just make your wish come true.....just awaiting some parts from china....

amp rolling....yes i agree, i ussually recomend T-amps nowadays as a second amp, parang atsara, pag naumay sa tubes T-amp naman....

i built one for a guy that owned a 2A3 single ended amp and he said the T-amp sounded like his SET....

i  do have a sonic t-amp.  -recasing  and power supply made by master jojod .
kasing tunog ba ?? ng 300B amp ko haha , tipid pa sa kuryente.

there are lots of russian tubes that i like . kahit na yun 6N1p nila , gusto ko sa tube buffer.
Russian sovtek 12ax7LPS- -favorite peanut tubes ko sa  JD-9.  The new production tungsol 6SN7 is another favourite of mine.... pang sub ko sa Sylvania, CBS 5692 at hitachi
http://singaporehifi.blogspot.com/2011/02/6sn7-comparisons.html

"real world tube that some feel come close to the fabled Telefunkin at realistic pricing"

http://www.enjoythemusic.com/magazine/equipment/0700/nimis.htm

meron metal base na russian 6SN7 na mura lang dati, skyrocket yun presyo niya ngayon sa $120-$169 a piece ata?

[JojoD818]

jojo bumati ka rin sa diyaudio.......

oo babatiin ko si Andrew...

[ATJr.]

oo babatiin ko si Andrew...

hehehe...kahit ganoon yon nakakamiss din......

[xtian_lugz]

I tried using a psvane 12au7 with my amp but it was 12ax7 originally it was good but a little lower in gain.. Then swithched to jj 12ax7 an its fatter sounding more solid so i preferred the JJ gold pins. I know i shouldnt compare the 2 coz its different gain but sound wise in my amp JJ wins.

[ATJr.]

JJ is Russian new production tubes, locally available here...http://www.epektos.com/catalog/90270c5d-17be-428d-8204-30703444af81.aspx

Pasvane is China made....a look at the gold plating on the pins and the fancy casing tells you it's not going to come cheap......there is a market for these expensive tubes, there are those who scorn cheap tubes and cheap amps as low quality...

Shuguang tubes are available here......http://www.goodcomponent.com/ they carry both the cheaper and more expensive versions.....so there is something for everybody....

[ATJr.]

i  do have a sonic t-amp.  -recasing  and power supply made by master jojod .
kasing tunog ba ?? ng 300B amp ko haha , tipid pa sa kuryente.

there are lots of russian tubes that i like . kahit na yun 6N1p nila , gusto ko sa tube buffer.
Russian sovtek 12ax7LPS- -favorite peanut tubes ko sa  JD-9.  The new production tungsol 6SN7 is another favourite of mine.... pang sub ko sa Sylvania, CBS 5692 at hitachi
http://singaporehifi.blogspot.com/2011/02/6sn7-comparisons.htmlhttp://www.enjoythemusic.com/magazine/equipment/0700/nimis.htm

meron metal base na russian 6SN7 na mura lang dati, skyrocket yun presyo niya ngayon sa $120-$169 a piece ata?

yes those Russian metal based 6sn7 really cost an arm and a leg, so that is what happens when an item is hyped and an apparent demand for the tube is created, cost skyrocket.....

[meat_eater]

hype = bad for us 

[JojoD818]

IME, I've had more infantile mortality issues with Chinese tubes than Russian tubes. I'm talking stock tubes that came with the units (Chinese) and new productions Russian tubes. I do have specimens of both that up to now are still working, maybe it has something to do with their quality assurance programs.

hype = bad for us 

good thing this bowl of 6sn7 tubes has insured my personal tube gears to last my lifetime...

[meat_eater]

I will probably try first the cheaper tubes and see how my amp responds, and as per Sir TonyT's advice, will probably try the JJ Tesla tubes first (locally available and reasonably priced).

Once I get a better understanding on how the amp sounds on rolling, the inherent character which remains constant and the tones that change upon rolling, then maybe I can start trying out these "premium" tubes.

I do hope those who've tried these tubes would still give in their inputs and observations - those would still be highly appreciated. If the said tubes are "bang for buck" or  just a complete waste of time and money.

Hope to hear more from you guys.

Thanks!

[ATJr.]

" bang for the buck?"  those will be TV tubes.....

the 6LU8 tubes i used in my 12 watter pp amp costs just $1 dollar each and yet give very decent performance.......

why not just try those psvanes and then tell us...

[xtian_lugz]

JJ are very good specially for the price very cheep but very good.. Try to borrow tubes muna and see what will fit in your gear and taste. I also compared a new sovtek and a nos philips 12ax7 obviously the philips won but not that much. Even my friends was shocked the difference wasnt that big.

[ATJr.]

Russian tubes are better than Chinese tubes for the simple reason that the Russians have been doing it for the longest time and has more experience, materials available to them......i have not met a Russian tube i did not like....

Russian tubes are much cheaper too...a pair of GU-50 pentodes can make 80 watts in pushpull...yest cost lower than other types...

[meat_eater]

Will probably try the cheap russians first, JJs then perhaps compare it with some chinese, psvane and shuguang... If by any chance other brands pop up that are quite cheap, then maybe those can be considered as well.

When i get those tubes in hand, I will invite you guys over to have a listen. Para madaming opinions sa A/B/C.

And a good way of meeting people din yun.