Topic: 2014-2015 NBA Season: Warriors crowned as Champions

[DVD_Freak]

but the term "revolutionize" itself means to change something completely. Shaq ,Lebron, and Magic didn't revolutionize anything but instead were freak of natures and are one of a kind. on the other hand, though, i stand corrected. Jordan did revolutionize the game because his play was to effective that the landscape of the NBA literally changed and shifted focus from the big men to wing players.

Revolutionize means a radical or major change.....not necessarily completely.  A vast improvement can fall into that category.  An introduction of something new can also be considered.

[leomarley]

Revolutionize means a radical or major change.....not necessarily completely.  A vast improvement can fall into that category.  An introduction of something new can also be considered.

it's not revolutionary though if no one follows what you've done. vis-a-vis Shaq, Lebron, Magic.

from the very definition of "revolutionary" in Oxford Dictionaries: Involving or causing a COMPLETE or dramatic change. an introduction of something new is PIONEERING not revolutionizing.

[dpogs]

LBJ revolutionize the modern NBA... in other way

[DVD_Freak]

it's not revolutionary though if no one follows what you've done. vis-a-vis Shaq, Lebron, Magic.

from the very definition of "revolutionary" in Oxford Dictionaries: Involving or causing a COMPLETE or dramatic change. an introduction of something new is PIONEERING not revolutionizing.

When I say something new I meant we havn't seen a 6'9" point guard before....but the point guard position isn't new.  Also it did say "... or dramatic change".  That is why I said completely isn't necessary.  It's all relative to one's perception.  Magic dramatically changed the general view of point guards then as small, quick, ball distributors and occasional scorers.  Several did try to follow Magic... Steve Smith and Penny Hardaway.  Magic and Bird did change the landscape of how the game was played.  That passing the ball and making your teammates better was the in thing.  Which is still being heard as a true testament of a great player.

[leomarley]

When I say something new I meant we havn't seen a 6'9" point guard before....but the point guard position isn't new.  Also it did say "... or dramatic change".  That is why I said completely isn't necessary.  It's all relative to one's perception.  Magic dramatically changed the general view of point guards then as small, quick, ball distributors and occasional scorers.  Several did try to follow Magic... Steve Smith and Penny Hardaway.  Magic and Bird did change the landscape of how the game was played.  That passing the ball and making your teammates better was the in thing.  Which is still being heard as a true testament of a great player.

still didn't have any dramatic change in the NBA. key phrase here being "dramatic change" like how Jordan affected the NBA. also, Steve Smith was a shooting guard not a point guard and Penny Hardaway did not have the same height or build as Magic. you could say they change their views, but hardly dramatic, about at what height PGs should be but a vast majority of point guards are still within the range of 6'-6'4". I mean, who are the good point guards today who are above 6'6"? i can't even name one in the list of points guards in the NBA last season.

Oscar Robertson was a great scorer and passer as well and made his teammates better and it was before the time of Magic and Bird. Them (Magic and Bird) passing the ball to make their teammates better did not revolutionize the game because players have been doing that even before Magic's and Bird's time. you could say Magic pioneered showtime fastbreak and yes great passing skills is a testament of a great player but you can hardly call that revolutionary.

Revolutionary = complete or dramatic change

was there a complete or dramatic change in the NBA in the point guard position because Magic? no.
was there a complete or dramatic change in the NBA because of Shaq? no.

[DVD_Freak]

still didn't have any dramatic change in the NBA. key phrase here being "dramatic change" like how Jordan affected the NBA.

Magic together with Bird did in the 80s.  Like I said making your teammates better was a foreign concept before they entered.  They brought the NBA to new heights.

also, Steve Smith was a shooting guard not a point guard and Penny Hardaway did not have the same height or build as Magic. you could say they change their views, but hardly dramatic, about at what height PGs should be but a vast majority of point guards are still within the range of 6'-6'4". I mean, who are the good point guards today who are above 6'6"? i can't even name one in the list of points guards in the NBA last season.

Both Smith and Hardaway played point early in their careers.  But both could not produce the same results and did discover that they could be more effective playing the 2.  But still it both tried moreso Hardaway.  That's why then you keep on hearing... the next Magic comparisons.

Oscar Robertson was a great scorer and passer as well and made his teammates better and it was before the time of Magic and Bird. Them (Magic and Bird) passing the ball to make their teammates better did not revolutionize the game because players have been doing that even before Magic's and Bird's time. you could say Magic pioneered showtime fastbreak and yes great passing skills is a testament of a great player but you can hardly call that revolutionary.

Magic was 6'9" and 220lbs.  Those were the numbers of most power forwards then.  The Big O was around 6'5".  Also hindi ba dito kay Oscar Robertson papasok yun concept mo of pioneering.  The Big O may have started it.  But Magic revolutionized the position.

Revolutionary = complete or dramatic change

was there a complete or dramatic change in the NBA in the point guard position because Magic? no.
was there a complete or dramatic change in the NBA because of Shaq? no.

Emphasis on the ... or dramatic change.

Was there a dramatic change in the general view of what was a typical point guard because of Magic?  Absolutely!

Was there a dramatic change in the general view of a center having a combination of power and strentgh and agility while being 7'1" and around 360lbs?  =  You betcha!

[DVD_Freak]

The top five point guards in NBA history
By Wade Souza, Associated Content Monday, Oct 25, 2010

1. Earvin "Magic" Johnson: Without question, no point guard in NBA history possessed the versatility, style, and grace of Lakers' Hall-of-Famer, Earvin "Magic" Johnson. At 6'8", the 12-time All-Star and 5-time NBA champion captivated the basketball world and revolutionized the point guard position forever. Johnson exuded an unrivaled passion for the game, fierce competitive nature, and effortless glow every single time he stepped on the floor. The Lakers' top overall pick in 1979 remarkably averaged double-digit assists for nine consecutive seasons, while recording an astonishing 138 regular season triple-doubles. Ultimately, Johnson deserves much of the credit for the evolution of the NBA point guard. "Magic" transcended the position, not only as a ball handler, but as a scorer, rebounder, defender, facilitator, leader, and highlight-reel regular. On playgrounds and courts to this day, aspiring point guards continue to imitate Johnson's free-flowing, improvisational style, but I am certain… there will never be another "Magic."

 The 10 best point guards of the past three decades
Posted by Dennis Velasco under NBA History on Jul 06, 2011

1. Magic Johnson, Los Angeles Lakers (1979-1991; 1995-96)
906 G; 19.5 PPG; 11.2 APG; 7.2 RPG; 0.4 3PTM; 52.0 FG%; 84.8 FT%; 1.9 SPG

Magic is at the top for a few reasons — statistics, championships, lifting the NBA up with Larry Bird into the mainstream again and revolutionizing the point guard position at 6-foot-9. Also, he made it cool to have one-word nicknames. What better name could there be for a wizard on the hardwood than Magic?

Keeping Score: The Anatomy of A Perfect Point Guard

Court Vision – Magic Johnson
There’s no denying that Ervin Magic Johnson revolutionized the position. Even his collegiate career was shaped by the desire to excel at a spot usually reserved for those 6 ft. 2 and under, despite his lengthy 6 ft. 9 frame.[/b]

[Kd Jb]

Mike miller posted that he is going to cleveland. Si ray allen na lang wala pa update.

[thebat]

^ wala pang update kay Kevin Love?

[rusty]

Miami re-signs Wade, Haslem

Knicks sign Jason Smith

Wizards sign Kris Humphries

Mavericks sign Rashard Lewis

Jazz sign Trevor Booker

Rockets sign Jeff Adrien, Joey Dorsey

Boozer Amnestied

Nine teams, by my count, have enough cap space to put in post-amnesty bids for Carlos Boozer: ATL, CHA, HOU, LAL, MIL, ORL, PHI, PHX & UTAH

[Kd Jb]

[ayosbathere]

btw, since we are on the summer league topic, I found this gem:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LE7iCJHscu4

Kobe's 36-point explosion in Summer League. Check out how much ahead of the competition he was at that time. Fresh out of high school and he was destroying college kids. You just know he was a special player. I can't believe dvd_freak considers him as just an average guard who is comparable to Vince Carter and the likes. (i remember you said this 2 years ago, dvd_freak. hehe)

100% Kobe haters ... bwahahahaha

[ayosbathere]

Oops oops oops bro!  Hindi yun ang sinabi ko ha...

Syempre I will be judged a hater na naman just by your post alone.  I never said Kobe was an average guard.  Never said Kobe was comparable to Vince Carter.  I said he is better than Carter.  I said he hasn't really revolutionized the game.  Yun link mo.... I see Jordan there!  From the fadeaway to the penetration to the free throws.... Jordan na Jordan!   

Mali yun post mo bro ha.   

Oppsss.. sorry. Hindi pala kobe haters   .. i :like:

[Waxx]

sa labo ng vid, wristband around the forearm, shooting form, body structure, and moves.. i swear i couldve mistaken him for mj.. if not for the number 32.. heck if he was wearing 23.. you could have me fooled...

[rusty]

Lance Stephenson has signed a three-year, $27 million deal to play for the Charlotte Hornets, according to league sources.

[DVD_Freak]

100% Kobe haters ... bwahahahaha

oh kita mo if not for the links I posted eh di na pre judge na naman ako.  Eh mali pala.   

[dpogs]

Kobe : just a copy cat - talented copy cat

[Superman]

Lance Stephenson has signed a three-year, $27 million deal to play for the Charlotte Hornets, according to league sources.

Good move by Michael Jordan! I was hoping though he moves to LA with the Lakers...another MWP in the works...

[tonedeaf]

Good move by Michael Jordan! I was hoping though he moves to LA with the Lakers...another MWP in the works...

Ako din. I wanted the Lakers to go after Lance, or Deng or Isaiah Thomas. I realize that it won't mean making the playoffs this year, but building a nice core of young/competent players is a better way to attract the superstar they want, instead of having all these players on minimum or expiring deals.

[dodie]

still didn't have any dramatic change in the NBA. key phrase here being "dramatic change" like how Jordan affected the NBA.
Revolutionary = complete or dramatic change

tama bossing! just like jordan change the pekpek shorts to baggy shorts. jordan's fashion move helps basketball into a new era! For the 1989 season, Jordan was the only player with the specific-tailored shorts. Then his teammate, Scottie Pippen, requested a pair. That offseason, the idea caught fire. It was a league-requested change, based on feedback from the players. and for those who dont know bkt nag baggy shorts si mj Ay dahil di kasya yung NC shorts nya na ginagawa nyang brief! and also that SHORT thing is very iconic, it has change the nfl workout short into a baggy one. boxing has it also and even tennis now. by 92, he is one of the most recognizable player around the world. some people doesnt knew what is nba but knew michael jordan. he changed how a pro athlete dealings with apparel manufacturers and inking mega buck contracts in the process. during the 90's, everyone "wanna be like mike"! At the turn of the 21st century, ESPN, the preeminent all-sports network, conducted an expansive survey of media members, athletes and others associated with the sports world to rank the 20th century's greatest athletes. Jordan topped the list above Babe Ruth and Muhammad Ali -- substantiating his link to those earlier cultural icons.

his basketball career in and out the court is best describe by an iconic lakers player...."There's Michael Jordan and then there is the rest of us."

-- Magic Johnson

but as greatness personified, michael jordan believes otherwise.He recognized his place in the game, but in a different manner. In his book, For The Love of The Game: My Story, Jordan wrote: "There is no such thing as a perfect basketball player, and I don't believe there is only one greatest player either. Everyone plays in different eras. I built my talents on the shoulders of someone else's talent. I believe greatness is an evolutionary process that changes and evolves era to era. Without Julius Erving, David Thompson, Walter Davis, and Elgin Baylor there would never have been a Michael Jordan. I evolved from them."

[rusty]

Interesting article about how the new NBA TV deal in 2016 is gonna affect the salary cap:

"In this scenario we see the cap rise from the $67 million range in 2015-16 to the $89 million range in 2016-17 with a player salary max at around $29 million. This basically means that every single NBA team should be able to fairly easily make a max contract offer to a Player in the 2016 offseason . Durant, Love, Lebron will be able to pick and choose wherever they want to go and there will be some horrendous contracts given out. Horrendous."

http://www.boxscoregeeks.com/articles/a-layman-s-guide-to-the-coming-nba-salary-cap-apocalypse

Another take:

The league projects the cap to jump from $63 million next season to about $68 million for 2015-16, and that may end up underselling the leap if the league rakes in another bonanza of revenue. At least a few teams have internal projections showing the cap rising by as much as 30 percent over the next two seasons, meaning that it might sit near $85 million going into the 2016-17 season.

http://grantland.com/features/2014-nba-free-agency-winners-and-losers-houston-rockets-chandler-parsons/

[the_w0rks]

Wow. Im loving Jordan's Hornets right now. Theyre making nice strides to become a good team.

I wonder if Stephenson will finally ditch And1 for Jordan brand? Siya lang yata And1 sponsored player last year.

[the_w0rks]

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2132048-nba-reportedly-submits-proposal-to-change-draft-lottery-format

Proposal to slightly change the draft lottery. It's not a real change per se. Just an adjustment of percentages. I'd rather have the wheel suggestion mentioned in the article to really eliminate tanking.

[leomarley]

tama bossing! just like jordan change the pekpek shorts to baggy shorts. jordan's fashion move helps basketball into a new era! For the 1989 season, Jordan was the only player with the specific-tailored shorts. Then his teammate, Scottie Pippen, requested a pair. That offseason, the idea caught fire. It was a league-requested change, based on feedback from the players. and for those who dont know bkt nag baggy shorts si mj Ay dahil di kasya yung NC shorts nya na ginagawa nyang brief! and also that SHORT thing is very iconic, it has change the nfl workout short into a baggy one. boxing has it also and even tennis now. by 92, he is one of the most recognizable player around the world. some people doesnt knew what is nba but knew michael jordan. he changed how a pro athlete dealings with apparel manufacturers and inking mega buck contracts in the process. during the 90's, everyone "wanna be like mike"! At the turn of the 21st century, ESPN, the preeminent all-sports network, conducted an expansive survey of media members, athletes and others associated with the sports world to rank the 20th century's greatest athletes. Jordan topped the list above Babe Ruth and Muhammad Ali -- substantiating his link to those earlier cultural icons.

his basketball career in and out the court is best describe by an iconic lakers player...."There's Michael Jordan and then there is the rest of us."

-- Magic Johnson

but as greatness personified, michael jordan believes otherwise.He recognized his place in the game, but in a different manner. In his book, For The Love of The Game: My Story, Jordan wrote: "There is no such thing as a perfect basketball player, and I don't believe there is only one greatest player either. Everyone plays in different eras. I built my talents on the shoulders of someone else's talent. I believe greatness is an evolutionary process that changes and evolves era to era. Without Julius Erving, David Thompson, Walter Davis, and Elgin Baylor there would never have been a Michael Jordan. I evolved from them."

This is what I mean when I say revolutionary. It changes things and those changes stick. With Magic, he changed how we view PGs but he did not necessarily revolutionise the position since small, quick PGs are still the prevailing characteristics of the position.

These sports writers have the tendency to be too liberal with the word "revolutionize" just to exaggerate how they feel about something and ends up trivializing the word. Also, what they write are merely their opinions and can be hardly considered as facts.

So I ask again:

Are big, tall point guards prevailing in the NBA now? No.
Are there big, fast, hulking, dominant centers right now? Not even one.
Has there been a dramatic change in the PG and C positions because of Magic and Shaq, respectively? No.
Are they revolutionary? Hardly.
Are they freaks of nature and dominant at their respective positions at the time when they were playing? Absolutely.

[rusty]

Rodney Stuckey has agreed to join the Indiana Pacers on a one-year deal, @USATODAYsports has learned. Nice pickup after losing Stephenson.

[the_w0rks]

This is what I mean when I say revolutionary. It changes things and those changes stick. With Magic, he changed how we view PGs but he did not necessarily revolutionise the position since small, quick PGs are still the prevailing characteristics of the position.

These sports writers have the tendency to be too liberal with the word "revolutionize" just to exaggerate how they feel about something and ends up trivializing the word. Also, what they write are merely their opinions and can be hardly considered as facts.

So I ask again:

Are big, tall point guards prevailing in the NBA now? No.
Are there big, fast, hulking, dominant centers right now? Not even one.
Has there been a dramatic change in the PG and C positions because of Magic and Shaq, respectively? No.
Are they revolutionary? Hardly.
Are they freaks of nature and dominant at their respective positions at the time when they were playing? Absolutely.

Agree ako with this point of view. Freaks of nature nga sila. Exception to the rule. Parang si Durant big guy with guard skills and Antetokounmpo 6'11 freak who can play point guard.

[DVD_Freak]

This is what I mean when I say revolutionary. It changes things and those changes stick. With Magic, he changed how we view PGs but he did not necessarily revolutionise the position since small, quick PGs are still the prevailing characteristics of the position.

These sports writers have the tendency to be too liberal with the word "revolutionize" just to exaggerate how they feel about something and ends up trivializing the word. Also, what they write are merely their opinions and can be hardly considered as facts.

So I ask again:

Are big, tall point guards prevailing in the NBA now? No.
Are there big, fast, hulking, dominant centers right now? Not even one.
Has there been a dramatic change in the PG and C positions because of Magic and Shaq, respectively? No.
Are they revolutionary? Hardly.
Are they freaks of nature and dominant at their respective positions at the time when they were playing? Absolutely.

dodie's post talks about baggy shorts, fashion and apparel.  But you said so yourself it is about skills?

yeah i don't think it counts since we're talking about players skills here not NBA rules with regards to revolutionizing the game.

Correct me if I am wrong but nowhere in the post does it connect with Michael Jordan's skills.

It can be with all sportswriters or majority of those do think Magic revolutionized the position, ikaw lang yun may view na mali yun term na revolutionary with regards to Magic Johnson.  How can probably 99% view the same thing?  Could those 99% just be wrong?  All of us naman are chiming in our opinions... sportswriters, me, you.  If that's the case, then no one speaks about facts.  What makes your own opinion be the one that is considered fact when probably 99% say otherwise?  Certainly those sportswriters do these for a living so they are either more knowledgeable than you or at least as knowledgeable.  They can't certainly be more clueless than yourself.

Well at least can you post a link where the sportswriters explicitly say.... MAGIC DID NOT REVOLUTIONIZE THE GAME AT THE POINT GUARD POSITION?  Because when you Google it, it's all over the net that he did.  Sobrang dami ng links na saying such.  Sa sobrang dami I can't possibly put it all in one post.  Mas maganda to broaden our perception if you can indeed provide that link.

It's so ridiculous though that a post I made over a year ago (no not 2 years ago ), is not in question naman.  So I guess the GIST of the message I was trying to emphasize is not the point of contention.  Ergo... agreed siya.  What is being questioned is the usage, definition or the proper implementation of "Revolutionize".   

---------------------------

BASKETBALL; Magic Johnson Ends His Career, Saying He Has AIDS Infection
By RICHARD W. STEVENSON,
Published: November 8, 1991

During his years as a versatile point guard in Los Angeles, he helped revolutionize the position with uncanny passes and length-of-the-court drives. He had an uncanny sense of when to shoot and when to give up the ball. His dazzling skills earned him the nickname that for most fans long ago replaced his given name, Earvin.

http://www.nytimes.com/1991/11/08/sports/basketball-magic-johnson-ends-his-career-saying-he-has-aids-infection.html

Magic Johnson Profile, Career Highs & Highlights

Pure talent. Maybe that's what better defines Johnson. His "magic" revolutionized the game of basketball. Behind-the-back passes, no-look passes, alley-oops from halfcourt, pivot moves, a smile for the history, were just parts of the endless arsenal of the tallest point guard in league history.

http://www.lakersuniverse.com/players/magic_johnson_profile.htm

A Champion on Every Level
Michigan State Basketball - Magic Johnson

The man who revolutionized the game of basketball before moving on to fiercer battles against AIDS and poverty, Johnson has been a champion at every level of competition.

http://www.bigten.org/genrel/022607aaa.html

[rexFi]

Wow tapos na LBJ discussions.

Anyway am glad I don't have to defend the guy anymore whoohoo.

BOOZER SUCKS by the way.

[leomarley]

dodie's post talks about baggy shorts, fashion and apparel.  But you said so yourself it is about skills?  Correct me if I am wrong but nowhere in the post does it connect with Michael Jordan's skills.

It can be with all sportswriters or majority of those do think Magic revolutionized the position, ikaw lang yun may view na mali yun term na revolutionary with regards to Magic Johnson.  How can probably 99% view the same thing?  Could those 99% just be wrong?  All of us naman are chiming in our opinions... sportswriters, me, you.  If that's the case, then no one speaks about facts.  What makes your own opinion be the one that is considered fact when probably 99% say otherwise?  Certainly those sportswriters do these for a living so they are either more knowledgeable than you or at least as knowledgeable.  They can't certainly be more clueless than yourself.

Well at least can you post a link where the sportswriters explicitly say.... MAGIC DID NOT REVOLUTIONIZE THE GAME AT THE POINT GUARD POSITION?  Because when you Google it, it's all over the net that he did.  Mas maganda to broaden our perception if you can indeed provide that link.

It's so ridiculous though that a post I made over a year ago (no not 2 years ago ), is not in question naman.  So I guess the GIST of the message I was trying to emphasize is not the point of contention.  Ergo... agreed siya.  What is being questioned is the usage, definition or the proper implementation of "Revolutionize".   

it is the utilization of the word "revolutionize" that i was trying to point out in dodie's post whether it's about a player's skill or his sense of basketball fashion because when you think about it, he did not revolutionize anything because nothing changed in the point guard position. I just made the quoted message because you guys were debating about player skills.

i'll indulge you though on links:

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2031789-steve-nash-calls-magic-johnson-the-greatest-point-guard-of-all-time

http://msn.foxsports.com/nba/lists/Top-10-point-guards-in-NBA-history#photo-title=Magic+Johnson+%25281979-96%2529&photo=30048902

http://sidelinesapp.com/item/whos-a-better-pgmagic-johnson-or-lebron-james/

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/642745-dunks-dimes-and-dishes-magic-johnson-and-each-teams-best-point-guard/page/13

http://entertainment.howstuffworks.com/magic-johnson-at.htm

in no way in those articles has pointed out that he's revolutionary. granted they didn't exactly say that Magic "didn't revolutionize the game at point guard position", they did not say that he did. and how can you say that 99% said that? have you gone through all sports articles that even remotely mentions Magic Johnson?

this is what i'm trying to point out regarding using the term "revolutionizing/revolutionized". even you used something to exaggerate the point you're trying to make. they're not wrong but they're wrong about using the term revolutionize when they ought to be using the phrase "pioneered the big PG position".

i'm not dissing on Magic because I do think that he's the best point guard the world has ever seen and he's a stand out guy but he did not revolutionize anything in terms of the point guard position. it is a fact if you strictly follow the definition of the word. everything else is just to emphasize how great a player he is. "pioneered" is still the best term to use.

this will be the last that i'm going to reply regarding the subject. replies are too long already and we're entering the zone of "i'll post my links, you post yours". let's just agree to disagree and just agree that he's one of the greatest ever to play the game. top 3 if you ask me. i don't want to end my day debating on things that doesn't even concern us

[DVD_Freak]

it is the utilization of the word "revolutionize" that i was trying to point out in dodie's post whether it's about a player's skill or his sense of basketball fashion because when you think about it, he did not revolutionize anything because nothing changed in the point guard position. I just made the quoted message because you guys were debating about player skills

But you're the one one who limited the discusiion on just skills.  So suddenly it's about fashion and apparel na rin.  Mas maganda sana pure skills lang  Hindi naman yata basketball skills ang fashion sense.   

i'll indulge you though on links:

in no way in those articles has pointed out that he's revolutionary. granted they didn't exactly say that Magic "didn't revolutionize the game at point guard position", they did not say that he did.

Then no need to click on them.  The link has to explicitly say .... Magic did not revolutionize the game.  Not mentioning anything doesn't count.  Because pwedeng he did... Pwede rin he did not.  Kaya dapat written talaga sa article.  Mas maganda yun links that really say that.  The links I provided naman say that.  So talagang no room for guessing, implying or whatever.  Nandun na. 

and how can you say that 99% said that? have you gone through all sports articles that even remotely mentions Magic Johnson?

Malalayo na naman tayo sa usapan.  Eto nga napakalayo na.  Hindi naman yun usage the "Revolutionize" yun pinopoint out ko.  Ok na itong isang "off topic" na 

this is what i'm trying to point out regarding using the term "revolutionizing/revolutionized". even you used something to exaggerate the point you're trying to make. they're not wrong but they're wrong about using the term revolutionize when they ought to be using the phrase "pioneered the big PG position".

Hindi pwedeng pioneered.  Kasi the Big O was the one who pioneered the big PG position.

i'm not dissing on Magic because I do think that he's the best point guard the world has ever seen and he's a stand out guy but he did not revolutionize anything in terms of the point guard position. it is a fact if you strictly follow the definition of the word. everything else is just to emphasize how great a player he is. "pioneered" is still the best term to use.

Yun definition naman is still dependent on one's perception.  From your definition.... OR DRASTIC CHANGE.  Pwede naman dun magfall sa category na yun.

this will be the last that i'm going to reply regarding the subject. replies are too long already and we're entering the zone of "i'll post my links, you post yours". let's just agree to disagree and just agree that he's one of the greatest ever to play the game. top 3 if you ask me. i don't want to end my day debating on things that doesn't even concern us

Hahaha!  Well hindi naman ako nag initiate ng debate.     Pero syempre I stand by my opinion.  Throughout all of these I never once said you were wrong.  I respect your opinion.  But you implied I was.  So I defended what I said.  And I have basis for what I said.  Sana nag agree to disagree ka na lang umpisa pa lang since ikaw naman yun nag reply sakin.

Also again this debate is in no way related to the gist of the message I was emphasizing.  Hindi naman proper use ng "revolutionize" yun gist ng original message ko more than a year ago.  Ang layo layo.