Topic: sound difference, vintage vs modern tube amp

[Jakob]

to those lucky enough to own both gears, kindly share their difference if any.

vintage - scott, dynaco, knight, and the likes...

modern - new production tube amps (not diy)..

i know it would be hard to compare because of other parameters, eg. entry-level, tube complement, related equipments, etc.

i'm just looking for a generalized, typical signature sound of vintage vs. modern tube amps

cheers,

 

[odyopayl]

Actually the difference between the Vintage & Modern Tube amps is only the components but design topology is almost the same. About the tubes, most of the vintage tubes sounds better than new production tubes but not all because there is a review that newly produced TJ mesh 300B tube is better that vintage one.

For the capacitors, because of the new technology & modern process of production new productions like Auricap, audionotes capacitors are better than the vintage.

Generally, I find signature model new production sounds better than vintage. Iba lang talaga ang dating ng Vintage, some are rere & priceless no matter how it sounds. but...thats just me.

[kimpao]

Generally, I find signature model new production sounds better than vintage. Iba lang talaga ang dating ng Vintage, some are rere & priceless no matter how it sounds. but...thats just me.

Wala ba dynamics at manipis tunog. 

[JojoD818]

Wala ba dynamics at manipis tunog. 

hhmmm.... sobrang vintage kaya ayaw na tumunog siguro. 

seriously, it can be very hard to compare vintage and modern tube amps. personally, I have heard both vintage and new prod tube amps that sounds very good. maybe the signature sound you may find with vintage amps is the warm sound it creates but some new prod amps can also do that, depends on the topology really.

anyway, YMMV. 

JojoD

[juanbote]

My take on this Vintage vs modern tube amp is that it boils down to the brand of tubes that goes with the amp.

I have a Quad II power amp that sounded great on the stock KT66 GEC / GENALEX power tubes. But when I put in Golden Dragon Chinese made KT66, My amp sounded awfully like a solid state amp.

I have a Sonic Frontier power amp that can take EL34, KT66, KT88 and 6550, sounded great on NOS tubes. When I tried SVETLANA tubes on the amp, The bass became edgy and hard.

I sold a Quad of 6550 Tungsol to a friend for his CJ amp with Svetlana 6550 tubes, He trash the Svetlana 6550 tubes as back-up.

I recently restored a Fisher 400 tube receiver. All tubes are stock NOS. 12Ax7 mullards and Telefunkens. This Vintage receiver is also good sounding. I will never put Sovtek or Chinese tubes on this receiver.

Tube amps are known by the tubes they keep!

[kimpao]

hhmmm.... sobrang vintage kaya ayaw na tumunog siguro. 

seriously, it can be very hard to compare vintage and modern tube amps. personally, I have heard both vintage and new prod tube amps that sounds very good. maybe the signature sound you may find with vintage amps is the warm sound it creates but some new prod amps can also do that, depends on the topology really.

anyway, YMMV. 

JojoD

Jo,

palagay ko nahukay sa balon yung tube amp kaya walang dynamics at manipis tumunog.  Mwehehehehe

[Jakob]

thank you guys for your replies, looks like there's no comparing vintage vs new amps.

there so many relatives, depends, i.e.  tubes, design, budget, etc.

how about signature sounds, i mean, what do the following brands are noted for in terms of sound (this maybe to each his own):

- scott, dynaco, cj, cayin, duntonic, amx, jojod amp  , etc...

thanks a bunch

 

[JojoD818]

thank you guys for your replies, looks like there's no comparing vintage vs new amps.

there so many relatives, depends, i.e.  tubes, design, budget, etc.

how about signature sounds, i mean, what do the following brands are noted for in terms of sound (this maybe to each his own):

- scott, dynaco, cj, cayin, duntonic, amx, jojod amp  , etc...

thanks a bunch

 

Uy nasali yun jojod amp, sir ss po ako, hindi tube amp. 

pero lahat nun amp na sinabi mo maganda tumunog yan. 

[JojoD818]

Jo,

palagay ko nahukay sa balon yung tube amp kaya walang dynamics at manipis tumunog.  Mwehehehehe

pa vulcanize para tumaba tunog....

pero ang cheapest trick in the book is to clean your ears regularly para madinig yun dynamics. 

ay mali, gears pala hindi ears. 

[kimpao]

thank you guys for your replies, looks like there's no comparing vintage vs new amps.

there so many relatives, depends, i.e.  tubes, design, budget, etc.

how about signature sounds, i mean, what do the following brands are noted for in terms of sound (this maybe to each his own):

- scott, dynaco, cj, cayin, duntonic, amx, jojod amp  , etc...

thanks a bunch

 

scott - malambing
dynaco - great mids especially when paired with LS3's
cj - if you want that ommmmph and well balanced sound and power this is the amp.
cayin - brusko tumunog especially the 6550's and KT-88's
duntonic - depends on the model, i find them a bit edggy, especially the el-84's
amx - you'll be surprised on what this amp can do.
jojod amp -  i'd rather let his customers speak for his work as this guy is a good friend. Pero PANALO yan. 

[odyopayl]

Definitely most of NOS tubes sounds better than new production. Now if we are talking about the Vintage Amp, I'm sure they sound better now because of New Internal Organs (Better wires, connectors, capacitors etch.) Anyway, most of the vintage amps now are mostly rehab and upgraded na.

[kimpao]

Definitely most of NOS tubes sounds better than new production. Now if we are talking about the Vintage Amp, I'm sure they sound better now because of New Internal Organs (Better wires, connectors, capacitors etch.) Anyway, most of the vintage amps now are mostly rehab and upgraded na.

if rehabilited, you'll be hearing it's original sound, if upgraded sinayang mo lang yung amp.  you have yet to hear the true sound of a rehabilited vintage amp. 

[Jakob]

if rehabilited, you'll be hearing it's original sound, if upgraded sinayang mo lang yung amp.  you have yet to hear the true sound of a rehabilited vintage amp. 

ey kimpao maybe your right, is rehabilitating same as restoring? how about upgrade vs modifying? certainly, mawawala na yung signature tunog pag na-modify yung amp. loosing also the original designer's intention in creating and using certain parts for the amp.

[kimpao]

ey kimpao maybe your right, is rehabilitating same as restoring? how about upgrade vs modifying? certainly, mawawala na yung signature tunog pag na-modify yung amp. loosing also the original designer's intention in creating and using certain parts for the amp.

basically, its one and the same jakob, rehabilitating and restoring. yup, was able to listen to a couple of modified vintage amp, sounded nice but lost it's signature sound. in other words nasayang lang yung amp.

[odyopayl]

if rehabilited, you'll be hearing it's original sound, if upgraded sinayang mo lang yung amp. you have yet to hear the true sound of a rehabilited vintage amp.

Rehabilited or technically refurbished vintage equipment is definitely different from upgraded one. Now we are talking about the "Good Sound" I'm sure we always follow our ears.
So sa mga may Dynaco ST70 don't make upgrades "Sasayangin nyo lang Amp nyo"! Forget about the Elna Caps, M-Caps & Rikens... hehehe  Peace Bro!

[Garp]

Uy tagal na nito pero...

I will disagree with the above posts (no offense). I was at Rene's place a couple of weeks back when somebody took delivery of an upgraded Dynaco MKIV. The upgrades consisted of cerafines in the ps, tantalums for grids, rikens for the rest of the signal path, Multicap RTX for coupling, and Mullard el34s. Celius was used.

In my many visits to Rene, usually after a few minutes of listening I tune out and look at Rene's other stuff. This time while I was fidgeting with something, Rene played the Dynaco and something about the sound made me paid attention. It was just so damned musical. It was one of those exceptionally rare times when you didn't have to listen hard to decide whether what you were hearing was good or not. It just hits you and instantly you know that the experience is rare. It would of course be great to compare an upgraded to a refubished one but the upgraded one sounds very very good.

This is the second time I've been bowled over by an amp. The first time was when I heard the Rogue Monoblocks. But between the two, I'd choose the Dynaco  Just sharing...

[odyopayl]

Uy tagal na nito pero...

I will disagree with the above posts (no offense). I was at Rene's place a couple of weeks back when somebody took delivery of an upgraded Dynaco MKIV. The upgrades consisted of cerafines in the ps, tantalums for grids, rikens for the rest of the signal path, Multicap RTX for coupling, and Mullard el34s. Celius was used.

In my many visits to Rene, usually after a few minutes of listening I tune out and look at Rene's other stuff. This time while I was fidgeting with something, Rene played the Dynaco and something about the sound made me paid attention. It was just so d**ned musical. It was one of those exceptionally rare times when you didn't have to listen hard to decide whether what you were hearing was good or not. It just hits you and instantly you know that the experience is rare. It would of course be great to compare an upgraded to a refubished one but the upgraded one sounds very very good.

This is the second time I've been bowled over by an amp. The first time was when I heard the Rogue Monoblocks. But between the two, I'd choose the Dynaco  Just sharing...

Sir Garp, Dynaco ST-70 is already a living legend. What more can you expect with the modern materials as replacement for the older original components especially the capacitors.

In my opinion, though only upgrades(replacing same value but different brand) was done in a vintage amplifier sound was already tampered & will sound different as the original  because of the characteristics of new components. There are modern process today that far improved manufacturing of electronic components especially discrete components. (e.g. diodes etch)
(IMHO)