Author Topic: Top Ten Best Filipino Flicks  (Read 69058 times)

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Offline indie boi

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Re: Top Ten Best Filipino Flicks
« Reply #150 on: Apr 14, 2006 at 01:47 PM »
Posting contradictory opinions about films does not mean you are "psychologically thinking your opinions are the only ones that matter". This is a forum after all and you are subjecting your opinion to a marketplace of ideas. It shouldn't surprise you that people may have a different opinion about the films that you love. It doesn't mean that since some people here did not like Rizal it would automatically mean that they are trying to change your opinions about the film. Take it for what it is -- an opinion and yours is as valid as anyone else's.

Having said that, I think Himala is loads better than Relasyon. And as I've also said so many times before the quality of a film is not measured by how many awards it has received or the size of its box office receipts. If that were the case then film buffs and critics would be worshipping at the altar of James Cameron and the Church of Titanic -- and that's a religion I have no plans of joining.
« Last Edit: Apr 14, 2006 at 01:47 PM by indie boi »

Offline Noel_Vera

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Re: Top Ten Best Filipino Flicks
« Reply #151 on: Apr 14, 2006 at 02:21 PM »
or are we going to put them all under one category-CRAP?

This I agree with.

If you read around, strong opinions happen up and down this thread; only thing to do is fight for it, if you've got the determination. I'm willing to listen and consider; and just as willing to give out my opinion if I don't agree.

Offline atomicat10

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Re: Top Ten Best Filipino Flicks
« Reply #152 on: Apr 14, 2006 at 02:49 PM »
"I didn't liked Rizal" was WAY different from
Quote
It's not really a good movie
  You have categorized it like a critic and by doing so you have placed yourself in a position of expertise whose credentials and qualifications I have no idea of.

You said that Rizal was not "really" a good movie, the whys and hows you have failed to explain. Ah, I forgot, it's too masturbatory and of course your basis is what again?

If awards and box office receipts are not measurements of the quality of film then I guess you are not a fan of the Lord of the Rings Trilogy neither. ;D

Initially, I said that Rizal was good for me as well as Clinton. I just used the list of awards it won and (thanks to your box office hint) the fact that it became the most successful filipino film (box-officewise) to prove that I wasn't just being hysterical about the film, a lot of other people shared the same assessment (or was it mass hysteria? ;D)

I liked Rizal because of how it was presented, the acting performances, editing, cinematography, the freshness it gave the two books etc. The fact that it was given so many awards and did "well" in the box office were only secondary and supportive.

One of my all time favorites is Seven by Brad Pitt and the great Morgan Freeman.The film never won major awards (if it even won any) and can be considered a flop in the box office.



 
« Last Edit: Apr 14, 2006 at 02:52 PM by atomicat10 »

Offline Noel_Vera

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Re: Top Ten Best Filipino Flicks
« Reply #153 on: Apr 14, 2006 at 03:20 PM »
Not a big fan of Se7en but it's an interesting choice, and I'm cool with that.

If awards and box office receipts are not measurements of the quality of film then I guess you are not a fan of the Lord of the Rings Trilogy neither.

How'd you guess?

As for explanations--posted an article upthread. I explain plenty there.

Offline atomicat10

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Re: Top Ten Best Filipino Flicks
« Reply #154 on: Apr 14, 2006 at 03:47 PM »
Sir Noel, I don't think that you and indie boi are the same posters because if you are then congratulations for making 10,000 posts but seriously it's mighty fine with me if you BOTH share the same tastes and opinion about the matter.
« Last Edit: Apr 14, 2006 at 03:47 PM by atomicat10 »

Offline keating

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Re: Top Ten Best Filipino Flicks
« Reply #155 on: Apr 14, 2006 at 04:01 PM »
We are not saying that JOSE RIZAL was a complete crap, opinions really matter in this thread. I'm not a fan of Nora either, its only now that I'm discovering the gems of this great artist. There is still a brilliant moment in RELASYON, that particular scene wherein Vilma doesn't know what to do when Boyet was dying and Bernal didn't cut the scene was one of the shining moments in the movie.

But when you look back, Nora's portrayal was much heavy and riveting. Bernal even admitted on interviews when he was still alive that its a very difficult part to reckon with.
« Last Edit: Apr 14, 2006 at 04:08 PM by keating »

Offline Noel_Vera

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Re: Top Ten Best Filipino Flicks
« Reply #156 on: Apr 14, 2006 at 04:20 PM »
Me and indie boi one and the same? You flatter us both, sir! ;D

Always maintained that Vilma played a character, Nora an icon in their respective films (Relasyon vs. Himala). Ever since I've been kind of developing a more complex position on the issue, something I wrote about for that Nora concert program and the tribute book.

Oh heck--here's an excerpt:

This lack of ego is nowhere more evident than in what possibly is her most celebrated role, that of Elsa in Ishmael Bernal's "Himala." It's often cited as her finest performance; I disagree, but for a special reason. I believe the film never dives deep into Elsa's character, or makes us identify completely with her--and this, I think, was completely intentional on Bernal's part. He uses Nora as a kind of focal point, a lens through which the different townsfolk (who are almost all more sharply delineated than she) project their various fantasies and fears--an icon, in short. Nora's Elsa for them is, alternately, a charlatan, a saint, a sex object, a target, a booming religious industry; none of them quite see her as a person, and neither do we. It's a remarkably selfless performance, totally dependent on the filmmaker's concept of the film; when Bernal said that only Nora was capable of playing Elsa, he was right, but in a particular way--I doubt if any other star of comparable standing would have allowed that to be done to her.

("Nora: Through the Years…" a souvenir program for Ms. Aunor's Grand Reunion concert, April 24-25, 2004)
« Last Edit: Apr 14, 2006 at 04:22 PM by Noel_Vera »

Offline keating

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Re: Top Ten Best Filipino Flicks
« Reply #157 on: Apr 14, 2006 at 04:30 PM »
I prefer Vilma in BROKEN MARRIAGE, incidentally another Bernal masterpiece. Her argument with Boyet in that film was priceless. She's more riveting in those dialogue-driven movies. While Nora is remarkable in less dialogue-driven films.
« Last Edit: Apr 14, 2006 at 04:32 PM by keating »

Offline Noel_Vera

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Re: Top Ten Best Filipino Flicks
« Reply #158 on: Apr 14, 2006 at 04:40 PM »
I can't remember much of Broken Marriage; it's Relasyon I remember. But Broken's rep seems better than Relayson's (at least, I've heard people preferring one over the other), and I did see Relasyon several times, Broken only once.

Offline keating

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Re: Top Ten Best Filipino Flicks
« Reply #159 on: Apr 14, 2006 at 04:43 PM »
You should see BROKEN MARRIAGE again, Noel. Vilma was really brilliant in this one. Maybe because of HIMALA, the reputation of RELASYON seems to die down.

Jose Carreon's script was genuinely witty and powerful.
« Last Edit: Apr 14, 2006 at 04:47 PM by keating »

Offline Noel_Vera

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Re: Top Ten Best Filipino Flicks
« Reply #160 on: Apr 14, 2006 at 05:11 PM »
Oh, one more reason why Relasyon's so memorable--I know who it's based on. ;D

But yeah--I should see Broken Marriage again. I do remember thinking it's one of Bernal's best.

Offline keating

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Re: Top Ten Best Filipino Flicks
« Reply #161 on: Apr 14, 2006 at 06:40 PM »
Thanks for sharing about that, Noel. Was the other person involved a prominent one also?  ;)

Offline indie boi

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Re: Top Ten Best Filipino Flicks
« Reply #162 on: Apr 14, 2006 at 06:50 PM »
"I didn't liked Rizal" was WAY different from  You have categorized it like a critic and by doing so you have placed yourself in a position of expertise whose credentials and qualifications I have no idea of.

You said that Rizal was not "really" a good movie, the whys and hows you have failed to explain. Ah, I forgot, it's too masturbatory and of course your basis is what again?

If awards and box office receipts are not measurements of the quality of film then I guess you are not a fan of the Lord of the Rings Trilogy neither. ;D

Initially, I said that Rizal was good for me as well as Clinton. I just used the list of awards it won and (thanks to your box office hint) the fact that it became the most successful filipino film (box-officewise) to prove that I wasn't just being hysterical about the film, a lot of other people shared the same assessment (or was it mass hysteria? ;D)

I liked Rizal because of how it was presented, the acting performances, editing, cinematography, the freshness it gave the two books etc. The fact that it was given so many awards and did "well" in the box office were only secondary and supportive.

One of my all time favorites is Seven by Brad Pitt and the great Morgan Freeman.The film never won major awards (if it even won any) and can be considered a flop in the box office.

I had promised myself that I will not write anything substantial this holy week because frankly I've been writing too much for the last year that my body is practically begging me not to touch a keyboard even for just three days. But I feel that Atomicat's response may be worth the exception.

Regarding my comment about Rizal, whether I said I didn't like it or I said it was not good, to me the thought is the same. It's just semantics, really.

I also think that I have mentioned the reasons why I didn't like Abaya's Rizal -- most telling of which was what I had called her masturbatory goals. I call it for what it is and make no apologies for my opinions. If you want meatier reasons, here's my laundry list of complaints: Poor acting with regards to Montano and even Gloria Diaz (Pen Medina and Jaime Fabregas were so much more effective!), very loose editing (it could've been made tighter), hit and miss cinematography (there were some nice moments but overall it was all about ego again especially that establishing shot of a building where they had to use special effects to make the sky unusually blue!), and most of all the confusing hodgepodge script. I am not going to say that I am a critic because I am not. But I do have my own opinions about films and if sharing my opinion makes me a critic then I'd gladly accept the label. When it comes to good film critiques though I just read the posts of Noel and X44, I may not agree with some of their reviews but that's what makes an online forum so vibrant. You get to read different views about the films that you've seen that it ultimately enriches you and your knowledge of this art form that we all love.

Lest it be said that I am an Abaya hater let me categorically say that I loved both Karnal and Moral, although Noel has introduced a new perspective towards those two films -- being that they are more Lee's films than Abaya's, which I have come to agree with. Heck, I think I even remember reading a post from Noel saying that Abaya's Sensual is one of her better works -- a film that I absolutely hated. Again, different opinions.

Lastly, if you feel personally offended that Rizal has met with negative comments in this thread well then I say there is no intention to offend you. These are just opinions plain and simple. As Noel said, you are free to defend your opinion but this also allows me the freedom to maintain mine. And that Among the three Rizal movies -- Abaya's was the worst. Aguiluz's Rizal sa Dapitan (I loved it for its quiet restraint) and de Leon's Bayaning Third World (for its innovative deconstruction of our national hero) are better films in my opinion.

Oh, and my favorite film of all time is a toss up among Kurosawa's Ran, Brocka's Maynila Sa Kuko ng Liwanag and Kieslowski's White. And thanks for thinking that I'm Noel Vera. ;D

Now I go back to my much deserved vacation away from my keyboard...
« Last Edit: Apr 14, 2006 at 06:50 PM by indie boi »

Offline keating

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Re: Top Ten Best Filipino Flicks
« Reply #163 on: Apr 14, 2006 at 06:58 PM »
Hey indie you deserved a much needed vacation. That RIZAL flick is stressing you out.  ;D I'll probably amend again my lists, not for RIZAL but for Lino Brocka's ORAPRONOBIS.
« Last Edit: Apr 14, 2006 at 07:00 PM by keating »

Offline indie boi

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Re: Top Ten Best Filipino Flicks
« Reply #164 on: Apr 14, 2006 at 07:16 PM »
Orapronobis is really good pre. A bit over the top as Brocka goes but good nonetheless. Great script from Sir Pete Lacaba, I really fully appreciated his skills when I saw this film. I had the opportunity to watch Orapronobis during the centennial film festival in greenbelt.
« Last Edit: Apr 14, 2006 at 07:45 PM by indie boi »

Offline keating

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Re: Top Ten Best Filipino Flicks
« Reply #165 on: Apr 14, 2006 at 07:29 PM »
I'm currently watching ORAPRONOBIS, indie boi. Brocka's films are always filled with oppression, struggle and political alienation. I have yet to see a Bernal movie that has parallelisms to Brocka's political sufferings. I have so much hope for this movie, maybe even better than Lacaba's KAPIT SA PATALIM: BAYAN KO & SISTER STELLA L.
« Last Edit: Apr 14, 2006 at 07:34 PM by keating »

Offline Noel_Vera

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Re: Top Ten Best Filipino Flicks
« Reply #166 on: Apr 15, 2006 at 12:47 AM »
Thanks for sharing about that, Noel. Was the other person involved a prominent one also? ;)

The person involved wouldn't tell me the name. I do know the other person was married. And that Relasyon is the original (and better) Brokeback Mountain.

Oops. Think I said too much. ;D

indie, you should check out O'Hara's Sisa. I like Gardo there, and he was awful--well, he was hilarious--as Bonifacio in Abaya's Rizal.

Actually I don't remember liking Sensual; either you're thinking of someone else or I wasn't clear about what I said. I do think Abaya's the worst director in the world when it comes to sensuality--cannot create a single erotic image, and when she tries it falls painfully flat (compare her to Laurice Guillen, who's a far more talented filmmaker, in my opine). I'm thinking of both Sensual and Milagros (Sharmaine Arnaiz dancing half-naked, then sharing herself with three men. I felt nothing; nada) and any number of times she's tried in her other films.

I think Brutal and Moral are representative of the best of Lee's work; I like Brutal okay (except again, I think Abaya misses getting an authentic feel in Austria's story at several points, but gets Charo's story pitch-perfect), think Moral is a terrific Lee film. I suppose Karnal is also more Lee, but it's a side of him I don't like--historical/dramatic pastiche that's a touch more hysterical (and unintentionally funny) than I can take.

« Last Edit: Apr 15, 2006 at 01:16 AM by Noel_Vera »

Offline uebetan12

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Re: Top Ten Best Filipino Flicks
« Reply #167 on: Apr 15, 2006 at 08:29 AM »
my top ten:

genghis khan
jose rizal
maynila sa kuko ng liwanag
sigaw
yamacrapa: the tiger's treasure
kahit konting pagtingin
imelda
anak ng bulkan {the original version}
darna {the original version}

panday} tied
goodfather} tied
tuko sa madre cacao} tied
captain barbell} [original version of bob soler?] tied

not in particular order and i can't remember if there are movies that i have inadvertently ommitted
and/or left out

dont' believe in too much dramas coz they are not the only things which would make a movie great...di lang iyakan ang criterion para maging maganda ang movie...........


we also have e.g. production values, number of actors-mas mahirap mag direct ng maraming cast, galing ng pagkuha ng camera......

look at rashomon, the initial chapter when takashi shimura was walking through the forest , d nagsasalita pero alam mo na maganda na agad ang pelikula

Offline atomicat10

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Re: Top Ten Best Filipino Flicks
« Reply #168 on: Apr 15, 2006 at 12:24 PM »
LOL I didn't think indie boi and Noel Vera are one! ;D

Totally misread that post. I was going sarcastic (yes, anger's ugly cousin) because every reply I posted for indie boi was answered by Noel Vera as if he was the one I was...got the picture? Dang, to think I even used the quote tool. Nevermind.

To all AWARDS non-believers, I just would like to share that another one of my all time favorite films is PULP FICTION, plenty of awards. Tell me you also didn't like this one.
« Last Edit: Apr 15, 2006 at 01:47 PM by atomicat10 »

Offline keating

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Re: Top Ten Best Filipino Flicks
« Reply #169 on: Apr 15, 2006 at 01:26 PM »
Almost every person has Brocka's MAYNILA SA KUKO NG LIWANAG on their lists.

Was the flashback scenes effective in BRUTAL, Noel? I only read the book of that film but never got the chance to see the movie because of its availability.
« Last Edit: Apr 15, 2006 at 01:33 PM by keating »

Offline Noel_Vera

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Re: Top Ten Best Filipino Flicks
« Reply #170 on: Apr 15, 2006 at 05:37 PM »
I think the flashbacks in Brutal would be more effective if they were erotic. Instead, they seem to be a feminist's cartoonish idea of brutalization, not the real thing.

Pulp Fiction is fun, "Jean Luc Godard Lite" for the audiences. My favorite Tarantino is Jackie Brown.

Offline keating

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Re: Top Ten Best Filipino Flicks
« Reply #171 on: Apr 15, 2006 at 07:14 PM »
Maybe the saving grace of Abaya's BRUTAL was the great performances of Amy Austria & Gina Alajar.

Cherie Gil was also considered for the role of Cynthia which Gina got.

Offline Noel_Vera

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Re: Top Ten Best Filipino Flicks
« Reply #172 on: Apr 16, 2006 at 08:40 AM »
They're good, but Charo Santos' character was the most convincing. I think it's because she's closest to what the director knows and is familiar with.

Offline keating

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Re: Top Ten Best Filipino Flicks
« Reply #173 on: Apr 16, 2006 at 08:54 AM »
Charo Santos role was inspired by thinking woman roles by Jane Fonda during that time.

Offline indie boi

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Re: Top Ten Best Filipino Flicks
« Reply #174 on: Apr 18, 2006 at 09:53 AM »
The person involved wouldn't tell me the name. I do know the other person was married. And that Relasyon is the original (and better) Brokeback Mountain.

Oops. Think I said too much. ;D

indie, you should check out O'Hara's Sisa. I like Gardo there, and he was awful--well, he was hilarious--as Bonifacio in Abaya's Rizal.

Actually I don't remember liking Sensual; either you're thinking of someone else or I wasn't clear about what I said. I do think Abaya's the worst director in the world when it comes to sensuality--cannot create a single erotic image, and when she tries it falls painfully flat (compare her to Laurice Guillen, who's a far more talented filmmaker, in my opine). I'm thinking of both Sensual and Milagros (Sharmaine Arnaiz dancing half-naked, then sharing herself with three men. I felt nothing; nada) and any number of times she's tried in her other films.

I think Brutal and Moral are representative of the best of Lee's work; I like Brutal okay (except again, I think Abaya misses getting an authentic feel in Austria's story at several points, but gets Charo's story pitch-perfect), think Moral is a terrific Lee film. I suppose Karnal is also more Lee, but it's a side of him I don't like--historical/dramatic pastiche that's a touch more hysterical (and unintentionally funny) than I can take.

Sisa's in my list of must-see movies, Noel. Along with Babae sa Bubungang Lata, Babae sa Breakwater, and Bagong Hari. Unfortunately, I still can't find a copy of any O'Hara film locally. The only available O'Hara DVD that's available is Fatima Buen but I have a strict no-buy policy of anything with Chlamydia Queen on it, hehe. But I'm seriously reconsidering that policy though as I haven't seen an O'Hara since Bulaklak ng City Jail and Halimaw sa Banga.

Offline Noel_Vera

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Re: Top Ten Best Filipino Flicks
« Reply #175 on: Apr 18, 2006 at 10:31 AM »
Locally you mean Manila? If you check the papers they'll show them once in a while--Pelikula at Lipunan, or that Intramuros video festival,  I'm blanking out on the name here. Even UP film center shows them once in a while.

Ironically, they may be easier to get in the US, where VCDs are available from online. But doesn't Kabayan central ship locally as well?

Offline keating

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Re: Top Ten Best Filipino Flicks
« Reply #176 on: Apr 18, 2006 at 12:36 PM »
The O'Hara classics occasionally shows at Cinema One, indie boi.  :)

Offline indie boi

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Re: Top Ten Best Filipino Flicks
« Reply #177 on: Apr 18, 2006 at 05:37 PM »
The O'Hara classics occasionally shows at Cinema One, indie boi.  :)

I've never chanced on it. Whenever I go to Cinema One I only see those bad action movies or those teeny bopper flicks. I'll keep a more vigilant eye next time. Thanks!

Offline Noel_Vera

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Re: Top Ten Best Filipino Flicks
« Reply #178 on: Apr 18, 2006 at 05:50 PM »
They're full of cuts, especially the more violent and sexually explicit ones, but that's better than nothing. That said, Sky One, the monthly cable schedule of Cinema One, was always required reading for me.

Offline keating

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Re: Top Ten Best Filipino Flicks
« Reply #179 on: Apr 18, 2006 at 07:45 PM »
I've never chanced on it. Whenever I go to Cinema One I only see those bad action movies or those teeny bopper flicks. I'll keep a more vigilant eye next time. Thanks!

They usually show the classics at 3pm or at midnight sometimes. Don't bother their primetime sked, the movies are not really good. And yeah their films now are badly mutilated and mangled. But as Noel said, that's better than nothing. They show Abaya's MORAL before with few cuts.  ;)