Topic: Diff in character between a Technics 1200 & other TT

[JoeyGS]

To all who have extensive experience in both turntables, what would you say would be the difference in sonic performance?

This is not in anyway saying one is better than the other, but, more on each other's strengths and weaknesses.

The other TT would be like the Thorens, Luxman and the like. To narrow down the choices for the other TTs, let's not include other TTs which are over Php75k. Plesae feel free to suggest as I am not totally sure if this is the right level of gear/s to consider in the analysis.

I am yet to start my venture into the analog world but would like first to get your opinion on this.

Thanks and regards,
JoeyGS

[stereophile]

JoeyGS- The SONIC performance is dependent on the CARTRIDGE mounted and not the machine. The phonostage used also affects the sonic character. WHat you get with a 1200 is it's built-like-a-tank quality/robustness. Speed is quartz-locked stable, it has a very nice sliding pitch, and a strobe. Because of the universal headshell, swapping carts is made easier.

Other audiophiles don't like a DD ttable, because of 'rumble'. I own two 1200s. I can tell you that the DD motor in the 1200 is one of the quietest. Some say too that the tonearm is the limiting factor. This is the reason why others mod it with a Rega tonearm to be able to mount a better cartridge. You do lose the ability to swap headshells.

I own other ttables: belt drives & idler drives. They each have their own characters. There is no one perfect ttable. If I had to KEEP ONLY ONE, I'd choose a SL-1200 anyday. Reason being, it's robust build quality, ease of use, universal headshell and because, it is a cult classic. More expensive ttable will extract mre detail because of the matching carts used.

If I had to put it all in one sentence, it would be: Technics SL-1200s are FUN to use.

[JoeyGS]

In your experience what is the best matching cart for the 1200 that would produce the best detail with:  a) using it's stock tone arm?  b) using the rega tone arm?

Thanks for your insights. I know I can depend on your experience and expertise in TT.

Kind regards,

JoeyGS

[stereophile]

There is no one cart which is best for the 1200 bcoz we each have different associated gears and tastes. It's like cooking a dish. We both may have the basic fresh chicken, but depending on the ingredients on hand, we may end up cooking it a different way. It also depends on your taste. If you want a warm sound, you'd have to get a warm sounding cart. Bottomline, I wouldn't exceed the cost of the 1200 for the cart choice. Carts I've tried are Shure M44-7, Shure V15xMR(phased out), Grado Red, Grado Gold, Denon 103, AT 440mLA, etc carts. Take your pick. I mount each cart on a separate headshell and swap them when I tire of the sound. It's all about system matching. The best and easiest way to change the sound of your analog system is to change cartridges. Just make sure your phono can handle them. If you are using built-in phono of a receiver, then your stuck with MMs unless you use a step-up tranny. If you use a high output MC, then most outboard phonos with active MCs will work. Its when you want to use a low out put MC that the chioce of phono becomes limited and expensive. Besides, you won't mount an expensive low output MC on a 1200.

As to mounting a rega arm, You have more options for carts. Dynavector 10x5, Denon DL-103/R, Dyna 17D3/XX2? Choices increase. You will have to use a new armboard to mount the Rega arm like that made by Origin Live.

In my listening room, I have 5 ttables/6 tonearms set-up right now to play on the fly. Why? Because no one cart/tonearm/ttable combo is the best for ALL RECORDINGS. Sometimes you tire of how it sounds. Rather than keep swapping carts, just put the LP on another ttable and play it. I know, it's costly, but the ttables were acquired slowly over the years. Rather than let the idle in storage, I put them to use.

[JoeyGS]

Simple and well said......Thanks a bunch

Regards,

JoeyGS

[allan1836]

JoeyGS- The SONIC performance is dependent on the CARTRIDGE mounted and not the machine. The phonostage used also affects the sonic character. WHat you get with a 1200 is it's built-like-a-tank quality/robustness. Speed is quartz-locked stable, it has a very nice sliding pitch, and a strobe. Because of the universal headshell, swapping carts is made easier.

Other audiophiles don't like a DD ttable, because of 'rumble'. I own two 1200s. I can tell you that the DD motor in the 1200 is one of the quietest. Some say too that the tonearm is the limiting factor. This is the reason why others mod it with a Rega tonearm to be able to mount a better cartridge. You do lose the ability to swap headshells.

I own other ttables: belt drives & idler drives. They each have their own characters. There is no one perfect ttable. If I had to KEEP ONLY ONE, I'd choose a SL-1200 anyday. Reason being, it's robust build quality, ease of use, universal headshell and because, it is a cult classic. More expensive ttable will extract mre detail because of the matching carts used.

If I had to put it all in one sentence, it would be: Technics SL-1200s are FUN to use.

Sir stereophile, I am monitoring this thread intently since I am also just starting out with tt and I would just want to ask if, when you said tt sq depends on the cartridge, does this mean I can go by with a entry level tt but use a mid-end cartridge too good effect? Also, if I use the same cartridge on two different tt, one is entry level and the other higher end, will they produce more or less the same sound quality?   TIA 

[av_phile1]

Obtaining great sonics from a TT is not just a matter of getting a high end cartridge for your  TT.  Whether high end or low end TT, your sonics will greatly depend on observing the interactive dynamics between tone arm and cartridge, tonearm and platter, and with the phono preamp.  A high end cartridge set with the wrong tracking force will increase skating force that will worsen the sonics and needlessly degrade your record grooves. Just to mention one of those you need to look into.   

Getting the most of a TT is not a plug and play proposition.  TT audiophiles spend a lot of time tinkering with their TT adjustments.    I suggest you reasearch a little more on TT operation.  Learn about vertical, tangential, lateral and skating forces your stylus acts on the grooves. Learn about stylus geometries and cantilever compliance and how they affect the sonics, tonearm construction and geometries, how pivot, bearing and gimbal mounted tonearms affect sonics as well as the mass and shape of your tonearms.  Research on how LPs are mastered and the pros and cons of using pivoted versus linear tracking tonearms.  Learn about why a massive platter makes for the least rumble and how differing TT base resonances can alter the sonic character of your TT.  I assure you, if you are truly interested, learning about and applying the dynamics of TT can be fulfilling in this hobby.  And quite expensive.   

BTW, the technics SL-1200 and its improved 1200 mk2 is the de facto choice of most radio and disco disc jockeys worldwide ever since that model series came out in 1972.     It's arguably the most popular TT of all time and is considered a legendary 20th Century audio artifact on its own.  The latest is mk6 if not mistaken.