Author Topic: The Plasma Thread  (Read 101668 times)

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Offline nerveblocker

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Re: The Plasma Thread
« Reply #540 on: Jul 10, 2014 at 05:08 AM »
Is it still worthwhile to buy plasma now even if it's phased out already? Magiging disposable na sya if it conks out?

Offline revskie

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Re: The Plasma Thread
« Reply #541 on: Jul 10, 2014 at 07:49 AM »
Well you still have a two year warranty for that.

Offline Clondalkin

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Re: The Plasma Thread
« Reply #542 on: Jul 10, 2014 at 08:06 AM »
There should be some risks for sure because local service centers would have to import parts from Japan or Korea or Singapore in order to do repairs.  Parts should be available outside the Phils for sure - at least 5 years from now I think.  Kaso how much would it cost after warranty expires.  Might be a good idea to get extended maker's warranty if the cost is reasonable.  Kung masira man Plasma, I think Panasonic or Samsung would provide you a replacement LED instead.


Is it still worthwhile to buy plasma now even if it's phased out already? Magiging disposable na sya if it conks out?

Offline barrister

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Re: The Plasma Thread
« Reply #543 on: Jul 10, 2014 at 09:37 AM »
Is it still worthwhile to buy plasma now even if it's phased out already? Magiging disposable na sya if it conks out?

Sa Philippines, halos pareho rin.

Madalas akong makabasa sa Samsung threads, medyo bago pa yung LED TV, wala na agad makuhang parts ang Sammy Phils., offer na lang sila ng new model replacement, but you have to pay an additional amount.  Ewan ko lang kung wala talagang ma-import na parts, o wala lang parts on hand at tinatamad mag import.

Kung nawawalan ng parts ang TV na hindi phased out, mawalan man ng parts ang TV na phased out, pareho rin pala ang mangyayari ke phased out man o hindi.

Kung masira man Plasma, I think Panasonic or Samsung would provide you a replacement LED instead.

Tama.  Mauuwi ka rin sa LED pag unrepairable ang plasma.  Pero at least lumigaya ka naman habang hindi nasisira ang plasma, imbis na sumula't sapol ay nagtiyaga ka na sa LED.  ;)


Reasonable pa rin yung price.   Kahit bilhin sa US ng approx. $1,800, I think additional $300 at least para madala yung unit sa Manila - and hopefully it gets there without any damage.  Anyway, good luck this time and let us know.

Yes, ok pa rin ang price.  Hindi ako mahilig sa US imports, iniiwasan ko ang 120 volts, so out of the question sa akin ang imports.

Ngayong wala nang plasma, ayos din kahit medyo mahal. 

Sa mga mahilig sa large plasmas, may Panny 64VT60 sa Listening Megamall (not displayed), US import labeled as 120 volts, but actually multi volt, P190k.

Medyo kinikilabutan ako sa presyo, pero ok na rin siguro kasi wala ka na talagang makukuhang ganong kagandang TV.
« Last Edit: Jul 10, 2014 at 09:40 AM by barrister »

Offline skooter

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Re: The Plasma Thread
« Reply #544 on: Jul 10, 2014 at 09:44 AM »

80k.  Post na lang ako pag ok na talaga.  Ayoko na magkuwento, baka mintis na naman... :P
for sure brand new talaga yan, 80k is much more realistic for a premium TV like these and there should be 2yrs. warranty too.

Offline barrister

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Re: The Plasma Thread
« Reply #545 on: Jul 10, 2014 at 10:29 AM »
I never thought of it that way.  Iniisip ko, mura kasi walang buyer.
 
Tama, parang totoo na nga ito ...
« Last Edit: Jul 10, 2014 at 10:29 AM by barrister »

Offline revskie

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Re: The Plasma Thread
« Reply #546 on: Jul 10, 2014 at 01:41 PM »
I had the chance to check this model in 51 and 64 inch sizes at Ansons Ayala a while ago.  It really is an awesome plasma tv.  Picture quality is crisp with very accurate colors.  Saw it side by side with the 60F5500 and you can just see the difference.  60F5500 pixels are visible at about 3-4 feet from the display.  The F8500s are just smooth as silk! 

Offline revskie

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Re: The Plasma Thread
« Reply #547 on: Jul 10, 2014 at 01:46 PM »
Another thing to note is that the louvre filter thingy that barrister was explaining was very obvious.  The 51 inch was put in a pedestal that was about 18inches from the ground and getting close to it looking down made the picture unviewable.

Offline nerveblocker

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Re: The Plasma Thread
« Reply #548 on: Jul 10, 2014 at 01:55 PM »
Kung masira man Plasma, I think Panasonic or Samsung would provide you a replacement LED instead.



I just dunno if they would do that here in PI. In terms of price per screen size, plasma is the more practical choice. Baka biglang sabihin ng distributer when you claim warranty "kaya namin binenta ng mura yung plasma kasi phased out models na. Bili ka nalang ng LED"
« Last Edit: Jul 10, 2014 at 02:27 PM by nerveblocker »

Offline barrister

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Re: The Plasma Thread
« Reply #549 on: Jul 10, 2014 at 05:21 PM »

Here's an opportunity to discuss plasma tech rather than plasma marketing:

 
====================================


I had the chance to check this model in 51 and 64 inch sizes at Ansons Ayala a while ago.  It really is an awesome plasma tv.  Picture quality is crisp with very accurate colors.  Saw it side by side with the 60F5500 and you can just see the difference.  60F5500 pixels are visible at about 3-4 feet from the display.  The F8500s are just smooth as silk!

60F5500 is not 1080p.  The Samsung plasma line is unique because the 60 inchers are usually PenTile screens rather than 1080p screens.

Here's my old old post on Sammy PenTile plasma panels:

For panel sizes larger than 50", you'd think that resolutions have nowhere to go but up.  ... Not.

Surpisingly, in 2012 Samsung came up with two 60 inch plasmas that are not Full HD --- the 60 inch PenTile panels of the 60E550 and 60E530.  It's more power-efficient, but expectedly produces an inferior picture.  What's more puzzling is that Samsung won't even tell us what the resolution is.  All they're saying is that it "reproduces FHD-like experience."  :P

http://ramsaysmarthomes.ca/info/Samsung%202012%20Panel%20Chart.pdf

The footnote reads: *Samsung’s Pentile Panel reproduces FHD-like experience utilizing sub-pixel rendering technology, making it 40% energy efficient over last year’s 59” comparable model.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PenTile_matrix_family

For 2014, Sammy made a 64 inch PenTile plasma (not yet available in the Phils.):
 

Samsung PN64H5000 (USA) Plasma TV Review
By David Mackenzie 14 March 2014 Verdict: Recommended




... Overall, we think the Samsung PN64H5000 is going to put smiles on the faces of self-emissive display fans, at a time where there’s precious little other good news (Samsung seems to have one foot out of bed with OLED at the moment, and we don’t have to remind anyone about Panasonic’s recent decision).

The “elephant in the room” is the pentile subpixel layout, which observant users might find to be an acquired taste at this screen size.

http://www.hdtvtest.co.uk/news/pn64h5000-201403143657.htm

 
But still, PenTile aside, they do say the F8500 really is very sharp, even on a 1080p vs 1080p comparison.
 
On avsforum, when they compare the F8500 with the ZT60, they say the F8500 is sharper.  Not necessarily a good thing, depending on how you look at it.
 
The negative side of the Sammy's sharpness, they say, is a more digital-looking picture than Panny.  The positive side of Panny's less-sharp picture is an analog look --- that is to say, a more natural-looking pic.   
 


===================================
 
 

Another thing to note is that the louvre filter thingy that barrister was explaining was very obvious.  The 51 inch was put in a pedestal that was about 18inches from the ground and getting close to it looking down made the picture unviewable.

On my demo unit, the louvre filter darkening does not appear from normal viewing distances, because the vertical angle of view does not become large enough from a normal viewing distance. 

But when you are about 2 feet from the screen, it's easy to view the screen with a big vertical viewing angle, maybe around 40 degrees or more, causing severe darkening of the screen.

This will not be an issue for regular-distance viewing, but it will be an issue for kids who like to sit on the floor and up close to the screen.

This is not unique to Samsung.  Panny plasmas also had louvre filters, starting with the ST model up to the ZT model.
« Last Edit: Jul 10, 2014 at 10:36 PM by barrister »

Offline Waxx

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Re: The Plasma Thread
« Reply #550 on: Jul 10, 2014 at 07:06 PM »
good luck atty barrister.. naiirita ako in a way kasi nga nabigyan ka ng demo unit.. buti nalang hindi ka nila binigyan ng sakit sa ulo sa process ng return/refund.. may kinalaman kaya na dahil atty ka?

anyways.. kung meron lang talanga 75in and above na plasma na high end.. pero kapresyo ng LED.. yan ang kukunin ko....

sad to say.... wala akong makita..

Offline barrister

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Re: The Plasma Thread
« Reply #551 on: Jul 10, 2014 at 07:30 PM »
Hindi nila alam, wala akong sinabi na atty ako.

I just presented my position very clearly.  Hindi na kailangan ng takutan, mababait naman ang staff.
 
Kung yung nagbenta sa akin ay parang may naka-ready agad na sagot na pangontra, medyo magdududa ako.  Pero sa tingin ko parang napahiya pa nga sa nangyari.  Yung boss niya, very accommodating and ready to listen.
 
I just made sure my presentation would clearly show my basis for saying that the TV was a demo unit.  I saved my best argument for last --- my TV had a round, yellow "SM" sticker on the right edge --- a sticker that they attach on the right edge of all demo units.  Nagtinginan yung dalawang kausuap ko... sabi nung isa, "demo nga..."  :D 

Wala ngang 75 inches.  Pero nag research ako sa Samsung F8500, mas trouble-free ang 51.  Pag 60 and 64, may mga problema. Palagay ko, kung may 75, mas lalong maraming problema.

The way I see it, if you want a screen bigger than 60", you need a front projector.
« Last Edit: Oct 21, 2014 at 04:58 PM by barrister »

Offline Clondalkin

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Re: The Plasma Thread
« Reply #552 on: Jul 10, 2014 at 09:30 PM »
If your TV is still under maker's warranty, they would likely make you that offer if they don't want to go through the hassles of repair.  In case of Panasonic, I think meron talagang spare parts kung level ng ST to VT series.   Samsung ang parang hindi type mag-maintain ng parts inventory because its costly and, they have toooooo many models, although the 8500 is pretty unique.

Like barrister posted, you get to enjoy the Plasma first (hopefully for a reasonably long time) before you're forced to get an LED.

I just dunno if they would do that here in PI. In terms of price per screen size, plasma is the more practical choice. Baka biglang sabihin ng distributer when you claim warranty "kaya namin binenta ng mura yung plasma kasi phased out models na. Bili ka nalang ng LED"

Offline anchit

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Re: The Plasma Thread
« Reply #553 on: Jul 12, 2014 at 12:03 AM »
Bad news, guys. SM gave me a demo unit.

ouch yan sir! im sure very excited ka na. i hope the new one wil arrive very soon. ;)

Ako same day ng delivery ng TV ko yung delivery ng first baby namen, so same sila ng birthdate. No one was home to receive the delivery, iniwan ko wife ko at si baby sa hospital para lang ireceive yung TV ko hahaha, mas excited pa daw ako sa TV.
« Last Edit: Jul 15, 2014 at 02:39 PM by anchit »
The handsomest and the happiest ;b

Offline mrclark

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Re: The Plasma Thread
« Reply #554 on: Jul 12, 2014 at 11:51 PM »
Just bought a Samsung 43F4500 in SM appliance in Greenhills.  32900 less 50% off.
Although will pick the unit by end of AUgust pa since hindi pa tapos renovation ng condo unit where I plan to install/wall mount the TV.

Can anyone send me the link on where I can test or know if the unit is a demo unit, and to check for dead pixels?
I read it somewhere although I can't remember the thread.

Thanks in advance.
« Last Edit: Jul 13, 2014 at 07:20 AM by sardaukar »

Offline barrister

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Re: The Plasma Thread
« Reply #555 on: Jul 14, 2014 at 10:34 AM »
Dumating na yung Samsung technician.
 
Findings:
 
- Physical condition --- with scratches, dust, masking tape and double tape marks, and an "SM" sticker on the unit. 
 
- The technician accessed the service menu.  Service hours = 2,920 hours.     
 
- I showed him a white slide on-screen.  Finding: "with screen burn mark." 
« Last Edit: Jul 14, 2014 at 10:41 AM by barrister »

Offline mrclark

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Re: The Plasma Thread
« Reply #556 on: Jul 14, 2014 at 12:33 PM »
Dumating na yung Samsung technician.
 
Findings:
 
- Physical condition --- with scratches, dust, masking tape and double tape marks, and an "SM" sticker on the unit. 
 
- The technician accessed the service menu.  Service hours = 2,920 hours.     
 
- I showed him a white slide on-screen.  Finding: "with screen burn mark." 

iyong Service Hours ilan dapat bago mo masabi na demo unit nga?
dapat ba zero para masabing brand new iyong stock?

Offline mars

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Re: The Plasma Thread
« Reply #557 on: Jul 14, 2014 at 12:38 PM »
Dumating na yung Samsung technician.
 
Findings:
 
- Physical condition --- with scratches, dust, masking tape and double tape marks, and an "SM" sticker on the unit. 
 
- The technician accessed the service menu.  Service hours = 2,920 hours.     
 
- I showed him a white slide on-screen.  Finding: "with screen burn mark." 

Sorry for your experience. Dapat talaga palitan yan ng bago.

Offline barrister

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Re: The Plasma Thread
« Reply #558 on: Jul 14, 2014 at 01:01 PM »
Sorry for your experience. Dapat talaga palitan yan ng bago.

Tama.  Siguradong display unit.  Walang stock ang SM, kaya refund ang agreement namin.  Ang rule nila sa replacement, dapat replace with SM's stock on hand.


iyong Service Hours ilan dapat bago mo masabi na demo unit nga?
dapat ba zero para masabing brand new iyong stock?

Hindi naman kailangang zero.  Puwedeng na test sa factory, hindi na zero yon, pero ok na rin kung konting hours lang. 

Wala namang rule kung ilang hours dapat.

But in my case, 2,920 hours divided by 24 hours, 121 days yon.  6 days pa lang sa akin ang unit.  Sobrang dami ng service hours para masabi mong factory testing lang.

Besides, may maliit na round yellow sticker ng SM sa gilid.  Sa demo unit lang nilalagay ng SM yon. Malinaw na display unit talaga.
« Last Edit: Jul 14, 2014 at 01:04 PM by barrister »

Offline mars

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Re: The Plasma Thread
« Reply #559 on: Jul 14, 2014 at 01:18 PM »
Surely demo unit nga yun. But then, the way I look at it, 121 pa lang days nagamit based sa number of hours, and yet, marami nang problema, especially yung burn mark. Baka naman maski new unit yun, magkakaroon din ng problem within a few months. It could be a batch or model problem.

Glad you got a refund so you can look for a better TV model.

Offline barrister

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Re: The Plasma Thread
« Reply #560 on: Jul 14, 2014 at 01:20 PM »
Just bought a Samsung 43F4500 in SM appliance in Greenhills. 32900 less 50% off.
Although will pick the unit by end of AUgust pa since hindi pa tapos renovation ng condo unit where I plan to install/wall mount the TV.

Can anyone send me the link on where I can test or know if the unit is a demo unit, and to check for dead pixels?
I read it somewhere although I can't remember the thread.

Thanks in advance.


Try the Evangelos plasma break-in DVD (free):

http://www.eaprogramming.com/downloads/download_main.htm


Or the AVS HD 709 calibration patterns (free):

http://www.avsforum.com/forum/139-display-calibration/948496-avs-hd-709-blu-ray-mp4-calibration.html


A real dead pixel tester is DPB (Dead Pixel Buddy, also freeware), but you'll need a laptop, since it's a Windows app (executable file) :

http://www.softpedia.com/get/System/Benchmarks/Dead-Pixel-Buddy.shtml
« Last Edit: Jul 14, 2014 at 01:43 PM by barrister »

Offline barrister

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Re: The Plasma Thread
« Reply #561 on: Jul 14, 2014 at 01:27 PM »
Surely demo unit nga yun. But then, the way I look at it, 121 pa lang days nagamit based sa number of hours, and yet, marami nang problema, especially yung burn mark. Baka naman maski new unit yun, magkakaroon din ng problem within a few months. It could be a batch or model problem.

Glad you got a refund so you can look for a better TV model.

Hindi siguro batch problem, nagulpi lang sa demo use ng SM.
 
121 days nga lang, pero hindi normal use yon.
 
That was vivid mode (actually shop mode) from the time SM opens in the morning until it closes at night, every day for about 1 year (2,920 hours divided by 10 hours a day = 292 days), with Samsung logos non-stop on both sides of the screen. 
 
Yung Samsung logos ang nag image burn (or maybe serious long-term IR).

Meron na kong kausap, new unit talaga.  Unit was stocked on the store premises.  Pinakita sa akin, tunay na sealed box, with only one layer of clear tape on top (walang patong na 2nd clear tape for resealing).  Binuksan, bago talaga.  I took a picture of the serial number at the back panel of the unit, to verify upon delivery if I got the same unit.
« Last Edit: Jul 14, 2014 at 03:02 PM by barrister »

Offline mars

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Re: The Plasma Thread
« Reply #562 on: Jul 14, 2014 at 02:25 PM »
I hope that your new unit will not have any problems. I've been using my plasma (different brand) for over 3 years now. Awa ng Diyos, wala naman problema.
« Last Edit: Jul 14, 2014 at 02:26 PM by mars »

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Re: The Plasma Thread
« Reply #563 on: Jul 14, 2014 at 03:31 PM »
whispers to atty barrister... "(oled, oled oled oled.... oled... oled...!!)"

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Re: The Plasma Thread
« Reply #564 on: Jul 14, 2014 at 03:43 PM »

Try the Evangelos plasma break-in DVD (free):

http://www.eaprogramming.com/downloads/download_main.htm


Or the AVS HD 709 calibration patterns (free):

http://www.avsforum.com/forum/139-display-calibration/948496-avs-hd-709-blu-ray-mp4-calibration.html


A real dead pixel tester is DPB (Dead Pixel Buddy, also freeware), but you'll need a laptop, since it's a Windows app (executable file) :

http://www.softpedia.com/get/System/Benchmarks/Dead-Pixel-Buddy.shtml

Thank you Barrister for the link  :)

Offline barrister

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Re: The Plasma Thread
« Reply #565 on: Jul 14, 2014 at 04:57 PM »
whispers to atty barrister... "(oled, oled oled oled.... oled... oled...!!)"


 :D   Kung puwede lang sana... Pero hindi puwede for 2 reasons:

1.  I can't afford it - Too expensive, yet your money does not go to the TV itself.  A big chunk of the selling price covers manufacturing wastage, since about 70% of manufactured panels are defective and have to be thrown away.

2.  Still with serious technical problems - Prone to burn-in and/or IR; prone to dead pixels; nobody knows how long the blue pixel life will last; sample-and-hold drive method causes LCD-like motion blur; off-axis viewing causes color shift to yellow.

Plasma pa rin ang best flat panel tech sa ngayon.  Pero kayang-kayang talunin ng OLED yan.  Ang problema lang ay kailan pa kaya?
« Last Edit: Jul 14, 2014 at 09:37 PM by barrister »

Offline revskie

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Re: The Plasma Thread
« Reply #566 on: Jul 14, 2014 at 06:15 PM »
Atty, easily accessible ba yung menu to check the usage hours?

Offline barrister

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Re: The Plasma Thread
« Reply #567 on: Jul 14, 2014 at 06:56 PM »
Madali lang.  May dala siyang maliit na Samsung remote, press access code. Service menu ang binuksan niya.  Hindi ko inalam ang service menu code, delikado kasi yon.

Ang safe ay hindi service menu, yung limited access lang, called MRT ("Mains Running Time"). Hindi ko pa na try, pero ang alam ko ay: Mute-7-3-7-Enter.
« Last Edit: Jul 14, 2014 at 07:04 PM by barrister »

Offline revskie

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Re: The Plasma Thread
« Reply #568 on: Jul 14, 2014 at 10:40 PM »
Thanks much!

Offline raptor

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Re: The Plasma Thread
« Reply #569 on: Jul 15, 2014 at 01:03 AM »
Tama.  Siguradong display unit.  Walang stock ang SM, kaya refund ang agreement namin.  Ang rule nila sa replacement, dapat replace with SM's stock on hand.


Hindi naman kailangang zero.  Puwedeng na test sa factory, hindi na zero yon, pero ok na rin kung konting hours lang. 

Wala namang rule kung ilang hours dapat.

But in my case, 2,920 hours divided by 24 hours, 121 days yon.  6 days pa lang sa akin ang unit.  Sobrang dami ng service hours para masabi mong factory testing lang.

Besides, may maliit na round yellow sticker ng SM sa gilid.  Sa demo unit lang nilalagay ng SM yon. Malinaw na display unit talaga.

walang duda sir na demo nga yan, after reading this, I checked my Samsung 51f5000 ... Sept. 2013 ko nabili, nasa 1,400+ pa lang usaga hours

@revskie, madali lang check - while on standby, press Info > Menu > Mute > Power ... note that in sequence lang pag-press, hindi sabay-sabay ... go to "SVC" and the usage hours will be displayed ... warning not to change anything on any of the menus as it may brick the tv according to the forum that i read
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