Topic: pixellation

[antikryst]

is this normal with lcd tvs? auditioned the new sharp and samsung 32"ers using the stores sharp dvd player and my dvds via component cables.

i noticed pixellation...real bad pixellation. is it a problem of my dvds or the players?

displays look really good when they use their own equipment...even those connected to demo dvds via component but my dvds looked bad. i used concert dvds i got from the US btw.

[el-el]

pixellations usually, dahil di maganda quality ng media being played... or can be the player itself din...

Just to give you an idea: a fairly encoded DVD movie should be at about 6-9MBPS when uncompressed... their demo discs are about 20-50MBPS.... 

[antikryst]

ahhh. whats a good dvd movie to use as a tester?

[barrister]

A good test DVD should be the type you will be watching most often. 

If you like concert DVDs, you should use concert DVDs for your demos.

Those in-store demos are usually useless.  Who's going to watch videos of flowers and tropical fish on his new flat panel at home?
 

[antikryst]

thats why i brought my concert dvds...pixellated nga lang. probably the player.

[el-el]

thats why i brought my concert dvds...pixellated nga lang. probably the player.

a lot of concert DVDs are not recorded on HD (or DVD quality man lang)... They are usually on interlaced format (not progressive) which may appear as pixellated (especially on fast moving scenes) when viewed on a progressive display...   

[ericag_ph]

You can use the same demo disc, ask them to use a different player...like a pioneer 490V...that works very well with hard to read source discs.

thats why i brought my concert dvds...pixellated nga lang. probably the player.

[barrister]

a lot of concert DVDs are not recorded on HD (or DVD quality man lang)... They are usually on interlaced format (not progressive) which may appear as pixellated (especially on fast moving scenes) when viewed on a progressive display...   

That's right.  Concerts are usually intended for TV broadcast.  Older ones are shot on videotape in fullscreen format; very few are shot on film in anamorphic widescreen.  Pixellation and mosquito noise are common artifacts from the source disc itself.

Sir antikryst is probably familiar with that particular disc's appearance on CRT TVs, where he had no complaints about pixellation because although the artifact was also present, it was not noticeable.  The problem is that the pixellation/ macroblocking might have been more obvious on the LCD.

[antikryst]

yep. these are new concerts though which are shot in widescreen. 2005 concerts to be exact. bought these in the states and watched these in an old 40+" that my tito had there...dont think it was hd ready though

one concert was shot in the royal opera house....and the background was mainly dark...this part was all pixellated. better bring some movies na rin for testing :p

[barrister]

one concert was shot in the royal opera house....and the background was mainly dark...this part was all pixellated.

Pixellation on dark scenes is usually caused by the encoding on the DVD itself, not the panel.

Pixellation on fast motion is sometimes caused by mpeg compression, sometimes by the LCD TV's bad video processing software.



Notice pixellation on the 39 jersey.  Slow response time causes the trail you see on the player on the right.

better bring some movies na rin for testing :p

Sa movies, try Pirates of the Caribbean 2 & Casino Royale.  Good bitrate, high contrast and high saturation.

[av_phile1]

Pixellation is just another compression artifact common in the early mpeg1 (vcd) and mpeg2 (dvd) formats and becomes obvious on large screens.  Video compression removes some data the processing algorhthm judges as unneccesary to reduce file size but can be objectionably obvious on large screens.  It's like looking at a small JPG image file magnified or digitally zoomed to fit your computer screen; you see pixels.  But it can look just fine without digital zooming.

That is why high definition became a necessity.  The 640 x 480 mpeg2 res of DVD is just fine on screens below 29"  but gets pretty pixelated as you increase the screen size.  Until it becomes totally unwatchable on LCDs and Plasmas starting at 32".   Upscaling can do wonders though, but the images get softer as the upscaling gets higher beyond, say, a 42" screen.  LCDs and Plasmas are not as forgiving on low res sources as CRT's interlaced technology which also benefits from line doublers at screen sizes above 29"

   

[antikryst]

im pretty well versed on resolutions and compression as i used to be a graphics artist but the thing with hd is that its different. actually low res lang ang hd movies but they look nice even on big 40" up screens!

so i guess this has something to do with the player decoding the dvd and outputing it to the hdtv? tama ba? dvds are not high res if i am correct but some dvds play well on hdtvs?

[barrister]

Pixellation on fast motion is sometimes caused by mpeg compression, sometimes by the LCD TV's bad video processing software.

Relevant to my post above is sir eijneb's observation, re: 37" Samsung vs 37" Sharp in another thread:

... samsung 37R81B is my 2nd option.

pero when i demoed side by side with PX5M, nalito na ako! pareho silang may mga differences, example: superman returns R1, sa R81B pixelated sya during the plane chasing scenes, sa PX5M smooth sya...

Same R1 Superman Returns DVD disc, presumably on a single player connected to 2 LCD TVs.  One pixellates, the other does not.  The smoother picture could be due to superior video processing software on the Sharp LCD.

[scofield]

hi share ko lang experience ko. just bought sharp aqous lcd tv. during the demo pansin ko ang pangit muntik ko na nga di bilihin. ayaw rin nila gumamit ng ibang dvd player. pero tinuloy ko pa rin ang purchase ko, kase ganda ng price at hoping ako na baka pag bumili ako ng hdmi player na nag uupscale eh gaganda rin. pero nung kinabit ko sa dvd ko sa bahay (pioneer) via component progressive input. wow ang ganda pala! suwabeng swabe...

dapat siguro mag dala ka ng mga gamit mo when auditioning bukod sa mga dvd magdala ka na rin ng player at cables mo. para makita mo kung anong gusto mo. kase ang mga dala ko lang eh dvds. ayaw naman nilang pumayag na gumamit ng ibang player bukod dun sa ginagamit nila.

[barrister]

Hmmm...   Magandang observation yan.  Baka nga player lang ang problema ....   

[scofield]

maari...or baka excited lang ako hehehehe. basta iba dun sa showroom. pwede rin siguro yung distance mo dun sa tv....

[ericag_ph]

wow, if they don't want to try a different player...talk to the sales guy's  manager  let's see if that
changes his motivation.  or I'd go to a different shop.    makes me think they will be just as accomodating
when trying to get support or claiming a warranty.

I'd say the sales guy was lazy, such a small/tiny effort on his daily routine when selling a P100-200K TV

hi share ko lang experience ko. just bought sharp aqous lcd tv. during the demo pansin ko ang pangit muntik ko na nga di bilihin. ayaw rin nila gumamit ng ibang dvd player. pero tinuloy ko pa rin ang purchase ko, kase ganda ng price at hoping ako na baka pag bumili ako ng hdmi player na nag uupscale eh gaganda rin. pero nung kinabit ko sa dvd ko sa bahay (pioneer) via component progressive input. wow ang ganda pala! suwabeng swabe...

[scofield]

exactly mga tamad nga. i tried to go to other shop pero hindi ko makuha yung price na binigay sa akin dun eh. kaya ayun. dun ko na kinuha yung tv ko.