Author Topic: Atheism/Agnosticism in the Philippines  (Read 84859 times)

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Offline dpogs

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Re: Atheism/Agnosticism in the Philippines
« Reply #1230 on: Feb 03, 2015 at 08:24 AM »
you cant event use the term "emphaty" in terms of human evolution...
There is none righteous, no not one.

Offline leomarley

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Re: Atheism/Agnosticism in the Philippines
« Reply #1231 on: Feb 03, 2015 at 08:48 AM »
Ano kinalaman nun? Smh

Offline dpogs

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Re: Atheism/Agnosticism in the Philippines
« Reply #1232 on: Feb 03, 2015 at 09:10 AM »
emphaty - no place in the process of evolution
There is none righteous, no not one.

Offline leomarley

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Re: Atheism/Agnosticism in the Philippines
« Reply #1233 on: Feb 03, 2015 at 09:38 AM »
i'm having what you're smoking

Offline dpogs

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Re: Atheism/Agnosticism in the Philippines
« Reply #1234 on: Feb 03, 2015 at 10:21 AM »
kailan natuto ang tao ng "emphaty" in terms of evolutionary process?
kailan natuto ang tao ng "mercy/compassion" in terms of evolutionary process?

in atheist worldview? kailan natuto ang human species na killing is bad?
There is none righteous, no not one.

Offline Nelson de Leon

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Re: Atheism/Agnosticism in the Philippines
« Reply #1235 on: Feb 03, 2015 at 11:24 AM »
in atheist worldview? kailan natuto ang human species na killing is bad?

Magandang tanong yan. Hindi kaya sa naramdaman na sorrow sa loss or death of a person?

Offline leomarley

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Re: Atheism/Agnosticism in the Philippines
« Reply #1236 on: Feb 03, 2015 at 07:42 PM »
Ang personal standard of empathy can also be construed depende sa kina-lakihan mo. Minsan may effect din ang morals mo as to how you will understand what another person/s is experiencing. It seems to be interwoven.

Not really. Empathy is putting yourself in the shoes of those you affect. If you don't know or misconstrued the feelings of others then you lack or have no empathy. That means you're a narcissist or, at worst, maybe even a psychopath. It cannot be molded by your environment but your ability on how to empathize may be. It's either you can or cannot empathize and it is not subjective in any way.
« Last Edit: Feb 03, 2015 at 09:22 PM by leomarley »

Offline Nelson de Leon

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Re: Atheism/Agnosticism in the Philippines
« Reply #1237 on: Feb 03, 2015 at 09:49 PM »
Not really. Empathy is putting yourself in the shoes of those you affect. If you don't know or misconstrued the feelings of others then you lack or have no empathy. That means you're a narcissist or, at worst, maybe even a psychopath. It cannot be molded by your environment but your ability on how to empathize may be. It's either you can or cannot empathize and it is not subjective in any way.

Correct sir. Empathy is putting yourself in the shoes of those affected. But it does not dictate how you will react to the situation.

Offline leomarley

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Re: Atheism/Agnosticism in the Philippines
« Reply #1238 on: Feb 03, 2015 at 10:22 PM »
Correct sir. Empathy is putting yourself in the shoes of those affected. But it does not dictate how you will react to the situation.

yes it can. it may not be always but most of the times it does. if you did not consider the pain you caused to another person or ignored it before you inflict it then you lack empathy.

Offline Nelson de Leon

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Re: Atheism/Agnosticism in the Philippines
« Reply #1239 on: Feb 04, 2015 at 12:30 AM »
yes it can. it may not be always but most of the times it does.

Agreed. It may not always be but most of the time, it does.

Magandang topic din ito:

if you did not consider the pain you caused to another person or ignored it before you inflict it then you lack empathy.

Madaming ganyan dito sir. Replying without thinking about the feelings of others.
« Last Edit: Feb 04, 2015 at 12:35 AM by Nelson de Leon »

Offline leomarley

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Atheism/Agnosticism in the Philippines
« Reply #1240 on: Feb 04, 2015 at 12:53 AM »
Yeah that's true. I'm guilty of that too. Madali kasi tayo madala ng emotions natin.
« Last Edit: Feb 04, 2015 at 12:55 AM by leomarley »

Offline Nelson de Leon

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Re: Atheism/Agnosticism in the Philippines
« Reply #1241 on: Feb 04, 2015 at 06:52 AM »
Yeah that's true. I'm guilty of that too. Madali kasi tayo madala ng emotions natin.

But it doesn't mean that you and I do not have empathy.  ;)

Offline leomarley

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Re: Atheism/Agnosticism in the Philippines
« Reply #1242 on: Feb 04, 2015 at 06:53 AM »
And it doesn't mean we're narcissists and psychopaths hahaha

Offline tigkal

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Re: Atheism/Agnosticism in the Philippines
« Reply #1243 on: Feb 04, 2015 at 07:36 AM »
Magandang tanong yan. Hindi kaya sa naramdaman na sorrow sa loss or death of a person?
Eto siguro ang evolution sequence. Kaya magulo na ang mundo ngayon.

Confucius: Do not do unto others as you do not want others to do unto you.< Do not Kill the person>
Jesus: Do unto others as you want others do unto you.<Do not kill the person's loved ones>
Latest: Do unto others before others do unto you. <Kill the person before he kills you>

Offline Nelson de Leon

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Re: Atheism/Agnosticism in the Philippines
« Reply #1244 on: Feb 04, 2015 at 10:47 AM »
Eto siguro ang evolution sequence. Kaya magulo na ang mundo ngayon.

Confucius: Do not do unto others as you do not want others to do unto you.< Do not Kill the person>
Jesus: Do unto others as you want others do unto you.<Do not kill the person's loved ones>
Latest: Do unto others before others do unto you. <Kill the person before he kills you>

Masmatindi sir ang sinabi ni Jesus:

http://www.pinoydvd.com/index.php/topic,170692.msg2230701.html#msg2230701

And the second, like it, is this: ‘You shall love your neighbor as yourself.’ There is no other commandment greater than these.” (‭Mark‬ ‭12‬:‭31‬ NKJV)

Pero:

http://www.pinoydvd.com/index.php/topic,170692.msg2230843.html#msg2230843

34 “A new command I give you: Love one another. As I have loved you, so you must love one another.  (Jn. 13:34)

Offline leomarley

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Re: Atheism/Agnosticism in the Philippines
« Reply #1245 on: Feb 04, 2015 at 10:26 PM »
see? that's empathy. even Jesus says so. ;D

Offline dpogs

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Re: Atheism/Agnosticism in the Philippines
« Reply #1246 on: Feb 05, 2015 at 12:07 AM »
in atheist worldview... kailan nagkaroon ng emphaty ang human species? before human feels emphaty paano nga ba ang basehan kung tama ginagwa ng human species noon? a child who can't

is right and wrong in atheist worldview changes depende sa era/time, place, event?

an atheist exist within a community where killing is a norm? saan papasok ang emphaty doon?

as long as your action cannot affect others then it is good to do it?
There is none righteous, no not one.

Offline bumblebee

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Re: Atheism/Agnosticism in the Philippines
« Reply #1247 on: Feb 05, 2015 at 06:26 AM »
in atheist worldview... kailan nagkaroon ng emphaty ang human species? before human feels emphaty paano nga ba ang basehan kung tama ginagwa ng human species noon? a child who can't

is right and wrong in atheist worldview changes depende sa era/time, place, event?

an atheist exist within a community where killing is a norm? saan papasok ang emphaty doon?

as long as your action cannot affect others then it is good to do it?

You mean to say, outside of Israel, until before Judaism or Christianity were propagated,  walang empathy?

Offline dpogs

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Re: Atheism/Agnosticism in the Philippines
« Reply #1248 on: Feb 05, 2015 at 07:08 AM »
You mean to say, outside of Israel, until before Judaism or Christianity were propagated,  walang empathy?

i have no idea kung kelan nagkaroon ng emphaty ang tao sa worldview ng isang evolutionist/atheist... i just want to know... kung kelan naramdamang ng human species ang need to exercies emphaty ayon sa mga atheist...

nung unggoy pa lang ang tao may emphaty na ba? sa panahon ba ng survival of the fittest or natural selection may malaking role ba ang emphaty?
There is none righteous, no not one.

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Re: Atheism/Agnosticism in the Philippines
« Reply #1249 on: Feb 05, 2015 at 08:24 AM »
^ you didn't answer his question.

Offline Nelson de Leon

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Re: Atheism/Agnosticism in the Philippines
« Reply #1250 on: Feb 05, 2015 at 08:48 AM »
see? that's empathy. even Jesus says so. ;D

Yup! That's true. Hindi lang actually empathy but it is more than that! Kasi empathy, the way I understand it, is simply putting oneself in the shoe of the other. If we would study the Words of Jesus further expounded in the Bible, hindi lang empathy pero more on being pro-active. Kung baga, kikilos tayo.

Offline dpogs

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Re: Atheism/Agnosticism in the Philippines
« Reply #1251 on: Feb 05, 2015 at 08:56 AM »
^ you didn't answer his question.

i have no idea when it comes to atheist view... that is why i am asking kailan pumasok ang emphaty sa human evolution in atheist worldview...

in atheist worldview... nag exist na ba ang emphaty habang unggoy pa lang o isda... or habang nasa mababang species ng human...

saan ba pumasok ang emphaty in terms of evolution...

kasi in terms of creation alam mo na ang sagot ko diyan saan at kailan nagsimula o kung sino ang nagbigay ng emphaty sa tao :)



i just want to know ano stand ng atheist when it comes to emphaty... sa ngayon we can easily says na basehan natin ang emphaty... paano before may role ba ang emphaty sa panahon na kung kelan umiiral ang survival of the fittest o nasa natural selection process ang human species... kailangan ba ang emphaty sa process ng survival of the fittest?
« Last Edit: Feb 05, 2015 at 09:40 AM by dpogs »
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Offline leomarley

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Re: Atheism/Agnosticism in the Philippines
« Reply #1252 on: Feb 05, 2015 at 10:38 AM »
There are instances where animals show empathy so even before we evolve into modern humans meron na.

Offline tigkal

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Re: Atheism/Agnosticism in the Philippines
« Reply #1253 on: Feb 05, 2015 at 10:57 AM »
Empathy is part of the electro chemical process within our body. Kaya iba meron yung iba wala, as part of the evolution process. During the evolution process, nakita na yung may empathy mas malaki yung chance of survival, unlike doon sa walang emathy. Kaya yung genes na nagbigay ng empathy na pass on sa mga anak. So majority meron empathy, pero meron pa din pa minsan minsan na walang empathy.

Offline Nelson de Leon

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Re: Atheism/Agnosticism in the Philippines
« Reply #1254 on: Feb 05, 2015 at 11:15 AM »
Empathy is part of the electro chemical process within our body. Kaya iba meron yung iba wala, as part of the evolution process. During the evolution process, nakita na yung may empathy mas malaki yung chance of survival, unlike doon sa walang emathy. Kaya yung genes na nagbigay ng empathy na pass on sa mga anak. So majority meron empathy, pero meron pa din pa minsan minsan na walang empathy.

Yan ang hindi ko alam.

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Re: Atheism/Agnosticism in the Philippines
« Reply #1255 on: Feb 05, 2015 at 11:30 AM »
di ko rin alam yan...
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Offline docelmo

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Re: Atheism/Agnosticism in the Philippines
« Reply #1256 on: Feb 05, 2015 at 02:45 PM »
There are instances where animals show empathy so even before we evolve into modern humans meron na.
Not exactly....

Animals have empathy too!
by: Connor Wood

It’s clear that animals have distinct personalities and, very likely, some type of subjective “selves,” even if those selves may be very different from human inner experiences. Anyone who’s owned pets knows that cats and dogs can be curious, inquisitive, scheming, quirky, and even dishonest – witness a cat jumping down from the counters to “pretend” it wasn’t up there in the first place. But do animals feel real empathy or compassion, emotions often held aloft by spiritual and religious teachings as among the highest human ideals?

University of Chicago neuroscientist Jean Decety and colleagues Peggy Mason and Inbal Bartal published the results of a study in Science magazine showing that rats were actually able to empathize with, and act to help, their fellows. The researchers introduced strange pairs of rats to each other and allowed them to get acquainted over a two-week period.

It’s important to point out that these rats were not genetic kin, and so the usual evolutionary argument for altruistic behavior – that it assists family members, who in turn share some of one’s own genes and therefore are able to contribute to one’s inclusive, or non-direct, genetic fitness – doesn’t hold. And the evidence suggests that the rats’ altruistic actions were directly related to their partners’ distress, since the trapped mice gave out very high-pitched (presumably unhappy) squeaks that were recorded with sensitive instruments and heard by their free comrades.
« Last Edit: Feb 05, 2015 at 03:05 PM by docelmo »
Denon/ GoldenEar Technology/Onkyo/Optoma/Sansui/SVS

Offline dpogs

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Re: Atheism/Agnosticism in the Philippines
« Reply #1257 on: Feb 05, 2015 at 02:52 PM »
nasa genes ang emphaty?

genetically passed on to their offsprings? kapag minalas malas ka hindi mo mamamana ang "emphaty"... :) those who doesnt have emphaty never have a chance to do good?

parang homosexuality... nasa genes din :)
« Last Edit: Feb 05, 2015 at 02:55 PM by dpogs »
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Offline Nelson de Leon

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Re: Atheism/Agnosticism in the Philippines
« Reply #1258 on: Feb 16, 2015 at 07:44 AM »
Taken from:

http://edwardfeser.blogspot.com/2011/02/to-louse.html?m=1

Skeptic: Science is BS.  Physicists believe in these things called “quarks,” which are little flavored particles that spin around and work like magic charms.  Their evidence is that they read about them in a James Joyce novel.  Some of them think the universe is made up of tiny shoelaces tied together, though they admit that they have no evidence for this and have to take it on faith.  Einstein said morality is all relative – which is why he stole his ideas from this guy who worked in a patent office, and why Richard Feynman stole atomic secrets during WWII.  Meanwhile, the chemists contradict the physicists and believe instead in little colored balls held together by sticks.  Biologists believe monkeys can give birth to human beings.  What a bunch of crap!  It’s child abuse to teach kids about this stuff in schools.

Scientist: Are you joking?  If not, I suggest that you actually read some science before criticizing it.

Skeptic: I’ve already read a lot about it, in blog comboxes like this one.  And why should I waste my time reading anything else?  I already know it’s all BS!  Didn’t you hear the examples I just gave?

Scientist: No, you’re missing my point.  You’ve completely distorted what scientists actually say.  It’s not remotely as silly as you think it is.  In fact it’s not silly at all.  But you need to actually read the stuff to see that.

Skeptic: So you deny that physicists believe in quarks?  What flavor are your quarks, chocolate or vanilla?  Do you deny that they think we came from monkeys?  Which monkey was your mother?

Scientist: No one says that monkeys gave birth to humans.  That’s a ridiculous caricature.  And of course I don’t deny that physicists believe in quarks, but you’re badly misunderstanding what they mean when they attribute “flavor” to them.  They don’t mean that literally…

Skeptic: Oh so it’s just empty verbiage, then.  See, you’re just proving my point for me.

Scientist: No, it’s not empty verbiage.  It’s technical terminology.

Skeptic: I see, like magic spells.  That’s why they talk about “charm.”  Really, you’re just digging the hole deeper.

Scientist: Actually, it’s you who is digging your own hole deeper.  That’s not what they mean by “charm.”  If you knew anything at all about physics, you’d realize that.

Skeptic: See, every time I debate people like you, you always whine about how everyone misunderstands what you mean.  You always say “Go read this shelf of books and come back when you know what you’re talking about.”  It’s like one of the naked emperor’s sycophants telling the kid who sees that he’s naked that he needs to read the learned works of Count Roderigo concerning the fine leather of the emperor’s boots, etc.

Scientist: What a ridiculous analogy.  You’re just begging the question.  Whether science is really comparable to the naked emperor is precisely what’s at issue.

Skeptic: OK, I’ll bite.  Explain it to me, then.  Prove to me here and now in this combox that science is worth my time, as opposed to being the tissue of superstition, lies, and bigotry that I already know it to be.  And don’t get long-winded like you people tend to do, or start throwing around references to this scientist I should know about or that book I should have read.

Scientist: What is this, an invitation to the Star Chamber?  How am I supposed to explain fields as complex as quantum physics, or evolutionary biology, or chemistry to the satisfaction of someone as hostile to them as you are in a combox comment, or even a blog post or series of blog posts?  Besides, there are so many things wrong with what you’ve said I don’t even know where to begin!  And if I keep it short, you’ll tell me that I’m dodging whatever issue I don’t address, while if I respond at greater length you’ll tell me I’m a windbag.  I can’t win!  But why are you wasting time in a combox anyway?  Why don’t you just read the work of some actual scientists?  It’s right there in the library or bookstore if you really want to understand it.

Skeptic: I knew it.  You won’t defend yourself because you know you can’t.  But then, arguing with people like you just gives you credibility.  That’s why you uneducated, irrational fanatical bigots need to be shouted down by reasonable, open-minded, well-read, tolerant people like me.  Science is BS, and you know it.  It’s just so obvious.  So why don’t you go back to eating your tasty flavored quarks and tying your vibrating 11-dimensional shoestrings over at your Uncle Monkey’s house, OK?  I’ll be here in the reality-based community reading my copy of The Science Delusion.

Author's note:

Naturally, a Dawkins or Myers would be appalled at our Skeptic.  And rightly so.  But replace terms like “science,” “physicists,” “quarks,” etc. with terms like “theism,” “philosophers,” “God,” etc. and you’ve suddenly got in our Skeptic a typical Dawkins or Myers fan – indeed, you’ve got someone pretty much indistinguishable from Dawkins or Myers themselves.

Offline leomarley

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Re: Atheism/Agnosticism in the Philippines
« Reply #1259 on: Feb 16, 2015 at 01:07 PM »
except that's not what a skeptic is. the other guy who argues with a scientist is what you call a science-denier.