Topic: how to start with a good home theatre system?

[Clondalkin]

@Clondalkin

ok sempai! how does...hmm...70k sound? ok na ba yun? what's a good round budget for a "mid-range" system? i'm shocked na mas mahal pala ang audio over video

how much kaya on the average? hoping murang lang talaga...a clean install sana but baka mahal

can you give me a run down of your system, who installed it and how much it cost?

thanks.

Yuriko, the system recommended by Mr. Barrister is a very good one, and for most people, would LIKELY be a ONE TIME PURCHASE just as you hope - just think of creative ways to reduce your viewing room area to around 20 sqm.  Ibang level na yon if you want to upgrade further later.   So based on that system, you're budget is short by 30K, THUS, I suggested that you sell one of the excess Plasmas to cover for that - OR, hold on to your planned purchase of another Plasma for a few months.   

Room modification and treatment is another matter in terms of budget ne. But it's OK, most people having some kind of HT don't start with treated room.  However if you have the money for it, then perhaps you should request one of the members to allow you a first hand look at their home set-up..kase ideal talagang you decide the equipment based on your room - that will certainly wreck your budget further.   so what to do?  what to do?   

Without home treatment, "hikkoshi soba" should suffice for all people willing to help with the set-up.   It's actually quite fun to do the set-up;)   

[oweidah]

volunteer ako ma'am, taga-tagay ng "sake"  

[Carlo777]

Si Yuriko pa, one time purchase lang talaga yan. Thanks guys for helping her out, because I'm not really into the audio stuff. Try as I may, I could not really appreciate this part of the home theatre experience. Maybe it's the fact that I don't even listen to most types of music.

About the room, it's a place where Yuriko can do her dancing and "slim-fit" exercises (which she does for around 1 hour in the morning and one hour in the evening), dedicated movie viewing is still done in the bedroom or the game room. So would you guys suggest a dedicated audio set up instead?

Budget considerations are purely up to her, I've given her much leeway because I think it's time that I spend for the system - given that most T.V purchases I've made were paid by her to sort of "surprise" me. I also directed her to ask for expert installation aid from you guys, because I think she is bent on doing it herself, and I sincerely advise against it.

Now where's my G11?  

[accastil]

1st requirement - find a dedicated room
2nd reqt - define a budget
3rd reqt - get the biggest possible display you could afford considering your room size (viewing distance)
4th reqt - treat the room. its enough that it should be isolated from external noise and no sound reflections would be created.
5th reqt - get 1 set of ht speakers. get the one that is easiest to drive. if possible, your fronts should be floorstanders
6th reqt - get a receiver to drive your speakers. get the highest possible output power your budget can afford.
7th reqt - get a decent player.

enjoy your HT sir!
post mo pix pag tapos na

[macdon]

If you'll permit me, I'd like to take a stab at your 60k budget in your 40sqm room:

AVR - 20k
Here's where the used market section could help you out. Find a good 7.1 High Current AVR

Front & Rear speakers - 24k
I'd probably go for 4 Proac 2.5 Floorstander clones by A-Audio

Center speaker - 8k
While A-Audio is just about to make a center that would match its  2.5 & D2 lines, the cost quoted is a good estimate.

12" Active Subwoofer - 8-10k
again, here's where our used market section could help you out or have A-Audio custom build you a 12" down firing sub for about the above quoted price.


Placement:
If your 40sqm room is rectangular and the Plasma/LCD is on one end of the room, situate your viewing couch or sofa about midway in your room - in a way, this sofa acts like a divider between 2 areas - HT & your dancing/exercising area. This also makes you sit a bit closer to your TV if you elect a smaller panel.

The 2 rear floorstanders can be situated on the rear corners of the room or moved along the wall between the back of the couch & rear walls.
Since they're floorstanders, you can easily move & position them to your preferred surround effect.
These 2 rear floorstanders will also act like your main speakers for dancing.

Lastly, place your subwoofer at the back of the couch/sofa - which is actually midway of the room. This would provide the bass for your theater as well for your dancing.
 

 

[streetsmart]

Front & Rear speakers - 24k
I'd probably go for 4 Proac 2.5 Floorstander clones by A-Audio

For the rear speakers, I would say it's more advisable to get bookshelf speakers which you mount about 7' high on the walls. Better if they are dipole. The problem with floorstanders for the rears is that they are easily localized.

[CMac]

just remembered this post in the marketplace!  perfect sa plans ninyo ni carlo!

this would be the best blind purchase for me as long as it is in great condition!

price drop.
36k complete- 2front, 1center, 2rear, 1sub
or
23k- 2front, 1center, 2rear, NO SUB

http://www.pinoydvd.com/index.php?topic=94440.0

with THX certified sub! san ka pa? 

[comitatus]

@Clondalkin

100k should give you a decent mid-range system na?

@accastil

we have 1&2 na=)

@macdon

let's say I go brand new on the avr and the subs, how much na kaya siya?

@carlo777

thanks darling

@streetsmart

carlo, unfortunately is not interested in any form of ht set-up=(

the more i look at the ht gallery, the more i get confused

[iiinas]

decent mid level avrs should start at 40k up. denons and harmans are pricier, onkyos and yamahas almost the same price range but cheaper than the denons and harmans for almost the same feature set. i guess i would strongly suggest either getting a denon or an onkyo because of its audyssey feature (which automatically calibrates the 5.1 speakers for you). and i believe audyssey is the best auto calibration system on receivers today. for denon a 2310 should be their mid level, for onkyo 806 or the newer 807 should do.

subs. svs is the best right now, their most economical which is the nsd series should set you back 40+k, you can ask mike c for pricing. velodyne is another option, almost the same in price, maybe a little cheaper. i think for your room nothing below 12 inches for the size of the sub. diy route is another option, diy_master can help with that.

[Clondalkin]

just remembered this post in the marketplace!  perfect sa plans ninyo ni carlo!

this would be the best blind purchase for me as long as it is in great condition!

http://www.pinoydvd.com/index.php?topic=94440.0

with THX certified sub! san ka pa? 

Definitely worth checking Yuriko.  If this speaker set is still in great condition and matches well with the Yamaha, 36K for this and 27K for the Yamaha 765, a little over the original 60K budget nalang!

[comitatus]

@Clondalkin& iiinas

darn the choices are really making my head spin...

@ojof00l

sure, sure yun lang pala=)

@everybody

guys is there a particular check list when i go for the auditions na?

thanks.

[Clondalkin]

@Clondalkin

100k should give you a decent mid-range system na?

Yuriko, the honest answer is "it depends on the person" because the boundaries of a mid-range system are quite wide.

If you ask me, definitely yes.   "Decent" would be a modest description already.  The full Yamaha system I recommended (765+325 series speakers) is about that much.  My current HT system is a 757 (late 2005 model Yamaha) paired with the 325 series speakers and an upgrade has never crossed my mind yet.   But then perhaps Im more picky on the TV than the audio system - and my HT rooms are within the 20sqm area so my current system has more than enough power to produce pleasing sound at all volumes - based on my standards of course.

On the other hand, if you ask Mr. Streetsmart and the guys who've got awesome sets, I'm not sure if they'd even consider a Yamaha765 based system as mid-range - and that's a fair assessment because the 765 belongs to the lowest class of Yamaha AVRs but it so happens to be the 2nd to the top within that class (the highest being the 1065), it's highly rated within its class and for such a relatively new model, has already garnered 2 prestigious Hi-Vi awards in Japan.   A 300K or 500K system may still be considered as mid-range, who knows?
  

[macdon]

  So would you guys suggest a dedicated audio set up instead?

If its just for a dedicated audio setup, then its easier:

A pair of A-Audio Proac 2.5 clone Floorstander........12k
CD Player...........15k
Integrated solid state amp..........25k

If you prefer listening to a lot of fast/dance music, solid state amps would be fine. No need for the complexity of tubes.

[mike c]

while i always recommend the PB10NSD for 2k cubic feet and smaller rooms ... it can still fill a 4k room (my demo area is about 4k or more).  i just prefer to apply my own subwoofer standards for my sub recommendations.

 

even an HT guy like me has a 2.1 setup for my bedroom even though that's where i do most of my watching.
 

[comitatus]

guys is there a short list i need to make when i do the auditions? is there anyone who'd buy a set up now para makisabay lalang ako sa auditions?

[mike c]

guys is there a short list i need to make when i do the auditions? is there anyone who'd buy a set up now para makisabay lalang ako sa auditions?

if you are ok with a 2.1 setup, i can demo for you an AV receiver, bookshelves and subwoofer combo in a more than 4k room.  (i don't sell receivers though)

[raptor]

guys is there a short list i need to make when i do the auditions? is there anyone who'd buy a set up now para makisabay lalang ako sa auditions?

most of the sellers here in pdvd would be able to setup an audition for you 5.1, 2.1, or another option that you might want to check for less cable clutter is the polf audio surroundbar + subwoofer (surrounddbar is a single piece speaker system that simulates the 5-piece surround system)

[accastil]

@Clondalkin

100k should give you a decent mid-range system na?

@accastil

we have 1&2 na=)

@macdon

let's say I go brand new on the avr and the subs, how much na kaya siya?

@carlo777

thanks darling

@streetsmart

carlo, unfortunately is not interested in any form of ht set-up=(

the more i look at the ht gallery, the more i get confused

in my case, i would spend most of the budget in display size(largest size possible) and the room treatment.
all the rest to follow can be easily adjusted in accord to your hearing preference na lang.

[Invinciible]

i'm pretty sure they have the flatscreen display aspect of the ht room covered.

[comitatus]

thanks again guys, can someone tell me a little more about this "room treatment"

 

[barrister]

Room treatment refers to the modification of the room to improve sound quality.  


1.  Reflections - The simplest treatment is the reduction of sound reflections.  Reflections cause echoes.  Reduce reflections by installing curtains/blinds, furniture, and books in open bookshelves.

2.  Standing waves - They cause bass to become inconsistent in the room, with some areas getting excessive bass and other areas getting weak bass.  Standing waves are reduced by installing bass traps.  As long as no dimension of the room (length, width height) is exactly the same as the other, you will not have any major issues regarding standing waves.

3.  Soundproofing - Forget about it.  It's very difficult and very expensive.  Don't believe that you can soundproof a room by simply using acoustic panels.  Absorption and diffusion will not work without decoupling and isolation of walls, doors, ceilings and floors.  

In your case, just reduce reflections and you'll be fine.  Don't totally eliminate all reflections, or you'll end up with a dead-sounding room that will sound weird.



Acoustic wall panels


Acoustic ceiling tiles


Full anechoic chamber    (Klipsch Audio Egineering and Testing Center)

[comitatus]

Room treatment refers to the modification of the room to improve sound quality.  


1.  Reflections - The simplest treatment is the reduction of sound reflections.  Reflections cause echoes.  Reduce reflections by installing curtains/blinds, furniture, and books in open bookshelves.

2.  Standing waves - They cause bass to become inconsistent in the room, with some areas getting excessive bass and other areas getting weak bass.  Standing waves are reduced by installing bass traps.  As long as no dimension of the room (length, width height) is exactly the same as the other, you will not have any major issues regarding standing waves.

3.  Soundproofing - Forget about it.  It's very difficult and very expensive.  Don't believe that you can soundproof a room by simply using acoustic panels.  Absorption and diffusion will not work without decoupling and isolation of walls, doors, ceilings and floors.  

In your case, just reduce reflections and you'll be fine.  Don't totally eliminate all reflections, or you'll end up with a dead-sounding room that will sound weird.

ayan mura lang!

i'll set the final budget already by next week and carlo will double whatever budget i come up with but will do my best to keep it way way under that=)

@barrister

sir ok din ba talaga sa mga horror movies yan?

[mike c]

sir ok din ba talaga sa mga horror movies yan?

heehee.  mas nakakatakot ang 'the haunting' with a good subwoofer.

i don't watch horror movies anymore

[Invinciible]

heehee.  mas nakakatakot and 'the haunting' with a good subwoofer.

i don't watch horror movies anymore

+1 

[barrister]

i'll set the final budget already by next week and carlo will double whatever budget i come up with but will do my best to keep it way way under that=)

That's good news.  You won't regret a multi-channel set-up.

@barrister

sir ok din ba talaga sa mga horror movies yan?

Yes, definitely.

Actually, all movies benefit from a multi-channel set-up.  But if there's a movie genre that gets the most benefit out of a proper sound system, it has to be the horror genre.

[comitatus]

great!

any dvd/blu-ray titles that would make great demo materials so i could bring them for the audition?

[Invinciible]

i always use "the incredible hulk" (the hulk scene in the college, up to the helicopter crash scene) and master and commander (the first encounter of the two opposing ships)... 

[comitatus]

i always use "the incredible hulk" (the hulk scene in the college, up to the helicopter crash scene) and master and commander (the first encounter of the two opposing ships)... 

Thanks i got the hulky Hulk just today...anymore? how about vanilla audio cd's? i have echo and the bunnymen (killing moon) love that

[dips15]

Since you do a lot of TV shopping already, I'm sure Sights and Sounds can give you a good price on audio gear, and they carry a lot of brands.  If I were you, I also wouldn't worry about installation.  Just have them do it for you.  If we let them install and calibrate our TV's then why shouldn't we have them install the system?  It will get confusing to do a set-up by yourself especially if you are not familiar with all the set-up requirements. 

First thing you need to identify is the applications of your future set-up then fix a budget.  From there, identify the kind of set-up you want.  You also need to note that one man's mid-range/high-end set-up is another man's entrylevel set-up.  Speakers can range anywhere from 1k (or less) to millions of pesos so just set a budget and move from there.  For those who are not used to higher end speakers, entry level speakers will sound very good... but as you audition high end hardware, the more you will want to upgrade.  That's when this will become a hobby. 

Good luck... baka si Carlo din mapahilig and we will be waiting for speaker reviews next time. 

[Carlo777]

Since you do a lot of TV shopping already, I'm sure Sights and Sounds can give you a good price on audio gear, and they carry a lot of brands.  If I were you, I also wouldn't worry about installation.  Just have them do it for you.  If we let them install and calibrate our TV's then why shouldn't we have them install the system?  It will get confusing to do a set-up by yourself especially if you are not familiar with all the set-up requirements. 

First thing you need to identify is the applications of your future set-up then fix a budget.  From there, identify the kind of set-up you want.  You also need to note that one man's mid-range/high-end set-up is another man's entrylevel set-up.  Speakers can range anywhere from 1k (or less) to millions of pesos so just set a budget and move from there.  For those who are not used to higher end speakers, entry level speakers will sound very good... but as you audition high end hardware, the more you will want to upgrade.  That's when this will become a hobby. 

Good luck... baka si Carlo din mapahilig and we will be waiting for speaker reviews next time. 

Hehe no chance sir, I tried to like it but it didn't take

We asked S&S already for a formal quote based off our budget. The dad of comitatus will be staying in the Philippines from Oct to January na of next year and with his generous aid comitatus was able to raise the budget considerably.

I, however, remain uninterested in the project.