Author Topic: 6F6G SE Amp  (Read 16760 times)

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Offline efren_

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6F6G SE Amp
« on: Mar 31, 2010 at 02:34 PM »
One morning while having coffee, switched on my tube amp to warm up the tubes and play some classics, but one power tube goes bright, smoke appears inside then goes off :o a few moments later the silvery coating on top became ghostly white...R.I.P 6AR5... :'( :'( :'( pull out the tubes and upon close examination, a crack is revealed at the base...


perhaps now is the time these bottles should take over.


after some metal working to fit the new tubesockets...




As can be seen the 12AV6 driver is dwarfed by the 6F6 clear tops.


Following changes were made:
1. 400R cathode resistor were replaced by 150R.

2. 10K feedback resistor connected to OPT secondary replaced by 250K, this time connected directly to plate of 6F6, in series with 1uF/350V motor starting caps & directly connected to cathode of 12AV6 driver tube.

3. Aside from power switch, i installed a B+ switch so that tubes are fully warmed up before supplying power to the tubes, to prolong the service life of the tubes.

First listening impressions: at power on there was an audible hum even at 4 ft away from the drivers. This is bad, steering away from the schematics, I have to do it my way, gathering up the knowledge i learned from the web site recomended by sir Tony also in this thread, just backtrack a few post( thanks again sir! ;)) I put a 1K res in the screen grid and shunted by 100uF/450V Nichicon caps to ground(the original schematics connects the screen grid directly to B+).

Second listening impressions: Finally the hum is barely audible with my ears sticking closely to the cone, great!!, listened to Maria Rita Mariano's "Dos Gardenias" I listened to this before but this time its kind of a euphoric, her vocals others may put it "to die for". This amp has taken me several levels up in tube audio!
Btw i am now using PHILLIPS AD50600 5" highly efficient drivers, so the 1Watt/ch output from 6F6 sounded even more powerful than my room warmer the JLH 10W/ch class A SS amp!

Bass- gone is the slight "boominess" from the former 6AR5, taut and having that punch.

Highs- Natural, airy, totally absence of sibilance.(I am using tweeter from my onkyo bs, the pHillips driver fits snugly in the Onkyo enclosure)


When I played Jim Brickman's "By Heart" sung by Ann Cochran, I noticed that my wife listened seriously, she later told me she was "a little bit carried away emotionally" though I know it is more than a bit.
My efforts now rewarded, I have no further plans of tweaking. It may not look glamorous on the outside, but the performance is really something!! I have yet to make that wooden plinth on the sides(my carpentry skills is very poor! but with determination it can be accomplished ::))

Also I would like to give credit to AT&S audio transformer by sir Edrel Sison, running at 43mA, they stay cool even up to one hour operation, they warmed up only due to heat conduction from power transformer because of close proximity, they have proven their worth sonic & physical.

my daughter ejoying her cd of Celine Dion
"just keep 'em glowing"

Offline efren_

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Re: 6F6G SE Amp
« Reply #1 on: Mar 31, 2010 at 02:39 PM »
 i did not notice I started a new thread  ??? it should be under RCA-victor stereo/GE reciever.....
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Offline mhore

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Re: 6F6G SE Amp
« Reply #2 on: Mar 31, 2010 at 02:58 PM »
pre, punta ko diyan para i-audition ko yang tube amp. :)
not so audiophile person,as long as the sound pleases my ears

Offline efren_

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Re: 6F6G SE Amp
« Reply #3 on: Mar 31, 2010 at 03:03 PM »
pare, finally nag post ka rin ;D ;D ;D punta ka d2, ano gusto mo handa ko, chivas, funda, pedro 1....
type mo pa rin ba karpa, bighead o tilapia binangonan? ;D
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Offline mhore

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Re: 6F6G SE Amp
« Reply #4 on: Mar 31, 2010 at 03:07 PM »
pre, umpisahan mo na yung tube buffer ko. ;D
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Offline efren_

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Re: 6F6G SE Amp
« Reply #5 on: Mar 31, 2010 at 03:11 PM »
nakaready na 12ba6 dala ka nlang plastic chasis ;)
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Offline mhore

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Re: 6F6G SE Amp
« Reply #6 on: Mar 31, 2010 at 03:19 PM »
"PHILLIPS AD50600 5" highly efficient drivers",
pre, ano ba tong philipps na ito, okey ba to?
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Offline efren_

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Re: 6F6G SE Amp
« Reply #7 on: Mar 31, 2010 at 03:27 PM »
Palagay ko pre vintage ito, kasi ADXXXXX series ay vintage speakers made by phillips for tube amps, wala na ngayon yan, galing din yan sa bodega na pinagkunan nung ni rebuild ko na RCA-Victor, Meron pa kasama altech-lansing 3" highly sensitive rin, yung natira 2 pcs na Phillips pagagawan ko ng enclosure diyan sa Marikina, dun sa Tulay ng Sto Ninio.
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Offline mhore

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Re: 6F6G SE Amp
« Reply #8 on: Mar 31, 2010 at 04:52 PM »


pre, this JLH Class A amp with marcopilyo sub amp is waiting for your tube buffer.
« Last Edit: Apr 08, 2010 at 12:27 PM by mhore »
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Offline edrel sison

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Re: 6F6G SE Amp
« Reply #9 on: Mar 31, 2010 at 04:56 PM »
efren first of all, congratulations again switching from 6AR5 to 6F6. fantastic work.

the philips, they are very nice. glad to know you were not running out of bass. those 5 inchers were used by philips with their mid-range application in the 70s. i have an 8 inch FR drivers in my posession by the way and they sounds nice.

you maybe ready for the big ones....

i was waiting for you to say "my wife cried" when she heard your new tube amp..

...and dug deep on her purse signing a check for 50,000 pesos...
...so that then you can explore some more with tubes and vintage speakers... ;D ;D

btw why not install 2 AD50600 5" on 1 large cab? you have 4 pcs right?

Offline efren_

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Re: 6F6G SE Amp
« Reply #10 on: Mar 31, 2010 at 05:13 PM »
sir edrel,

good day sir, i was thinking about that "digging" but she was more cunning than wolf, if i do something wrong she can smell it a mile away ;D ;D ;D

sir di kaya kapusin kung tig dalwa per ch? remember this amp can shoot less than 2Watts per channel. Btw, the schematics has a choke, lacking it I instead place 240ohms 5w in series of B+, will there be an improvement further if I put a choke? After this long vacation I might put an order for a 10H 90mA choke. ;)
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Offline efren_

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Re: 6F6G SE Amp
« Reply #11 on: Mar 31, 2010 at 05:21 PM »


pre, this JLH Class A amp with marcopilyo sub amp is waiting for your tube buffer.

Pre,

alam mo b na yang JLH 1996Version para sa akin before I switched to tubes ay the best sounding SS amp I have ever built imo. still is, in the bjt category, side by side with the Hiraga na napunta kay pareng REy.. :)
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Offline edrel sison

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Re: 6F6G SE Amp
« Reply #12 on: Mar 31, 2010 at 06:19 PM »
i was thinking about that "digging" but she was more cunning than wolf, if i do something wrong she can smell it a mile away ;D ;D ;D
you maybe have a "bad record" and is still under "parole" for now.. ;D ;D

i was actually thinking of an 8 inch bass driver then 2 of your 5 incher philips and one dome or a ribbon tweeter for an MTM config.

Offline ATJr.

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Re: 6F6G SE Amp
« Reply #13 on: Apr 01, 2010 at 03:36 AM »
Quote
I put a 1K res in the screen grid and shunted by 100uF/450V Nichicon caps to ground(the original schematics connects the screen grid directly to B+). 

afaik, this technique was never done in the past for the simple reason that 100uf/500v caps during those days would been huge and very expensive, plus you will have to parallel several units. we are lucky to be living in an era where capacitor technology has made leaps and bounds. i call this technique psuedo-regulation....
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Offline efren_

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Re: 6F6G SE Amp
« Reply #14 on: Apr 01, 2010 at 01:21 PM »
@ sir Tony,

Many thanks again sir for the enlightenment. That website of turneraudio is a big help. ;)
I was before thinking of regulating the whole B+ by using Zener diodes, but locally available Zeners is only up to 200V / 5W. I need at least 250 or 260V.

@ sir Edrel,

My "bad record" in the past sir is not in anyway about financial embelishment, its about something else more serious, as Paquiao puts it "i'm just a man, you know" ;D ;D ;D.

For the moment sir I am happy with these 5 inchers, ported enclosure I think will be just fine, considering that my listening space is also limited. Increasing the size decreases the WAF ;D

Btw, i just found out that 6F6G, 6L6G/C, 6V6 have the same pin configuration. In the future, if budget permits, I might get to try on these varieties, (patungo na kaya ito sa "tube rolling"? GASTOS TALAGA!)
 :D
« Last Edit: Apr 01, 2010 at 01:34 PM by efren noble »
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Offline efren_

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Re: 6F6G SE Amp
« Reply #15 on: Apr 01, 2010 at 02:02 PM »
pareng mhore,

About that SAKURA AV200t tube amp you've been yappin about over the phone, its not really pure tube amp. It only have that tube buffer, a tube rectifier to juice up those tubes, a budget class AB solid state power amp with cheap chinese made D1047 power output(D1047C is now in the market as replacement, with higher breakdown voltage, the former easily gets fried, plus better sonic performance ). In other words hybrid amp, Your JLH class A with MJ15003 output is far, far more better in terms of sonic performance, you only have to add tube buffer for that "tubey sound", I tried it before, wag ka lang mainip, inumpisahan ko na tube line driver/buffer mo, swerte mo pre may dalwa pang natira dito na 12BA6 pentodes. you can solicit the advice of the experts like sir Tony, sir Edrel, sir Jojo, at marami pang iba dito sa Pdvd, i'm sure most of them will agree with me..... mga Sir's?? ;)
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Offline ATJr.

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Re: 6F6G SE Amp
« Reply #16 on: Apr 01, 2010 at 04:22 PM »
Quote
I was before thinking of regulating the whole B+ by using Zener diodes, but locally available Zeners is only up to 200V / 5W. I need at least 250 or 260V.


I am unable to post pictures, but if you fire me an email i can give you an cathode follower regulator using strings of 1/2 watt zeners...
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Offline mhore

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Re: 6F6G SE Amp
« Reply #17 on: Apr 02, 2010 at 12:25 PM »
pareng mhore,

 you only have to add tube buffer for that "tubey sound", I tried it before, wag ka lang mainip, inumpisahan ko na tube line driver/buffer mo, swerte mo pre may dalwa pang natira dito na 12BA6 pentodes.

sige pre, abonohan mo muna he he he! bayaran ko sayo pag natapos. ;D
not so audiophile person,as long as the sound pleases my ears

Offline edrel sison

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Re: 6F6G SE Amp
« Reply #18 on: Apr 03, 2010 at 09:28 AM »
"bad" record really.. ;D ;D
it was really really bad touching "knobs" other than your amps and pre-amps. :D :D

6L6s is not in the category of the 6V6s power wise..12L6 maybe..

so PTX, a choke and a pair of OPTs, ready?? :o :o

Offline efren_

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Re: 6F6G SE Amp
« Reply #19 on: Apr 09, 2010 at 12:33 PM »
Good day fellow DIY'ers,

my 6F6G amp now with wood plinth...pardon my "amateur carpentry" ( i really hate woodworking but  now i have no choice but to craft my own). Well, that's the essence of being a DIY'er, do almost everything on your own, you are forced to learn even metal works, paint job, etc...





now starting the top cover (the metalworks) a #12 solid copper wire to form a "cage" for tubes & trannies, to shield them from those curious hands. ;D







I do hope in my own little way, i have provided even a small encouragement to those who plan to tread the bumpy road of a DIY'er ;D
"just keep 'em glowing"

Offline mhore

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Re: 6F6G SE Amp
« Reply #20 on: Apr 09, 2010 at 01:13 PM »
nice work!!! pwede na.  :D umpisahan mo na yung sakin ;)
not so audiophile person,as long as the sound pleases my ears

Offline efren_

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Re: 6F6G SE Amp
« Reply #21 on: Apr 09, 2010 at 01:27 PM »
'preng mhore,

bakit nawala yung pix na pinost mo? pag binura mo sa photobucket mawawala din dito.
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Offline efren_

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Re: 6F6G SE Amp
« Reply #22 on: Apr 09, 2010 at 01:36 PM »
nice work!!! pwede na.  :D umpisahan mo na yung sakin ;)

patience pre, itong top cover nlang ;D ;D ;D
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Offline edrel sison

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Re: 6F6G SE Amp
« Reply #23 on: Apr 10, 2010 at 08:50 AM »
hindi ba naka connect sa b+ yang top cover mo? ;D ;D

Offline mhore

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Re: 6F6G SE Amp
« Reply #24 on: Apr 10, 2010 at 11:35 AM »
'preng mhore,

bakit nawala yung pix na pinost mo? pag binura mo sa photobucket mawawala din dito.

accidentally nabura ko yata sa photbucket. kaya nga minodify ko yung isang post ko para makita uli picture. :D
not so audiophile person,as long as the sound pleases my ears

Offline efren_

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Re: 6F6G SE Amp
« Reply #25 on: Apr 10, 2010 at 04:42 PM »
hindi ba naka connect sa b+ yang top cover mo? ;D ;D

binigyan nyo ko idea sir, para walang humipo ;D( chasis ground lang po)
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Offline efren_

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Re: 6F6G SE Amp
« Reply #26 on: Apr 11, 2010 at 08:06 PM »
I just have to post this...

several posts back, ( also in some other threads) they say 1 watt RMS of pure audio is more than enough for listening, ( normal, not too loud nor too soft,) well, I have proven it myself, my 6F6G's output is just over than a Watt/ Ch. but it can really knock your socks off! ;D
Crank up the volume and it can really go loud with negligible clipping.

Here are my listening parameters:

Amplifier- 6F6G single ended, triode strapped, class A operation, 363volts, 43mA each power tube.

Room- 20m X 20m uninsulated.

Drivers(loudspeakers)- Philips AD50600(vintage according to sir Edrel) 5" currently installed on bookshelf type enclosure.

 "less is more" according to the Gurus....they were absolutely right :D 
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Offline efren_

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Re: 6F6G SE Amp
« Reply #27 on: May 03, 2010 at 07:31 PM »
Mhore,

your 12BA6 buffer in the making:

Layout.......

Drilling..........

by the way, eto pala yun cover na pinagkaablahan ko.

habang nagbubutas eto pinakinggan ko.

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Offline mhore

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Re: 6F6G SE Amp
« Reply #28 on: May 03, 2010 at 08:34 PM »
ayos pre! hindi na ko makapag antay  :D bilisan mo ang pag bubutas ng chassis go! go! go! ;D ;D
sana maganda ang maging resulta!!! kelan ako punta diyan sa inyo? ihanda mo na yung chivas diyan!
not so audiophile person,as long as the sound pleases my ears

Offline edrel sison

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Re: 6F6G SE Amp
« Reply #29 on: May 06, 2010 at 09:30 AM »



phelps dodge ba yang ginamit mo dyan? ;D kailangan mo ng electrical permit sa munisipyo ha reminder lng. pag hindi ipapatigil yang construction mo.. ;D ;D
« Last Edit: May 06, 2010 at 09:30 AM by edrel sison »