Author Topic: The Religion Thread  (Read 360674 times)

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Offline bumblebee

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Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #2520 on: May 03, 2017 at 09:23 AM »
How was it out of context and blown up?

Because this is a pear.



If the bible isn't clear about the shape, then we move on then.

How old is the earth?
« Last Edit: May 03, 2017 at 09:25 AM by bumblebee »

Offline JT

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Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #2521 on: May 03, 2017 at 09:51 AM »
Because this is a pear.

If the bible isn't clear about the shape, then we move on then.  How old is the earth?

So any idea why that scientist says pear is the actual shape of the earth when NASA's pictures clearly shows a round ball???

Anyway, there was no accurate measurement for the earth's age.  Even carbon dating is not reliable.  A newly dead animal can come up dead for 600 yrs with this validation process.

Biblically, Earth's age seems to be between 6000-7000 years old in our Adamic age . However, there is that theory of pre-Adamic age (before man) where Earth already existed before and was restored by God from chaos mentioned in Genesis.

What about you? What do you think?

Offline dpogs

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Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #2522 on: May 03, 2017 at 10:02 AM »
Quote
"Biblically, Earths age seems to be between 6000 - 70000 years old"

andoon na ang salitang "biblically" kaya ano pa nga ba ang paniniwalaan ko - I believe the earth still young (6-7K years old). :)
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Offline bumblebee

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Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #2523 on: May 03, 2017 at 10:07 AM »
The earth is probably around 42km wider below the equator. In context, that's hardly noticeable. The earth isn't perfectly round as Mt Mayon isn't a perfect cone. I hope you get the idea.

6000-7000 years of man you say. We'll get to that. Earth muna. How old?

Offline dpogs

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Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #2524 on: May 03, 2017 at 10:11 AM »
The earth is probably around 42km wider below the equator. In context, that's hardly noticeable. The earth isn't perfectly round as Mt Mayon isn't a perfect cone. I hope you get the idea.

6000-7000 years of man you say. We'll get to that. Earth muna. How old?

Earth is 6000 - 7000 years old.

Less than 10,000 years old.
« Last Edit: May 03, 2017 at 10:13 AM by dpogs »
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Offline bumblebee

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Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #2525 on: May 03, 2017 at 10:13 AM »
Earth is 6000 - 7000 years old.

Hindi, meron pa raw pre-adamic age. Yun yung tinatanong ko sa kanya,

Ikaw ba, 6k to 7k, all in na?

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Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #2526 on: May 03, 2017 at 10:15 AM »
Hindi, meron pa raw pre-adamic age. Yun yung tinatanong ko sa kanya,

Ikaw ba, 6k to 7k, all in na?

6k to 10k - I believe in literal seven day (24 hour/day) creation
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Offline JT

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Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #2527 on: May 03, 2017 at 10:26 AM »
Hindi, meron pa raw pre-adamic age. Yun yung tinatanong ko sa kanya,

Ikaw ba, 6k to 7k, all in na?

I got nothing to say further on pre-adamic age as the bible is not directly saying that.  And yes, 6k-7k years old is my approximate guess.

What say you? So where are you coming from?
« Last Edit: May 03, 2017 at 10:34 AM by JT »

Offline bumblebee

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Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #2528 on: May 03, 2017 at 10:40 AM »
I believe it's 4.5B years old.

Do all of you Bible believers agree with 6-7k, 10k?

Offline t-bone

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Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #2529 on: May 03, 2017 at 10:43 AM »
Earth is 6000 - 7000 years old.

Less than 10,000 years old.


When did the the Dinosaurs appear within the 10,000 year life of the Earth?
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Offline JT

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Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #2530 on: May 03, 2017 at 10:51 AM »

I believe it's 4.5B years old.

Do all of you Bible believers agree with 6-7k, 10k?

Any proof? Or you just want us to simply believe in your word? or is it because majority believe it is 4.5b years old so that automatically the correct age?

Not all bible believers are particular nor interested with Earth's age.  That's  just majoring on the minor. What is major in Christianity is Jesus Christ.

Here's simple chart for the 6-7k age.

Take note that no one knows the end date so this is just for illustrations assuming Christ Millennial (1000 yrs) reign as part for the 7 days period.

Offline bumblebee

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Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #2531 on: May 03, 2017 at 11:01 AM »
Any proof? Or you just want us to simply believe in your word? or is it because majority believe it is 4.5b years old so that automatically the correct age?

Proof is easily google-able. But I got the idea when I was 11 from a science book.

Quote
Not all bible believers are particular nor interested with Earth's age.  That's  just majoring on the minor. What is major in Christianity is Jesus Christ.

Majoring the minor? More like dodging the question ;D You should at least get the basics sorted out, right?

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Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #2532 on: May 03, 2017 at 11:05 AM »
When did the the Dinosaurs appear within the 10,000 year life of the Earth?

Does anyone really knows? Everything about their period is just a theory.

Are dinosaurs mentioned in the Bible? There has been much discussion on the topic specifically involving verses in Job 40-41. Job is considered to be the oldest book of the Bible. Scholars, in studying Job's longevity (he lived up to 140 years), descriptions of his wealth and household, believe he was most likely alive after the time of Noah, but before the time of Abraham.

Behemoth: Job 40:15-24 speaks of a "behemoth." No one is really sure what it is, but read its description.
15 “Look now at the behemoth,which I made along with you; he eats grass like an ox.
16 See now, his strength is in his hips, and his power is in his stomach muscles.
17 He moves his tail like a cedar; the sinews of his thighs are tightly knit.
18 His bones are like beams of bronze, his ribs like bars of iron.
19 He is the first of the ways of God; only He who made him can bring near His sword.
20 Surely the mountains yield food for him, and all the beasts of the field play there.
21 He lies under the lotus trees, in a covert of reeds and marsh.
22 The lotus trees cover him with their shade; the willows by the brook surround him.
23 Indeed the river may rage, yet he is not disturbed; he is confident, though the Jordan gushes into his mouth,
24 Though he takes it in his eyes, or one pierces his nose with a snare."

The way the "behemoth" is described, doesn't it almost sound like a dinosaur? Perhaps one of the sauropods? Some will argue these verses are referring to the hippopotamus or elephant. However, they run into the problem of explaning vs 17, since the tails of both animals are...well, far from looking like a cedar tree (let along moving like one). Their tails more resemble switches.

Leviathan: In Job 41:1-2,7,12-32, the "Leviathan" is another creature described that has been hard to find a modern equivalent.
 1“Can you draw out Leviathan with a hook, or snare his tongue with a line which you lower?
 2 Can you put a reed through his nose, or pierce his jaw with a hook?...
 7 Can you fill his skin with harpoons, or his head with fishing spears?...
 12 “I will not conceal his limbs, his mighty power, or his graceful proportions.
 13 Who can remove his outer coat? Who can approach him with a double bridle?
 14 Who can open the doors of his face, with his terrible teeth all around?
 15 His rows of scales are his pride, shut up tightly as with a seal;
 16 One is so near another that no air can come between them;
 17 They are joined one to another, they stick together and cannot be parted.
 18 His sneezings flash forth light, and his eyes are like the eyelids of the morning.
 19 Out of his mouth go burning lights; sparks of fire shoot out.
 20 Smoke goes out of his nostrils, as from a boiling pot and burning rushes.
 21 His breath kindles coals, and a flame goes out of his mouth.
 22 Strength dwells in his neck, and sorrow dances before him.
 23 The folds of his flesh are joined together; they are firm on him and cannot be moved.
 24 His heart is as hard as stone, even as hard as the lower millstone.
 25 When he raises himself up, the mighty are afraid; because of his crashings they are beside themselves.
 26 Though the sword reaches him, it cannot avail; nor does spear, dart, or javelin.
 27 He regards iron as straw, and bronze as rotten wood.
 28 The arrow cannot make him flee; slingstones become like stubble to him.
 29Darts are regarded as straw; he laughs at the threat of javelins.
 30 His undersides are like sharp potsherds; he spreads pointed marks in the mire.
 31 He makes the deep boil like a pot; he makes the sea like a pot of ointment.
 32 He leaves a shining wake behind him; one would think the deep had white hair.

Some have translated the Leviathan to be a "crocodile," because of the large number currently present in the region. However, the crocodile pales in comparison to the description given to the Leviathan. Do crocodiles really raise themselves? Aren't the underbellies of crocodiles smooth rather than "sharp potsherds?" Does the crocodile really move fast enough and graceful enough to leave a "shining wake"? The Leviathan is also mentioned in the following verses: Psalms 74:14, 104:25-26, Is 27:1.

Offline JT

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Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #2533 on: May 03, 2017 at 11:06 AM »
Proof is easily google-able. But I got the idea when I was 11 from a science book.

Majoring the minor? More like dodging the question ;D You should at least get the basics sorted out, right?

Your source of truth is GOOGLE????

Offline bumblebee

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Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #2534 on: May 03, 2017 at 11:07 AM »
Your source of truth is GOOGLE????


No, you actually click on the links. You know how to use it, right? ;D

Offline JT

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Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #2535 on: May 03, 2017 at 11:15 AM »
No, you actually click on the links. You know how to use it, right? ;D

Ahhh googlemaster.  You know web contains different information and not all agree to one another right? So how do you reconcile or confirm it is the truth? 

History and science text books are being revised as some facts are changing on different generations.  So is there a definitive facts about these things you are putting your faith with?

Offline bumblebee

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Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #2536 on: May 03, 2017 at 11:22 AM »
Ahhh googlemaster.  You know web contains different information and not all agree to one another right? So how do you reconcile or confirm it is the truth? 

History and science text books are being revised as some facts are changing on different generations.  So is there a definitive facts about these things you are putting your faith with?


Actually, if you visit websites of schools, universities and scientific institutions, they pretty much agree with each other.

But now that you mentioned it, why is God allowing all these misinformation to be taught in schools, which I assume, correct me if I'm wrong, you also paid for?

Offline JT

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Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #2537 on: May 03, 2017 at 11:27 AM »
Actually, if you visit websites of schools, universities and scientific institutions, they pretty much agree with each other.

But now that you mentioned it, why is God allowing all these misinformation to be taught in schools, which I assume, correct me if I'm wrong, you also paid for?

God has already had it written down for the things man should know what is important in life. 

But man keeps trying on to figure it out more by himself.  Then formulates these so called facts which keeps on changing because they are all theories not truth.   No one can establish the truth except God. 

Man has pursued knowing the creation rather than knowing the creator.

Offline t-bone

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Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #2538 on: May 03, 2017 at 11:35 AM »
God has already had it written down for the things man should know what is important in life. 

But man keeps trying on to figure it out more by himself.  Then formulates these so called facts which keeps on changing because they are all theories not truth.   No one can establish the truth except God. 

So you are not in favor of Science?
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Offline JeromeA

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Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #2539 on: May 03, 2017 at 11:38 AM »
God has already had it written down for the things man should know what is important in life. 

But man keeps trying on to figure it out more by himself.  Then formulates these so called facts which keeps on changing because they are all theories not truth.   No one can establish the truth except God. 

Man has pursued knowing the creation rather than knowing the creator.

hindi dapat magkahiwalay ang bible at science. im not ang expert on this matter pero how sure you are na buong buo ang nakasulat sa bible?

napanood ko ang isa sa mga documentary ni stephen hawking. malaking factor ang science kesa sa paniniwala ng tao.

Offline JeromeA

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Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #2540 on: May 03, 2017 at 11:44 AM »
sa unang part palang ng documentary mapapaisip ka na..

during vikings time paniniwala nila pag nagkakaroon ng solar eclipse kinakain daw ng dragon ang araw. that's why nagtatambol sila para mapalayas iyon. ang then pag nawala na ang eclipse natutuwa sila kasi success ang ginawa nila. but then kalaunan nagkaroon ng paliwanag si aristotle (correct me if im wrong) about sa nangyayaring eclipse ayun natauhan ang mga tao.

same thing lang din. bulag ang bible pag walang science..

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Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #2541 on: May 03, 2017 at 11:54 PM »
bulag ang bible pag walang science..
Sir, hindi po bulag ang bible pag walang science. Science is confirming what the bible said about the physical world. The bible is by no means a book a science, it is a book about the nature of man, nature of God and our relationship to Him. But when it mentions the physical word, it is accurate.

One concrete example is in the book of Genesis, here the bible says time, light,  universe and all matter had a Beginning! The bible even mentions the nature of infection and importance of sanitation. These are just a few of the bible's description of the physical world that has been confirmed by science...
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Offline ninjababez®

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Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #2542 on: May 04, 2017 at 01:56 AM »
So any idea why that scientist says pear is the actual shape of the earth when NASA's pictures clearly shows a round ball???

Anyway, there was no accurate measurement for the earth's age.  Even carbon dating is not reliable.  A newly dead animal can come up dead for 600 yrs with this validation process.

Biblically, Earth's age seems to be between 6000-7000 years old in our Adamic age . However, there is that theory of pre-Adamic age (before man) where Earth already existed before and was restored by God from chaos mentioned in Genesis.

What about you? What do you think?

eto yata ibig nya sabihin bro




How would life on Earth been
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Offline JT

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Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #2543 on: May 04, 2017 at 10:32 AM »
So you are not in favor of Science?

Its not that I'm not in favor of Science but for me the bible is above Science. Not all that science says are the truth as like I said it is changing unlike the bible is constant throughout the ages.
 
But there are some examples of the harmony between science and the Bible. "In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth" (Genesis. 1:1) This was written by Moses through the inspiration of the Holy Spirit about 1500 B.C. In 1820 A.D. a man named Hubert Spencer gave the world five scientific principles by which man may study the unknown. They are time, force, energy, space, and matter. However, Moses, by inspiration, gave us those scientific principles in Genesis 1:1.
"In the beginning" --> time;
"God"--> force;
"created" --> energy;
"the heavens" --> space;
"and the earth" --> matter.
 
All of Spencer's scientific principles are right there in Genesis 1:1 which was written very long time ago which science just identified recently.


And another point  for me. Science (or man) may establish facts but only God can establish the Truth.

For example:
One of our pastor was visited by His inlaws(from manila) in Auckland last year.  During their stay here, the father-in-law had an heart attack, lungs collapsed and kidney failure all at the same time. Was rushed to the hospital and all the doctors says He wont last the night.

Now that is a FACT because there is a medical evidence. However, the bible says "by His stripes we are healed" and the "prayer of the righteous avails much". Given these TRUTHS written in the bible, every leaders and elders of the church prayed that night.

Not only he survived the night, he was discharged the next day as if nothing happened and able to stay longer here to complete their holidays. Every doctors in that hospital says it is impossible and they say our faith really works.

So how did that happen?


Another example:
While I was still in Singapore in 2010, we visited a couple in hospital with their 6 year old daughter having chemo for leukemia. The child is already too weak and doctor says max 6 months to live.

Again, the doctor is not lying as there are medical proof. Again, the bible says "by His stripes we are healed" and the "prayer of the righteous avails much". And after the church prays for healing, the child was completely healed after 6 mos without further chemo.  The doctors got baffled with her case and close the case as completely no more indication of cancer.

Instead of dying, becomes so much alive and now a very healthy 13 yrs old.

Any scientific explanation for these two cases?

Offline JT

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Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #2544 on: May 04, 2017 at 10:40 AM »
eto yata ibig nya sabihin bro


How would life on Earth been

Mas mukha yatang heart kaysa earth ...

But how could it change so fast into that shape if NASA claims these are actual pictures of the earth? the recent being in 2015.
 


Which picture is telling the truth?

From NASA web says it is pear-shape in some ways so somehow it will show in the pictures right?
https://image.gsfc.nasa.gov/poetry/ask/a11818.html

Offline bumblebee

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Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #2545 on: May 04, 2017 at 10:45 AM »
Who is Hubert Spencer?

Offline JT

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Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #2546 on: May 04, 2017 at 10:47 AM »
Who is Hubert Spencer?

Anyare sa pagiging googlemaster mo?

Offline bumblebee

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Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #2547 on: May 04, 2017 at 10:55 AM »
Anyare sa pagiging googlemaster mo?


I did. Tatanong ko ba kung nakita ko sya? ;D

Baka naman imbento mo lang ;D
« Last Edit: May 04, 2017 at 10:56 AM by bumblebee »

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Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #2548 on: May 04, 2017 at 11:47 AM »
I did. Tatanong ko ba kung nakita ko sya? ;D

Baka naman imbento mo lang ;D

The bible showed us how to response to someone not really seeking the truth but just want confrontation.

Jesus said "neither will i tell you ..."

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Re: The Religion Thread
« Reply #2549 on: May 04, 2017 at 11:52 AM »
Its not that I'm not in favor of Science but for me the bible is above Science. Not all that science says are the truth as like I said it is changing unlike the bible is constant throughout the ages.
 
But there are some examples of the harmony between science and the Bible. "In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth" (Genesis. 1:1) This was written by Moses through the inspiration of the Holy Spirit about 1500 B.C. In 1820 A.D. a man named Hubert Spencer gave the world five scientific principles by which man may study the unknown. They are time, force, energy, space, and matter. However, Moses, by inspiration, gave us those scientific principles in Genesis 1:1.
"In the beginning" --> time;
"God"--> force;
"created" --> energy;
"the heavens" --> space;
"and the earth" --> matter.
 
All of Spencer's scientific principles are right there in Genesis 1:1 which was written very long time ago which science just identified recently.


And another point  for me. Science (or man) may establish facts but only God can establish the Truth.

For example:
One of our pastor was visited by His inlaws(from manila) in Auckland last year.  During their stay here, the father-in-law had an heart attack, lungs collapsed and kidney failure all at the same time. Was rushed to the hospital and all the doctors says He wont last the night.

Now that is a FACT because there is a medical evidence. However, the bible says "by His stripes we are healed" and the "prayer of the righteous avails much". Given these TRUTHS written in the bible, every leaders and elders of the church prayed that night.

Not only he survived the night, he was discharged the next day as if nothing happened and able to stay longer here to complete their holidays. Every doctors in that hospital says it is impossible and they say our faith really works.

So how did that happen?


Another example:
While I was still in Singapore in 2010, we visited a couple in hospital with their 6 year old daughter having chemo for leukemia. The child is already too weak and doctor says max 6 months to live.

Again, the doctor is not lying as there are medical proof. Again, the bible says "by His stripes we are healed" and the "prayer of the righteous avails much". And after the church prays for healing, the child was completely healed after 6 mos without further chemo.  The doctors got baffled with her case and close the case as completely no more indication of cancer.

Instead of dying, becomes so much alive and now a very healthy 13 yrs old.

Any scientific explanation for these two cases?


The power of prayer. The most neglected area of our Christian life.
There is none righteous, no not one.