Author Topic: Non-Catholic (Read 71755 times)

dpogs · « **Reply #210 on:** Jul 30, 2015 at 08:45 PM »

Quote from: leomarley on Jul 30, 2015 at 06:19 PM

interesting. just want to ask. since the INC do not believe that Jesus is God(correct me if i'm wrong), are you saying that they are not, as you say, "true christians"?

first "Christian" ang tawag sa mga followers ni Christ before... at hindi mga apostles not even Jesus ang nagtawag sa mga believers before... its the people around them or the pagans called those who believes that Jesus is GOd are called Christians... kasi sa ngayon basta hindi ka naniniwala kay allah/buddha/other gods Christian na kasi lagi tawag...

kaya ko naman nasabi na may "true" Christians because there are genuine faith and false faith or masabi lang na naniniwala siya sa Diyos/Jesus... kaya nga sabi sa BIble hindi lahat ng tumatawag sa Diyos ay maliligtas... eto ang mga false or professing to be Christians... may mga tao na pumupunta lang sa simbahan kasi sinasama lang ng kanilang nanay... but deep inside theri heart wala talagang genuine faith... iyong iba naman pinagkakaperahan...

at papaano mo masasabi kung may genuine faith (true Christian) ang isang tao... we can't... only that person can tell if he/she have a genuine faith kasi it is a personal relationship betweeh him/her and God...

tungkol naman po doon sa tanong mo... nagstay ako sa Laguna at isa sa mga naging project ko doon ay pag-aralan ang mga Rizalista sa Calamba... unang-una bakit natin tinawag na "Rizalista" sila - kasi naniniwala sila na diyos si Jose Rizal...

kung meron mang naniniwala dito na diyos si Dpogs malamang tawag sa kanila ay "Dpogista"

can you call someone Christian if he/she doesnt believe in Jesus Christ as God and their personal saviour?

tungkol naman sa

pekspert · « **Reply #211 on:** Jul 30, 2015 at 08:49 PM »

ito ba eh isang totoong christian at pupunta siya sa langit?

tony · « **Reply #212 on:** Jul 30, 2015 at 09:18 PM »

well at least hindi kami tinuruan ng mga pari na manglait at magmura.....
ang puno kasi nakikila sa bunga....

tony · « **Reply #213 on:** Jul 30, 2015 at 09:21 PM »

pero bakit nga bang mga Sunni at Shia parehong muslim pero kung magpatayan wagas....

barrister · « **Reply #214 on:** Jul 30, 2015 at 10:01 PM »

Quote from: tony on Jul 30, 2015 at 08:04 PM

so these "hell" are actual places here in earth and not some imagined place?
i have always suspected that hell is here on earth, that is why i imagine i will go to heaven
because all my life was spent in hell.....

Sabi ko na nga ba doon pupunta yon...

Kung nasa hell na tayo ngayon, wala na tayong problema.

Sarap non, kahit magnakaw at pumatay ka, langit ka pa rin.

dpogs · « **Reply #215 on:** Jul 30, 2015 at 10:23 PM »

I believe hell is in the center of the earth... Iba pa ung lake of fire na kung saan may final judgemt pa.

leomarley · « **Reply #216 on:** Jul 30, 2015 at 11:49 PM »

Quote from: dpogs on Jul 30, 2015 at 08:45 PM

first "Christian" ang tawag sa mga followers ni Christ before... at hindi mga apostles not even Jesus ang nagtawag sa mga believers before... its the people around them or the pagans called those who believes that Jesus is GOd are called Christians... kasi sa ngayon basta hindi ka naniniwala kay allah/buddha/other gods Christian na kasi lagi tawag...

kaya ko naman nasabi na may "true" Christians because there are genuine faith and false faith or masabi lang na naniniwala siya sa Diyos/Jesus... kaya nga sabi sa BIble hindi lahat ng tumatawag sa Diyos ay maliligtas... eto ang mga false or professing to be Christians... may mga tao na pumupunta lang sa simbahan kasi sinasama lang ng kanilang nanay... but deep inside theri heart wala talagang genuine faith... iyong iba naman pinagkakaperahan...

at papaano mo masasabi kung may genuine faith (true Christian) ang isang tao... we can't... only that person can tell if he/she have a genuine faith kasi it is a personal relationship betweeh him/her and God...

tungkol naman po doon sa tanong mo... nagstay ako sa Laguna at isa sa mga naging project ko doon ay pag-aralan ang mga Rizalista sa Calamba... unang-una bakit natin tinawag na "Rizalista" sila - kasi naniniwala sila na diyos si Jose Rizal...

kung meron mang naniniwala dito na diyos si Dpogs malamang tawag sa kanila ay "Dpogista"

can you call someone Christian if he/she doesnt believe in Jesus Christ as God and their personal saviour?

tungkol naman sa

medyo malabo ata yung sagot. sabi mo kasi that if they don't believe that Jesus is God then they are not True Christians. the INC does not believe that Jesus is God but they believe in his teachings. so are they not True Christians?

dpogs · « **Reply #217 on:** Jul 31, 2015 at 12:03 AM »

Quote from: leomarley on Jul 30, 2015 at 11:49 PM

medyo malabo ata yung sagot. sabi mo kasi that if they don't believe that Jesus is God then they are not True Christians. the INC does not believe that Jesus is God but they believe in his teachings. so are they not True Christians?

how can i tell if they are true or false christian eh on the first place they dont even believe that Jesus is God... well sa ngayon kasi ang term na christian eh applicable na sa lahat ng faith na ginagamit ang Bible sa kanilang teachings... sa panahon ngayon maari nating tawagin ang sinuman na christian simply by being a follower of Jesus teachings...

but for me di ko matatawag na christian ang isang tao kung hindi siya naniniwala na isang Diyos at Tagapagligtas si Jesus Christ.

leomarley · « **Reply #218 on:** Jul 31, 2015 at 12:11 AM »

ah ok so personal opinion lang pala. fair enough.

dpogs · « **Reply #219 on:** Jul 31, 2015 at 01:13 AM »

Quote from: leomarley on Jul 31, 2015 at 12:11 AM

ah ok so personal opinion lang pala. fair enough.

it maybe be my personal opinion but the Bible says... "Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven;"

not all who says they're 'christian' will enter into the kingdom of heaven...

oweidah · « **Reply #220 on:** Jul 31, 2015 at 04:00 AM »

dats y i said pag ganyan, "exclusivity" only we, true believers will be saved = away gyera.
tell dat to jews, muslims, catholics etc

dpogs · « **Reply #221 on:** Jul 31, 2015 at 04:31 AM »

Quote from: ojofool on Jul 31, 2015 at 04:00 AM

dats y i said pag ganyan, "exclusivity" only we, true believers will be saved = away gyera.
tell dat to jews, muslims, catholics etc

Jesus Christ said ...

"Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven." Mat.7:21

Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves. Mat.7:15

malamang lamang ang nagsasabing "only we will be saved" ay ang false prophets...

bumblebee · « **Reply #222 on:** Jul 31, 2015 at 06:09 AM »

Quote from: dpogs on Jul 30, 2015 at 08:45 PM

at papaano mo masasabi kung may genuine faith (true Christian) ang isang tao... we can't... only that person can tell if he/she have a genuine faith kasi it is a personal relationship betweeh him/her and God...

If that's the case, how were you able to tell that the LGBT mentioned a few posts back won't go to heaven? Are you God himself?

dpogs · « **Reply #223 on:** Jul 31, 2015 at 06:32 AM »

Quote from: bumblebee on Jul 31, 2015 at 06:09 AM

If that's the case, how were you able to tell that the LGBT mentioned a few posts back won't go to heaven? Are you God himself?

ang sabi ko... if that person is a true christian or genuine christian then that person is going to heaven... if not then there is nothing else but hell... that is applicable to all i mention that also.

Quote from: dpogs on Jul 29, 2015 at 04:15 PM

Now... Bago ko sagutin to... Baka gusto mong dagdagan na natin...

"gay, kristiyano, tunay na kristiyano" - heaven
"gay, kristiyano, di tunay na kristiyano" - not heaven

sinabi ko ba mismo na LGBT will go to hell? please qoute me... baka nakalimutan ko lang

PS: I am not god... but the Bible says that all sinners (that includes alll human both homoexuals or heterosexulas, including me and you) are going to hell unless they do the will of God the Father (Mat 7:21).

bumblebee · « **Reply #224 on:** Jul 31, 2015 at 07:00 AM »

^My point is, in one post you can define what a "true" Christian is. In another, you say no one cannot tell because it is between God and the person.

tony · « **Reply #225 on:** Jul 31, 2015 at 07:07 AM »

Quote from: barrister on Jul 30, 2015 at 10:01 PM

Sabi ko na nga ba doon pupunta yon...

Kung nasa hell na tayo ngayon, wala na tayong problema.

Sarap non, kahit magnakaw at pumatay ka, langit ka pa rin.

you missed the point....when you commit crimes,
the justice system takes care of you....
if you are truly contrite and mend your ways,
there is hope for your salvation...

i think that virtue and character is its own reward...
for me a righteous man is in heaven already....
a state of bliss and blessedness....
here there or anywhere, everywhere....

dpogs · « **Reply #226 on:** Jul 31, 2015 at 07:15 AM »

Quote from: bumblebee on Jul 31, 2015 at 07:00 AM

^My point is, in one post you can define what a "true" Christian is. In another, you say no one cannot tell because it is between God and the person.

hmmm... ganyan ang mga tanong hindi iyong manghuhusga ka agad na may pinost ako... kumbaga eh leading agad ang tanong mo

a true christian are those believer and have genuine faith to Jesus Christ as their God and Saviour... that is how i define true christian - i never mention yang sinasbi mong pinost kuno...

saka defining a meaning and knowing a "true" chrstian magkaiba iyon...

we can only assume that a person is a true christian according to his/her works/testimonies... if he/she keeps on sinning then that person is not true christian based on his/her works... or based on his/her testimonies...

but to know if that person have genuine faith (thus a true christian)... then it is between that person and God...

kidlat08 · « **Reply #227 on:** Jul 31, 2015 at 07:26 AM »

Quote from: pekspert on Jul 30, 2015 at 08:49 PM

ito ba eh isang totoong christian at pupunta siya sa langit?

Nakakalungkot isipin na may mga ganitong tao na nagsasamantala sa mga nangyayari ngayon. Duda ko hindi ito INC, dahil paulit ulit nyang tinatawag na SIMBAHAN ang mga gusaling sambahan ng INC. Kahit ang anak kong 6 years old, alam nya na ang tawag namin sa mga gusaling ito ay KAPILYA

Naalala ko tuloy nung Yolanda. May lumabas na picture sa Internet na pinakita ang Kapilya ng Tacloban, habang ang mga bahay sa paligid ay halos nadurog na. Biglang naglabasan ang mga chismis na hindi daw nagpapasok ng ibang mga tao sa loob ng kapilya at hinayaan na lang mamatay. Marami rin akong nabasang mga masasakit na salita laban sa amin noon. Pero nung humupa na ang bagyo, nakapasok na ang mga relief sa Tacloban, nalaman na halos lahat ng pamilya sa paligid kung nasaan ang kapilya, ay kinupkop at pinapasok sa loob habang dumadaan ang bagyo.

bumblebee · « **Reply #228 on:** Jul 31, 2015 at 07:27 AM »

Quote from: dpogs on Jul 31, 2015 at 07:15 AM

hmmm... ganyan ang mga tanong hindi iyong manghuhusga ka agad na may pinost ako... kumbaga eh leading agad ang tanong mo

May pinost ka naman talaga. Kaya nga ako naguluhan e. And which leading question is that?

dpogs · « **Reply #229 on:** Jul 31, 2015 at 07:51 AM »

Quote from: bumblebee on Jul 31, 2015 at 07:27 AM

May pinost ka naman talaga. Kaya nga ako naguluhan e. And which leading question is that?

kaya nga po... i quote mo ako na nag post under this thread kung sinabi ko ba talaga specifically na LGBT will go to hell...

you're assuming kasi na doon lagi papunta ang sasabihin ko

as you can see i never i tried most of the time na instead homosexual address ko sa kanila dito ang ginagamit ko ay 'person'... because when it comes to heaven or hell our sexual preference means nothing...

sirhc · « **Reply #230 on:** Jul 31, 2015 at 07:54 AM »

Quote from: pekspert on Jul 30, 2015 at 08:49 PM

ito ba eh isang totoong christian at pupunta siya sa langit?

Don't know about the screen grab above but I personally experienced these "turo" on INC's sunday school for kids. My Ex-GF pad was next to a venue where an INC minister conducts their sunday school on, the landlord was an INC. What you'll hear on their teachings almost borders on hate messages. Its as if they're brainwashing their kids to hate on other religion, notably, Catholics and their practices.

bumblebee · « **Reply #231 on:** Jul 31, 2015 at 07:58 AM »

Quote from: dpogs on Jul 31, 2015 at 07:51 AM

kaya nga po... i quote mo ako na nag post under this thread kung sinabi ko ba talaga specifically na LGBT will go to hell...

you're assuming kasi na doon lagi papunta ang sasabihin ko as you can see i never i tried most of the time na instead homosexual address ko sa kanila dito ang ginagamit ko ay 'person'... because when it comes to heaven or hell our sexual preference means nothing...

Ganito ha? Gay, nagsisimba, me bf, hindi nya tinigil yung relationship nya with the bf, biglang namatay. Langit ba pupunta? Sabi mo, hindi sya "tunay na Kristyano", so hindi langit.

Pro sabi mo rin, only God knows. And yet, you knew. Gets mo na?

sirhc · « **Reply #232 on:** Jul 31, 2015 at 08:12 AM »

^I think the apt venue for your argument with Dpogs is in the LGBT issues - Religous version. Sayang naman yung thread na ginawa ni Klaus if dito niyo paguusapan yan. just my 2 cents worth.

bumblebee · « **Reply #233 on:** Jul 31, 2015 at 08:16 AM »

^The LGBT thing is just an example. The point really, is to know where he is coming from, regarding being a Christian, because honestly I can't tell

Quitacet · « **Reply #234 on:** Jul 31, 2015 at 08:24 AM »

Quote from: leomarley on Jul 30, 2015 at 06:19 PM

interesting. just want to ask. since the INC do not believe that Jesus is God(correct me if i'm wrong), are you saying that they are not, as you say, "true christians"?

The INC does not believe that Jesus Christ is GOd because INC is monotheistic in the sense that except for the Father, there's no other God.

Jesus Christ though not God in the belief of the INC is not considered as ordinary man. He was given a lot of extraordinary endowments by God: he was given Lordship, powers beyond ordinary man, he is the Son of God, He is the Savior, he is the Christ, he is the head of the Church, thus Iglesia Ni Cristo, He is the way to God's kingdom.

FYM on the other hand though refer to as angel does not mean higher than Christ, because angel came from angelus "Latin for angel" meaning messenger or tagapaghatid ng balita, in older tagalog: Sugo.

Plus the INC believes that Christ was originally believed not to be God by early Christians.

Of course many of you will find these unbelievable. But from where we are coming from, what is unbelievable is the belief that God had to transform into human then when on Earth, he called and prayed to himself to make the cup of suffering pass him, and when on the cross, he commended his spirit to his other self. Simplu put, we do not believe God is suffering from multiple personalities.

Like everything in religion, it's a matter of belief. We believed something that is not believed by many other people. That's how the early Christians were like, come to think of it.

Quitacet · « **Reply #235 on:** Jul 31, 2015 at 08:25 AM »

Quote from: pekspert on Jul 30, 2015 at 08:49 PM

ito ba eh isang totoong christian at pupunta siya sa langit?

Gaya ng ng post ng isang tao sa FB. Tanga na lang ang maniniwala na INC ang nagpost nito.

dpogs · « **Reply #236 on:** Jul 31, 2015 at 08:26 AM »

Quote from: bumblebee on Jul 31, 2015 at 07:58 AM

Ganito ha? Gay, nagsisimba, me bf, hindi nya tinigil yung relationship nya with the bf, biglang namatay. Langit ba pupunta? Sabi mo, hindi sya "tunay na Kristyano", so hindi langit.

Pro sabi mo rin, only God knows. And yet, you knew. Gets mo na?

mahirap iyang "sabi mo kasi ganito.. ganire"... just qoute me sa post ko na iyon... madali lang naman yan eh... punta ka sa post ko then click "Qoute"

now... if you're referring to these then nasa sa iyo na ang problema kung di mo nagets ang example

Quote from: dpogs on Jul 29, 2015 at 04:15 PM

Now... Bago ko sagutin to... Baka gusto mong dagdagan na natin...

"gay, kristiyano, tunay na kristiyano" - heaven
"gay, kristiyano, di tunay na kristiyano" - not heaven

tony · « **Reply #237 on:** Jul 31, 2015 at 08:26 AM »

Quote from: sirhc on Jul 31, 2015 at 07:54 AM

Don't know about the screen grab above but I personally experienced these "turo" on INC's sunday school for kids. My Ex-GF pad was next to a venue where an INC minister conducts their sunday school on, the landlord was an INC. What you'll hear on their teachings almost borders on hate messages. Its as if they're brainwashing their kids to hate on other religion, notably, Catholics and their practices.

i remember a very young kid went over to my place,
he said "kaya hind kayo mayaman kasi hindi kayo kasapi ng Iglesia"
hindi man lang sinaway ng magulang...
they boy must be 7 or 8 years old at the time...
i just smiled, nod and kept quiet.....
bata palang yan me kahambugan na.....tsk...tsk...tsk...

tony · « **Reply #238 on:** Jul 31, 2015 at 08:29 AM »

Quote from: Quitacet on Jul 31, 2015 at 08:24 AM

The INC does not believe that Jesus Christ is GOd because INC is monotheistic in the sense that except for the Father, there's no other God.

yes, just like the Muslims, the father dis not have a son....

oweidah · « **Reply #239 on:** Jul 31, 2015 at 08:30 AM »

o.t.
na miss ko tuloy 70s sa harap ng quiapo church at luneta, pagsapit ng dilim, ayan na, debate ng mga relihiyoso' bukas ang kanya.kanyang biblia, very animated.

@dpogs, will a true muslim go to heaven?