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Re: Official Cayin Thread
« Reply #330 on: Jan 22, 2008 at 01:55 PM »
Enjoy the Music.com

Cayin's $1,295 Integrated Dual Mode A-50T Amplifier  by A. Colin Flood




I heard a copper faced Cayin TA-30 drive big ole horns at a Klipsch gathering in Arkansas two years ago (thanks, Daddydee) I was so favorably impressed, I jumped like a frog to review this Cayin amplifier! The silver and black Cayin (pronounced “Kai-an”) A-50T is a beefy, Chinese-built, $1295, integrated amplifier, with both triode and ultra linear modes. It is rated at 16-watts per channel, in triode mode, with a remote control. The A-50T is a classic tube Marantz 8B or Dynaco Class B tube design with EL-34 power output (four),
12AU7 and 12AX7 (two each) input tubes. Ron Nagle reviewed the A-50T’s bigger brother in the December 2006 issue.

One glance at the A-50T however, and I had to compare it to Antique Sound Lab’s AQ1003 DT Integrated Amplifier, which I reviewed two years ago. The AQ is a very similar integrated tube amplifier. It delivers 30-watts, using the same tubes, but derived from Class A electrical topology, for almost the same price. “This is how,” I wrote then, “amplifiers should be built: beefy, powerful, yet sweet and
delicate; with fun-to-use bias and remote controls; and relatively low-cost. A very good value for sound and quality.” Although the power output tubes are the same on both amplifiers, the transformers are larger on the AQ1003DT. Most of the time, I listened to the AQ1003DT on the solid-state powered sub-woofers of Aperion’s $599 Intimus 522D-PTPowered Towers, in a small, bright, but open room. Unfortunately, these two amps did not co-exist in the same room, with the same speakers, at the same time. Only the music and reviewer are the same. I did not “hear the A-50T back-to-back with the AQ to be able to honestly say which one I like better.” So much for a rigorously-controlled, scientific-listening experiment. Cayin means gold sounding in Chinese. They manufacture their amps in ZhuHai, close to Hong Kong, China. US models are voiced by VAS for the US domestic market. There are 50 Cayin authorized dealers in the U S. VAS maintains a complete inventory of most products. There are some products that are special orders. Special orders take up to 60 days.

The amplifier came double-boxed in 2-inch of Styrofoam, with a pair of white cotton gloves to handle the tubes. Like the AQ, there is a thin, gray Dove-bar size remote control; a modern feature which adds considerable ease of use to classic components.While the there are two sets of beefy taps on the rear, for 4 and 8-ohm connections, the A-50T does not have the sub-woofer outputs of the AQ. The tube sockets are labeled, but the tubes come installed and wrapped in Styrofoam. The black tube cage pops off easily, allowing quick adjustment to the bias pots.

Unlike the AQ, there is no easy-to-use bias meter however. You have to stick the probes of a voltmeter into holes by the tubes in order to get bias readings. The A-50T transformers are labeled in gold and the power cord is detachable for tweaking audiophiles seeking to improve their unit. Overall the Cayin, like the AQ, provides a very favorable impression of solid quality, blended with excellent value.

The Cayin importer is VAS Industries. Steve Leung is President of VAS for over 3 years. (He is also an Aurum Cantus Ribbon speaker importer too.) He is an audiophile for over 25 years. He loves the warm and musical sound of tube amplifiers. VAS is located near Newark, NJ.

Leung says tube amplifiers are better today than years ago. “Today, he says, we make better power transformers, better output transformer and utilize hand crafted point to point wiring. Sound quality is much better than older tube amps! The technology improving “with higher quality components.”

This A-50T unit was opened and checked out before shipment. He suggests a break-in of approximately 50 hours and a warmup time of approximately 30 minutes. In fact, the A-50T did seem harsh when first powered-up. When the A-50T starts up, it defaults to the CD source. It takes 30-seconds to operate fully, during which time the blue light on the volume knob blinks. When the blue light is solid, the unit is ready to crank. During power-up, the selector knob can not turn to another source. You have to wait for the A-50T to power up completely before turning its selector knob. So while you are waiting to select the source, you can load the video or music disc.

Cayin doesn’t generally recommend any special treatment or placement of the amplifier. They feel the amplifiers’ own footers are enough. Special amplifier stands however, can make a difference as well as tube dampening rings. But, Cayin says, this option is “up to each user’s ears.” If you use tube damping rings, Cayin suggests using them on the driver tubes only. Interestingly enough, the A-50T switches on the fly from its ultra linear to triode mode with the gray remote control. Big ole horn loudspeakers are so amazingly efficient that a mere two or three-watts drives most music in most homes. Low powered, single ended triode (SET) tube amplifiers therefore, are a wonderful option for tweaking audiophiles with big ole horns (See my reviewer’s bio for the context of all reviews.)

On The Fly Triode
SET design is simple, elegant, requires very little manipulation and produces an easy listening second order distortion which our ears equate with acoustic instruments. A push-pull style tube amplifier however, splits the signal into two halves and then recombines the halves in its output. The single 12AX7 tube stage in a tube pre-amplifier is a SET design. Most great audio tube preamps are SET designs.

The VAS web site says the triode mode is “the ‘BEST’ way to listen to tubes. Although the [triode] output decreases, the bandwidth increases, the distortion decreases, and damping factor increases as compared to PENTODE operation.” Big ole horns are so amazingly efficient that a mere two or three-watts drives most music in most homes. Low power SET amplifiers therefore, are a wonderful option for tweaking audiophiles with horns.

Ultra linear mode, the VAS site says, is a superb compromise between the simple triode and five-stage pentode tubes. “The output power is more than TRIODE, yet you have most of the benefits of triode. You have better linearity, greater damping factor, and lower distortion, but virtually the same power output as pentode” style amps. In ultra linear mode, the A-50T doubles its output, to 35-watts. It sounded a lot more powerful than that.

The tubes selected for the Cayin A-50t are matched for most musical and dynamic sound. “We have tried most the new tube available today.” The tubes should last for 3,000 hours due to their low bias setting. Bias is set for 0.3 volts, so a small multimeter is required to read the tube voltage settings. Replacement tubes are $160 for the complete set of 8 tubes from VAS. Tweaking audiophiles know when their tubes are wearing out, Leung says, when the sound is slow or the high frequency rolls off.

Or, in this case, when one of them starts to crackle. One of the output tubes seemed to glow brightly shortly after receiving my review unit, but when it warmed up, the crackling went away. When the crackling remains, it is time to replace the tube. Leung recommends changing the 4 power tubes first, but for the best sound, replace all the tubes.

Cayin thoughtfully provides a single white, soft cotton glove. The glove is not so tweaking audiophiles can dress like Michael Jackson. It is for handling the tubes. Oil and dirt from our greasy palms may wear down the delicate glass of hot tubes. Although actual damage is part of the folklore and mysticism of tube audio, the added glove is nice a nice touch. Wiping dust and fingerprints off the tubes with a moist, soft cloth works fine.

The amps are stable with 4-ohm, down to 2-ohm, loads. Using 20-ampere electrical service is certainly an audiophile tweak, Leung suggests, but worth it.

Comparisons
First impression of the A-50T is one of comfortable capability. Its 28+ hefty pounds, three large silver knobs, effortless sound and modern features make it seem like a far more expensive amp. The A-50T has unmistakable tube sound and capabilities, with out any severe deficiencies. On Holly Cole’s Temptation (Capitol, 1995), for example, there is clearly sweetness in the vocals, with plenty of mid-bass. Horns sound like horns. They are bright and brassy, with all the snap and class of Buckingham Guards.

Movies and music glow with A-50T’s lights. Its presence infects the house. Tube amps get a hard work-out in this household: they are always on. First a little “release the steam” music after a hard day at work. Then some more mellow, “let’s make dinner” jazz tunes. Finally, a video disc from Blockbuster. Action or drama mostly – sometimes comedy. This stereo is on all night long and most of the weekends too. Ears never wear out with tubes on big ole horns and the A-50T is no exception. Compared to the AQ1003DT, my Bottlehead 2A3 Paramours and refurbished Scott 299C integrated amplifiers — all of which I’ve heard at least briefly on big ole horns — the A-50T is a heavier, slightly more expensive unit, with unique and easy-to-use modern features.

The handy triode/ultra linear (TR/UL) button on the gray, dove bar, remote control made for wonderfully instant comparisons between the two modes. Push the button and the A-50T switches an LED on the front panel and changes its circuitry mode; amber for triode and range for ultra linear mode. Slick. At first, the difference between the two modes at low volumes on both horns and cones seems slight. Switching between the two modes is not as revealing as I expected. One mode is not clearly better sounding, with movies or music, as I expected. Only different.

Yet after a while, the orange UL mode seems like a loudness switch. It seems to re-shape response curve, lifting the mid-bass, sharpening the treble and bringing voices forward. In that respect, the orange UL mode is better at low volumes (not what I expected). At normal to loud volumes, with peaks in the mid-90dbs, the middle-range on UL mode seems too strident, brittle and the treble grates. Otherwise, on long-time favorites like Diana Krall’s wonderful Stepping Out, there was not an appreciable difference in details or definitions between the two modes. Switching to the award-winning, delicate DACT Dual gold patch cords made just as much difference.

Even in triode mode, my Dynaco and Paramour amplifier combination is still slightly sweeter and more delicate than the A-50T, but 2A3 tubes are too low powered for all but the most ultra-efficient loudspeakers. With its integrated pre-amplifier, the A-50T is a very good value for most audiophiles. It is solid and powerful, with stronger mid-bass, powerful enough for my bookshelf speakers, but without the Nth degree of delicacy and mid-range smoothness of the Paramours’ 2A3 tubes.

Compared to a beast like the Delta 6s, the A-50T has the enjoyable tube sound. It does not have the wide soundstage, midrange nuances and strong mid-bass control of the massive Delta 6s, but then it is only a quarter of the weight and the price! If bass is where you live, the tube amplifiers I have heard with big ole horns do not have the cement-solid feel of even a modest solid-state amplifier, and the A-50T doesn’t change that. Yet, like the Delta 6s monster, its music too is like the live event. Neither one may not be as accurate, but music is more enjoyable than listening with modestly priced solid-state equipment. Of course, the A-50T is more musical on big ole horns, but on my cone speakers, it had enough of the high and mid-bass to satisfy. I am not switching from my passive bi-amp set-up, but if I was starting over, an amplifier like this one might be all I ever need.

A Reborn Classic
I grade slavishly. Only where the review equipment unit is “very good” – performing above average, will I confer four Blue Notes on the Enjoy The Music.com categories. The unit must work as hard for that score as a migrant worker in the noon-day sun. The A-50T is no exception. Across the board I thought this was a very good, all-around and capable performer. In my own personal category, Enjoyment, the A-50T scores 4 Blue Notes. I enjoyed the value it gives for the price. The A-50T is very good tube sound, at an excellent price. It will not be the weakest link in any normal audio/video chain with typical speakers, room or demands.

Two years ago, I said there was “very little to buy in the way of excellent tube pre or power amplifiers with good looks, hefty build, decent sound quality and modern features.” Now, there are several excellent choices from Antique Sound and Cayin. Cayin’s robust and practical construction, design and price are solid. The small remote control and TR/UL switch is addicting. This is one hard-to-beat modern version of a classic amplifier! Without any unusual demands, any tweaking audiophile would be proud to own, listen and enjoy this amplifier for a very long time. It is solid, strong sounding, yet sweet and delicate enough, with tube bias adjustment and remote control; making it a very good value for sound and quality. This integrated EL-34 unit is a winner at great price point.

For the online version please check http://audioamplified.com/Reviews/PDF/A50T_EnjoytheMusic.pdf

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Re: Official Cayin Thread
« Reply #331 on: Jan 22, 2008 at 02:11 PM »
Enjoy the Music.com

Cayin A-70T Integrated Tube Amplifier  by Ron Nagle




I said it all before there are some really good affordable audio components coming from the Pacific Rim most of them from Mainland China. Fact is that some U.S. based companies have their products either partially or entirely made offshore and they never mention that fact. The case of the now mostly defunct Red Rose Audio and their marketing philosophy stands out in my memory. In an ironic backhanded way this is a testimonial for the quality of Chinese manufacturing. Case in point is the affordable Cayin line of audio components. It is yet another example of Audiophile grade equipment that offers great value for the money. Read
on; lets take a look at the big picture.

Origins
As I just found out the Zhuhai Spark Electronic Equipment Co. LTD in China manufactures the subject Cayin A-70T amplifier and also the PrimaLuna line of audio components. The range of products made under just these two brand names is impressive. I first learned of the Cayin components last January at the 2006 CES. Ever since that time I have been very eager to try one of the Cayin amplifiers in my reference system. I was fortunate; after I made a phone call a representative from VAS Industries delivered the A-70T Integrated Amplifier to my home. The amplifier was placed on the floor between my Quad ESL 63 speakers and Gradient ESL woofers. I had been listening with a PrimaLuna 2 amplifier I replaced that with the Cayin A-70T. It took only one CD to know I had found a match for my Quad speakers. The way this Cayin amplifier is connected to my system I can drive the Quads full range with the A-70T or bi-amp the system using my modified Hafler 500 as the second amplifier powering only the Gradient woofers. Using the A-70T amplifier in a bi-amp setup gives me an advantage I can remove the lowest bass frequencies and listen to the sound produced from the lower midrange on up to dog whistle.

The Genealogy
This amplifier has a very interesting raison d’etre. As you probably know during the transistor heyday there was a thriving export business for classic American tube amplifiers from Marantz, Fisher, Scott, and others. A few enterprising people made a nice living buying old unwanted tube audio in America and selling these same units on the opposite side of the Pacific where they were getting three or four times what they paid. Of course it was inevitable that one day the supply would run out, still the demand remained alive and well. Now jump ahead and look at the last few years and the burgeoning Chinese economy. With increasing prosperity the demand for vintage American audio grew stronger than ever. Back in 1993 a Chinese company called China National Aero Technology began to manufacture audio components. They claimed that their products could duplicate the sound of classic Marantz, Citation and McIntosh amplifiers. Later on there was a spin off from the original company and the Zhuhai Spark Electronic Equipment Co. LTD was born. Incidentally the name Zhuhai refers to a region in China where the factory is located.

Deus Ex Machina
This is the section where we explore the nuts and bolts of the Cayin A-70T integrated amplifier. They are hand assembled with neat point-to-point wire routing. Sporting a thick aluminum faceplate they are coated with a beautiful metallic lacquer spraypainted over the steel chassis and tube cage. This integrated amplifier uses four Kt 88 Pentodes for power and is a Push Pull class A2 design. The A-70T owner manual describes the voltage setting procedure used to adjust tube bias but does not mention the tube type. However the procedure refers to the supplied KT88 pentodes. You can use other types of pentode output tubes but nothing is mentioned about the bias setting for these other tubes. The PrimaLuna PL 2 is made by the same company but differs because it has one less high level “Pre-input” and it does not have a “Pre-out” connection and is not remote controlled.

You might call the Cayin A-70T with KT88’s the upscale feature added big brother of the KT88 PrimaLuna PL 2. The A-70T is rated at 55 watts per channel and so it provides an additional 15-watts per side. The A-70T uses proprietary EI audio transformers and a toroidal power transformer said to have a much wider frequency response. The hand wired A-70T is a remote controlled integrated amplifier. This amplifier uses a 5AR4 rectifier tube. The driver tubes are two each 12AX7EH (hi-mu) and two 12AU7EH (medium-mu) tubes, both types are dual triodes. Incidentally the Greek letter Mu pronounced mew, is used to denote a tubes amplification factor.

For me the fun part of this amplifier is definitely the remote control feature. There is one remote control function that I always wanted to try. It is the ability to switch the amplifier between Triode and Ultralinear operation on the fly. Other than the small pushbutton power switch on the front panel all of the functions can be accessed via the aluminum remote control. There are eight buttons on the remote, two control up down volume, four select CD, Aux, Tape, Pre-in and Mute the last button switches between Triode and Ultra linear. After you switch on the amplifier a yellow colored Light Emitting Diode (LED) on the volume control knob blinks a yellow caution. After about 30 seconds that same diode turns red and the soft start cycle is completed the amplifier is than ready to go.

As I indicated the remote control allows you to select from one of the four input sources CD, Aux, Tape, and Pre-in. There is one additional pair of RCA connections on the rear panel labeled, Pre-out. The Pre-in and Pre-out connections offer an increased level of system flexibility. The first most obvious use for the Pre-in connections will enable you to separate from the preamp and use only the power amplifier portion of the A-70T. You might choose to use the pre-out to drive a powered subwoofer or run a set of cables to an outboard processor or recording device. On the top panel cover in two locations just in front of the left and right pairs of KT88 tubes are tube bias test points, three per side. Just above these test points are four bias potentiometers located below the top cover plate and accessible using a small slotted screwdriver. Using a voltmeter the bias adjustment is straightforward and easy to do. Each of the chassis tube openings has a nice decorative aluminum ring just above the sockets. The owners manual states that many different pentode tube types may be substituted for the stock KT88’s.

So if you are into “tube rolling” (tube substitution) like I am there are a lot of interesting tube tinkering possibilities waiting for you. Now look just behind the two output transformers at the back of the chassis. There are six sets of plastic covered WBT style speaker posts for connecting16, 8 and 4-Ohm speakers. There is an IEC style AC socket that allows you to use a variety of upgrade power cords.

Caveat Emptor
As I advanced farther in this report my research uncovered some confusing product duplication. There are actually two nearly identical models of this same Cayin amplifier. Acoustic Sounds markets a different version and states they are “ the exclusive on line dealer for Cayin Audio products” they sell a similar SA-70T Integrated Amplifier. But Acoustic Sounds lists different specifications for their amplifier. They specify the SA-70T amplifier power as having 30 watts per channel in Ultralinear and 18 watts in triode operation. A bit farther along on the Acoustic Sounds web site the manufacturer literature states that that the SA-70T amplifier uses auto bias. And provides a list of possible substitute pentode type tubes KT88, 6550, KT66, KT77, 5881, 6L6, EL34, 6CA7 and 7189A.

The integrated I am evaluating for this report is from VAS Industries the “Exclusive Cayin Importer and distributor” of the A-70T Integrated amplifier The A-70T owners manual specifies that it is rated at 55 watts Ultralinear and 26 watts triode. The A-70T will allow tube substitution using the same types of pentodes as the SA-70T but requires that you adjust tube bias manually. The power specifications of both amplifiers are rated into an 8-Ohm load using KT88 tubes and in every other way the amplifiers appear identical.

Understand that substituting other types of pentodes for the stock KT88’s will change the power rating for both versions of this amplifier. Additionally there is a slight price difference, the Acoustic Sounds SA-70T lists for $1,975 and the VAS A-70T lists for $1,995. I phoned VAS the importer and I was informed that the two versions of this amplifier are still available. However VAS Audio states that they import and sell only the “newer higher power” A-70T version. This audio amplifier has upgraded power transformers and costs twenty Dollars more and for me the choice between the two is the Cayin A-70T. The increased power will allow a broader range of applications and that means more system matches.

The Sound
The Chinese Zhuhai Spark Company still markets amplifiers that model themselves after classic American amplifiers of old. With KT88’s the Cayin A-70T is said to sound like a McIntosh Mc275 amplifier. If you go directly to the manufacturers site you can find a statement that the A-70T equipped with EL34 tubes sounds like a Classic Marantz 8 B amplifier. Yes I know, I would just like you take these claims with a large grain of salt. Unfortunately I don’t have either of these two grand old Dames of classic audio to do a comparison so just lets not go there. I will tell you instead what this device sounds like in my system.

When the VAS guy dropped off this amplifier I was listening to a Diana Krall Album The Look Of Love Verve [314-549-846]. I replaced the PrimaLuna PL 2 I was listening to with the Cayin A-70T. To describe the differences between a good solid-state amplifier and a good tube powered amplifier is hard. To describe the differences between tube amplifiers is an art form that could trip up Shakespeare and Shelley. However I am bound to try, placing the A-70T in my system I could hear more warmth suffuse Diana’s voice. The more powerful ultralinear amplifier lent the supporting bass lines a stronger apparent foundation that projected the sound out into the room. The sound of the A-70T in triode mode might be what the manufacturer refers to as the sound of an older classic American amplifier, but I can’t be sure.

Yes the triode configuration is warmer but the sound is still believable and is very natural. It was not so much like you were hearing the performance but rather more like you were experiencing a pleasant half forgotten memory. Suspending disbelief you are immersed all the more by the emotional content. It’s as if a time machine trespassed space carrying you believing to the event. The most prevalent criticism of tube amplification is that tubes lack speed and this is most apparent on large bass transients.

The majority of the time I preferred to run the amplifier in ultralinear mode this greatly extends the upper and lower range of the amplifier. And to my ears in this operational mode nothing is left, out the full spectrum of the performance is there to enjoy. Since I listen and evaluate mostly by listening to the sound of a human voice using the amplifier in either mode is usually not a problem for me. I do have a recording I use to test and evaluate bass, it is something I’ve used and referred to before. Adagio d’ Albinoni is performed by Gary Karr and Harmon Lewis and is available via the Cisco Music catalog [GCD8003]. It is a large pipe organ accompanying an Amati bass fiddle recorded in a cavernous stone cathedral. This musical selection is invaluable to me because it contains sustained bass frequencies that slowly decay to inaudibility. This test helps me to analyze not just the bass transient speed but far more important the tonal structure of the sound itself. And in that resonant stone Cathedral the wooden Amati seems to summon you with a mournful cry of sorrow. Using the Cayin to drive my ESL 63 speakers full range the timber accuracy is wonderful it allows you to hear the harmonic shading and wooden voiced resonance of the Amati Bass.

The Cayin amplifier gets it right, the sadness the longing the essence of the music is free to tug at your emotions. If this performance does not affect you than I suggest you seek medical attention.

Coda

What is the nature of the beast, what is it all about, in our quest for reality we strive to make the performance come to life. And where in the scheme of things does the Cayin A-70T fit in. Well it’s not at the top of the heap for me the most realistic sounding amplifier that I’ve heard is the $13,000 ART Audio Vivo 300B tube amplifier I reviewed for Enjoy The Music.com®. But the A-70T for $1,995 is not that much farther down the list that is if we judge audio components on a scale that rates the real life quality of their performance. Bottom line the Cayin is a very good sounding well-built amplifier that is easily worth much more than the asking price. Let me digress for a moment, its my impression that the majority of the sound I hear in demo rooms at Hi-Fi shows emphasize speed and razor edge detailing which is the digital forte. I suppose that’s ok if you only stop for a while in these rooms. I do believe you are bound to leave impressed. It is indeed a quick shot in the ear and the prevalent way to marketaudio gear but live music does not sound like that

Let me ask you a question, are you exclusively solid state and only playing CD’s? Are you using your expensive system more now just to provide back round music? Well Bunky I think I can help you. It may be that this phenomenon is a direct result of digital encoding and its subliminal side effects. If all you listen to are compact discs then I have a radical suggestion to make.

Get tubes, put them someplace in your system be it pre or power or maybe even a tube hybrid CD player. Cast off your start stop sound and put a little harmonic continuity back into your life. Audiopals the Cayin A-70T is a very good place to start.

The human brain is an analogue decoder not a digital decoder and deserves to be treated with respect.

For online version please check http://audioamplified.com/Reviews/PDF/A70T_EnjoytheMusic.pdf

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Re: Official Cayin Thread
« Reply #332 on: Jan 22, 2008 at 02:54 PM »
The CD-50T has been a very popular tube cd player.  While we are still waiting for the english review from sterophile and absolute which the US distributor says will be soon... here are some things people in Audiogon say about it:



Cayin CD50-T Anybody audition or own this? 
I see that Cayin has introduced a new tube cd player. Has anybody auditioned or own one of these? What are your thoughts on its construction and sound?

Thanks
Vlad.
Vlad1456  (Threads | Answers)

01-12-07 
 

 
  Responses
01-12-07: Invincible
I have not, but the January edition of "The absoulte sound" has a small review on it along with the 88-T tube amp.
Invincible  (Answers)


01-12-07: [email protected]
I own a cd-50T and heres what I think.

For acoustic music its pretty much unbeatable at the price. For rock music such as Rolling Stones etc - it probably lacks the speed / dynamic punch I like down low (think NAIM).

However, when you hear something like Joni Mitchell or Diana Krall through this player all will be forgiven beleive me.

So for the hard rock fans - I'd probably go elsewhere, and for anyone else I cant think of anything better at the price.

In comparison my opinion is that IT EATS AN aRCAM CD73t, Cambridge 640c, and nad C542 for anything but hard rock which it does at a similar standard.

Conclusion: at the price it has no competition - mind you its not as good as a Mcintosh CD/SACD either (although the build quality is comparable.

cheers
[email protected] 


01-13-07: Vlad1456
Thrusty and Invincible, thanks for your input!

Vlad.
Vlad1456  (Threads | Answers)


01-16-07: Bondmanp
I auditioned one at the Vacuum Tube Valley show last May in NJ. The Cayin distributer A/B'd it with the Cayin SACD (2CH) player, and I thought the CD-50T was noticeably warmer. I was impressed, although I did not listen long enough to give you an informed opinion.
Bondmanp  (System | Reviews | Threads | Answers)


01-18-07: [email protected]
Update: I have tried some NOS 12au7 tubes with my CD-50T.

Phillips Miniwatt 12au7/12au7a 1950's /1960's sound way better than the standard valve - more detail yet not fatiguing - still dont have the solid state slam though.

AWV Super Radiotron 12au7a - OMG this tube absolutely rocks in the cd-50T. Huge soundstage, awesome dynamics, and the level of detail is astounding.

Playing the Stones SACD/Hybrids the cd-50T plays the cd layer better than my Denon 3910 plays the sacd layer - in comparison the Denon sounds "bloated" and confused in the midrange and the treble is veiled.

So if your willing to spend 5mins and $50 rolling tubes the Cayin cd-50t for me now has no competition at the price regardless of muscial tastes / genres.

I listened to a Cambridge C640c and Arcam cdt73 the other day which are around the same price as the Cayin cd-50t give or take $50.

The Cd-50T completely outclasses these two by a country mile. In fact to me the Arcam and Cambridge sounded boring - which is a bit tough too say because if the Cayin didnt exist I'd highly reccomend the Arcam or Cambridge in this price range.

Only my opinion though, I'd still reccomend auditioning any of these players. Although the ability to roll tubes in the Cayin is the icing on the cake for me.

cheers everyone
[email protected] 


01-27-07: [email protected]
Got mine since yesterday - can only confirm Thrusty's enthusiasm re sound (Jazz, Classic) and ease of tube doctoring. AMV unfortunately not easy to get here (Germany), but will try EH. Anyway, a real positive surprise in this price class.

I can also confirm the superior sound of SACDs on the player. Since SACDs hardly come with HDCD but rather ordinary 16bit CD layers, what could be an explanation here?

Cheers,
Achim
[email protected] 
 
 


And oh... of course there are lots of non-english review http://www.audioforum.be/article-print-1524.html in case anybody would like to translate it for us :)

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Re: Official Cayin Thread
« Reply #333 on: Jan 22, 2008 at 03:33 PM »


Nice words about the Cayin CD-23A CD-player from Sterophile.  This same unit was also rated Sterophile Class-B product last year.
 


For the online file please click http://www.vasindustries.com/r.a.asp

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Re: Official Cayin Thread
« Reply #334 on: Jan 22, 2008 at 05:39 PM »
Cayin's Flagship CDT-17A



I am sure that the Cayin CDT-17A CD Player’s sound effect can be compared with the highest grade digital system of more than 10,000 US dollar.

The sound was impressive at once when I first turned on the Cayin CDT-17A CD Player. It sounds like the effect of the unusual treasure Koetsu 80 Pickup which many fans are earnestly long for. The timbre is very pure, natural, relaxed, and tireless. Although I have a Koetsu 80 Pickup which is very expensive (8,000 US dollar ten years ago) and unwonted, I do not always use it for the difficulties to buy new one to change the broken one. Benz micro ruby Ⅲ is always used because of the prices of 3,000 US dollar and the convenience of buying and going back factory to change the new pickups.

Cayin CDT-17A CD Player’s sound effect can not catch the whole music soul of the Koetsu 80 Pickup and even the 80 or 90 percent of it. Whether you know that the price is 26,000 US dollar only including one Koetsu 80 Pickup with air-driven turntable, air-driven arm and full-balance pick-up amplifier (from the arm to the amplifier) which is more than 20 times than the price of the CDT-17A. It is more convenient when we use the CDT-17A without any tension in the hart (in case of the damage of the Pickup), so we always have a relaxed mood when we enjoy the CDT-17A with the felling that what a good sound effect with that par instrument.

We can enjoy the feeling of the Hall Effect using CDT-17A with CAI QIN FOLK SONG, especially the song Follow Me To Say Love Me. We have the feeling that Timbre and consonance are rolling on the both sides of our rooftree which the Lingering musical sound and the feeling can only be compared to some records played with Koetsu Pick-up. As only for Leisureliness and lingering charm, the Cayin CDT-17A CD Player has already attained the word standard without the consideration of the price.

Air and body: Many instruments exhibited in the Hong Kong Hi-Fi show had all given a demonstration using voice, bass and big gun of ZHAO PENG Vol 1. I found that it was not easy to play the songs of ZHAO PENG, especially the song “The Moon Speaks For My Heart”. What is the result of expression using the Cayin CDT-17A CD Player with Altec Ultra A5 MK6? The timbre is full of relaxation, easiness and bounce while two Spanish Guitars give the introduction

Zhao Peng’s voice has a unique attraction and magnetic charm with the ample air sense and the setting off from the bottom of the throat. Zhao Peng has sang the larruping song The Moon Speaks For My Heart with the basic skills full of the feeling of tiredness, idleness and unconcern. Although Deng Lijun has sung the song, the song here has a unique style of the voice, and moreover, the Right-hand Bass cello plays a deep and relaxed bass. As for the air sense and the Body full degree Cayin CDT-17A CD has already attained the world’s best level of separation.

The sound effect of the rubber leg belongs to the kinds of instantaneous slowing and weak analysis, moreover, Cayin CDT-17A CD’s instantaneous change speed, analysis and the live sense fade because the legs’ positions do not matched the center of the gravity, believe? So long as you change the position according to the indication of the drawing, the instantaneous change speed, analysis and the live sense will be improved more than one time, and if the rolling crystal tacks are used for supporting the effect will be improved twice. Frankly Cayin legs have been already much better than other products, and if the low center of gravity is placed CDT-17A CD will Sweep other products away in domestic market.

The arrow 1 showed in the drawing indicates the all-closed Transport system which can stop the interferences of the useless lights, electromagnetic wave and electric wave completely. The arrow 2 indicates the power supply transformer for digital and the arrow 3 indicates the other one for analog. Arrow 3 and 4 show the soul parts of the CDT-17A CD, and the chips are BB DAC PCM1792 (24 bit/192kHz) which are used exclusively for compact disc player in domestic market. Actually each chip is used for only one CD, but one PCM1792 is used to get the all balanced decoding for each sound channels in order to stop the interferences between the two channels. The weak analog signals firstly pass the low pass including six OPA604s OPT AMP so as to obtain the full-balance fastidiously after the D/A conversion course.

Two vacuum tubes EH 6922 are used to do the full-balance amplifying. DC is filtrated through four Wimas 2 mF capacitances and then the alternating current sound signals are transmitted to the Pre-amplifier or amalgamated amplifier. The two amplifications operate independently in order to avoid the interferences between the full-balance and single-ended amplification. The two EH6922 triodes are used to single-ended amplify independently and the following Wimas 2 mF capacitances are used to filtrate the DC of the single ends. The two Realcap 0.4 mF (white) clung to the Wimas are used to filtrate the UHF completely.

When you look at the CDT-17A circuitry carefully you will find out more than sixty Ribbin capacitances with the price of 400 bucks (each one 6 bucks), and May I ask how the manufacturer makes money? I recollect that Mr. Wang in Melody whose job is radar designing while serving in the army have given me several resistances used for radar designing. The sound effect is very good when we weld them to the electronic crossover for a test. I t is impossible to bear the price of such high-quality resistances with the Melody’s price. Actually these were the surplus products of the military more than ten years ago, and military decided to break them and recycle the pure silver and copper for environmental protection. The boss of Melody bought all the surplus goods and used them to their own products. Cayin is affiliated to Aerospace industry and we can speculate that Cayin bought the surplus high-quality resistances used for Aerospace industry to produce Hi-Fi, it just a guess and we try to get the answer till next meet with the important official of Cayin

Conclusion: The Cayin CDT-17A CD has the highest cost performance ratio I have tested in a long long time. Because of the appropriate price it is well worth spending a lot of attention exploiting the potentialities to the high point. I am sure that the Cayin CDT-17A CD Player’s sound can be compared with the highest grade digital systems of more than 10,000 US dollar.

For online version please visit http://finallink.com.au/picts/Cayin%20CDT%20review.pdf

Offline dB10

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Re: Official Cayin Thread
« Reply #335 on: Jan 22, 2008 at 11:07 PM »
Dear Friends,

Cayin has been one of the hottest brands in 2007 garnering numerouse reviews.  Below are some of them for your reading pleasure.


good day,
 
pls pm price for cdt17a and a100t w kt88, thanks
"...be careful & ready what you wish for, it may come true"

Offline AudioAmplified

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Re: Official Cayin Thread
« Reply #336 on: Jan 23, 2008 at 05:19 PM »
thanks for your interest sir.  replied via pm.

Offline qguy

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Re: Official Cayin Thread
« Reply #337 on: Jan 29, 2008 at 08:30 AM »
I read somewhere that Cayin has its roots in germany, is  this true ? can you guys share a little bit of Cayins history - thanks

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Re: Official Cayin Thread
« Reply #338 on: Jan 29, 2008 at 03:58 PM »
Cayin is a German company who has a joint venture with CATIC (China Aeronautics) to make hi-fi audio systems SPARK AUDIO.   Cayin Germany brought in the initial technology and knowledge on music and utilized the production line, quality control and access of parts of CATIC to make good quality audio products. Their partnership has been there for quite a while.  I believe Cayin Germany has joint ownership to the Cayin trademark that is why you see some models only in Cayin and some models for China market labelled as SPARK.

So far the partnership has been very positive as Cayin has grown not only in EU but now in the US. 


Offline odyoboy

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Re: Official Cayin Thread
« Reply #339 on: Jan 30, 2008 at 06:38 PM »
I read a lot of reviews of Cayin amp, its being compare mostly to vintage Marantz amp. Why is Cayin being associated with vintage gear? Like this review from enjoy the music January 2007 With KT88's the Cayin A-70T is said to sound like a McIntosh Mc275 amplifier. If you go directly to the manufacturers site you can find a statement that the A-70T equipped with EL34 tubes sounds like a Classic Marantz 8 B amplifier. Can you enlighten mr? I'm shopping for an integrated and interested with a70t model.   thanks


 

Offline qguy

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Re: Official Cayin Thread
« Reply #340 on: Jan 31, 2008 at 06:18 AM »
When Ferrari salesman says their car is Fast, you know its fast ...

When an unknown hi performance car says their car is fast, you would ask, how fast  ? ..Like a ferrari .. it gives you an idea how fast it is based on a benchmark

In the Cayin case, the benchmark are those collectible amps from Marantz and McIntosh.

I use an A70T myself and previously had a Dynaco St70 series II and a Scott 299D, I would describe the A70-t as a Scott 299d on steroids. 



Offline JoeyGS

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Re: Official Cayin Thread
« Reply #341 on: Jan 31, 2008 at 09:08 AM »
Likewise my A-50T is a classic tube Marantz 8B or Dynaco Class B tube design which I am now quite happy with.  :)

Offline AudioAmplified

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Re: Official Cayin Thread
« Reply #342 on: Jan 31, 2008 at 11:31 AM »
Thanks for the very proper explanation qguy.  I actually dont even know how to describe it better than what you did.

Since audio is very difficult to get into words (that is why we always encourage our customers to read the reviews but more importantly AUDITION) using these known amps as benchmarks is the best way to communicate the "cayin expirience" since these vintage amps are well respected and known.  This allows for a apples to apples analogy. 

Cayin is like these vintage amps in steriods.  With newer technology; Cayin built their philisophy around these "collectors" amps by improving some aspects while keeping the soul that made these vintage amps well loved through the ages.  The MC275 is still being produced up to this date (i think its their anniversary edition) and is still considered one of the best ever power amplifier from McIntosh.  Of course it will cost several times more than the a-70t.  Sadly Marantz 8 is out of production for a long long time, yet people still cherish this amp... for those who cant find a vintage then at least we know there is the Cayin A-50T at an affordable price as sir JoeyGS mentioned and enjoys.

Thanks sirs for your positive feedback on Cayin. 

 


Offline odyoboy

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Re: Official Cayin Thread
« Reply #343 on: Jan 31, 2008 at 03:41 PM »
Thanks for the input guys. Since you have mentioned it, Where can I audition? I want to compare a70t and a50t, maybe the a100t if budget permits.
By the way I saw a different version of 70t, sa70t I've read its 30watts/channel, auto bias. Its also has a swicth for EL34 group and KT88 group of tubes. What does it mean? Sorry i'm just a newbie.Any inputs Cayin owners? ...thanks

Offline qguy

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Re: Official Cayin Thread
« Reply #344 on: Feb 01, 2008 at 11:52 AM »
There are two versions of the A-70T

The 30 watts version
Runs in Class Class A
Switch for El34 or 6550 familes of tubes (el34, 6Ca7,6L6, Kt88, 6550, Kt90)
Auto bias, no need to bias when changing tubes

The 55 watt version
Runs in Class AB
Can use only kt88 or 6550 or its equivalent, I dont think you can  use EL34 types
Bias is manually done everytime you changed tube - think of it as alingment of your tires  ;D

Thanks for the input guys. Since you have mentioned it, Where can I audition? I want to compare a70t and a50t, maybe the a100t if budget permits.
By the way I saw a different version of 70t, sa70t I've read its 30watts/channel, auto bias. Its also has a swicth for EL34 group and KT88 group of tubes. What does it mean? Sorry i'm just a newbie.Any inputs Cayin owners? ...thanks
« Last Edit: Feb 01, 2008 at 11:55 AM by qguy »

Offline AudioAmplified

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Re: Official Cayin Thread
« Reply #345 on: Feb 01, 2008 at 06:13 PM »
A-100T is a monster giving 100 watts per channel.  This is Cayin's most powerful integrated and can be used effectively on difficult to drive speakers such as dyns, thiel or sonus.  The A-100T is also Cayin's newest integrated amp.  It comes with a guage so that you can bias easily without the need of a tester.

Beautiful design, power all rolled into one.

Offline Le_Stat

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Re: Official Cayin Thread
« Reply #346 on: Feb 02, 2008 at 06:43 PM »
pag balik ko ng pinas, i'l pick up na my amp na naka Turbo, pati cables na ginto.  ;D 

Tika? Hangji !  ;)

« Last Edit: Feb 02, 2008 at 06:48 PM by Le_Stat »
Only tax payer's should vote !

Offline karce

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Re: Official Cayin Thread
« Reply #347 on: Feb 03, 2008 at 11:29 AM »
anong amp yung kinuha mo sir

Offline Adam Warlock

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Re: Official Cayin Thread
« Reply #348 on: Feb 07, 2008 at 04:51 PM »
Any clue?
Is it a monoblock?  ;D

Offline qguy

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Re: Official Cayin Thread
« Reply #349 on: Feb 08, 2008 at 06:19 AM »
clue.. anything larger than a A-70T  ;D

Any clue?
Is it a monoblock?  ;D

Offline muypogi

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Re: Official Cayin Thread
« Reply #350 on: Feb 13, 2008 at 10:18 PM »
Pa PM naman ng price ng Cayin integrateds and the NAD preamp and amp lines please. . . :-)

Offline XXXyzledge

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Re: Official Cayin Thread
« Reply #351 on: Feb 15, 2008 at 09:52 AM »
hi!

just want to solicit ur opinion on my plan....

my current setup :
 dvdp ---> mf x10d ----> harman avr 235 (analog in)

i was thinking 1st of looking for a DAC (mf x-dac or mf 24k)
to be inserted in between the dvdp & x10d....

however, my plan changed....
instead of buying just a DAC, im planning to get a
dedicated CDP with a built in DAC....

with this, im considering to acquire a Cayin CD-50T....

-im curious on how the cayin cdp would blend with my
tube buffer.....

your comments would be highly appreciated....

thanks in advanced!
 
Cayin, RS1, Velo, QED, Bada         Sony4K, HK, B&W, SVS, Oppo, LaZboy....

Offline AudioAmplified

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Re: Official Cayin Thread
« Reply #352 on: Feb 15, 2008 at 02:05 PM »
replied via pm sir

Offline Adam Warlock

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Re: Official Cayin Thread
« Reply #353 on: Feb 15, 2008 at 05:46 PM »
pag balik ko ng pinas, i'l pick up na my amp na naka Turbo, pati cables na ginto.  ;D 

Tika? Hangji !  ;)



Here's a clue:

Its a monoblock
Cabling are made of gold alloy
Premium caps

Would you like to know more?  ::) hehehe

Offline AudioAmplified

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Re: Official Cayin Thread
« Reply #354 on: Feb 15, 2008 at 07:40 PM »
its heavy.  its tuuubey hahaha

Offline ǝʞɐɾ ʎzzɐɾ

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Re: Official Cayin Thread
« Reply #355 on: Feb 15, 2008 at 09:46 PM »
hi!

just want to solicit ur opinion on my plan....

my current setup :
 dvdp ---> mf x10d ----> harman avr 235 (analog in)

i was thinking 1st of looking for a DAC (mf x-dac or mf 24k)
to be inserted in between the dvdp & x10d....

however, my plan changed....
instead of buying just a DAC, im planning to get a
dedicated CDP with a built in DAC....

with this, im considering to acquire a Cayin CD-50T....

-im curious on how the cayin cdp would blend with my
tube buffer.....

your comments would be highly appreciated....

thanks in advanced!
 

uuuuyyyyy pasimple ang SARS!

jim, imho -

better simple set up - cd50t > a55t > celestion sl6si  ;D
« Last Edit: Feb 15, 2008 at 09:48 PM by Jazzy Jake »
˙ ˙ ˙ ɯɐp - ıp - ɯɐp - ıp - ɯɐp

Offline XXXyzledge

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Re: Official Cayin Thread
« Reply #356 on: Feb 16, 2008 at 09:04 AM »
tsk!
nasa inquiry & review & saving-up stage pa lang ako!

layuan mo ko jake!
ayaw ko mahawa ng serious case ng SARS mo!!! ;D ;D ;D
Cayin, RS1, Velo, QED, Bada         Sony4K, HK, B&W, SVS, Oppo, LaZboy....

Offline cybermms

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Re: Official Cayin Thread
« Reply #357 on: Feb 16, 2008 at 09:12 AM »
tsk!
nasa inquiry & review & saving-up stage pa lang ako!

layuan mo ko jake!
ayaw ko mahawa ng serious case ng SARS mo!!! ;D ;D ;D

I have units (Cayin A50 + CDT50) allocated for you sir Jim, as recommended by Jake - 6 months deferred 0% interest - best cure for SARS!! ha! ha!

cyber

Offline ǝʞɐɾ ʎzzɐɾ

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Re: Official Cayin Thread
« Reply #358 on: Feb 16, 2008 at 09:41 AM »
ayan na!  ayan na!   cayin cdp > cayin tube integrated > celestion SL6Si   here we come!  told you jim, ang layuan mo yang isang hobby mo na puro putok.  di maganda tunog niyan.   hahaha!

ahem 6 mos zero interest?  wow!  how can you go wrong with this offer for the cayin cdp?!

jim, bibili na ako ng red wine -  the best while listening to diana krall and pareng frank with the cayins!
˙ ˙ ˙ ɯɐp - ıp - ɯɐp - ıp - ɯɐp

Offline XXXyzledge

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Re: Official Cayin Thread
« Reply #359 on: Feb 16, 2008 at 10:12 AM »
I have units (Cayin A50 + CDT50) allocated for you sir Jim, as recommended by Jake - 6 months deferred 0% interest - best cure for SARS!! ha! ha!

cyber

ayan na!!! patay tayo dyan!!! hahahahaha!!!!
really? 6 months? ayan na!!! lapit na kumagat!!! ;D ;D ;D
Cayin, RS1, Velo, QED, Bada         Sony4K, HK, B&W, SVS, Oppo, LaZboy....