Topic: Do I even need a HDMI ready-DVD player if i use my PC as HTPC? (edited title)

[kyleryner]

Hi all,

Planning to buy an LCD TV within the week or so.. 32" only..

So many offers and promos out there..

2 offers is basically around the same price..

Samsung B350 for 27,900 with FREE HTS..5.1 speaker system but only regular DVD player

vs

LG 32LH20 for 26,900 with FREE Pioneer HD DVD player w/ HDMI cable (no 5.1 speaker system)

Im tempted to get the Samsung so i can have a nice 5.1 sound system over my present stereo one.
but im wondering if a Pioneer HD player with the HDMI cable wouldnt be a lost opportunity for a freebie..
(then there are other offers like SHARP and Devant who have their own freebie players/ HTS)

Thing is, i dont have true HD dvds.. mostly regular DVDs and avi files and the occasional MKV files..

I already own several DVD players and play regular DVDs on them and USB flashdrives.

I plan to connect my PC thru HDMI with the LCD TV 6-8 feet away probably using a long CHEAP HDMI cable.
With that setup, I can now play MKV files from my PC.

so the question is.. do i even need that HD-DVD player? Granted, I realize the HDMI cable it comes with would be better than the china-made cable i plan to buy, but i doubt it's length will reach my PC (unless I bring my PC closer).  

Will that Pioneer HD DVD with original (presumably) HDMI cable play DVDs and USB files BETTER than my PC (with an HD capable VC btw) ever could? Would the cheap (CDRKing) and longer cable degrade the output sigificantly or would it remain the same?

If the answer is no, its not gonna make a big difference either way, then I dont see a reason to get the HD player and will opt for the regular DVD instead with free 5.1 sound system...

Unless of course you masters have different advice?

thanks....

 

[Clondalkin]

Please clarify what a Pioneer HD DVD player is.  The Toshiba patented HD DVD??

[ditoy_eagle]

I haven't seen any Pioneer HD-DVD players locally, and to be sold as a bundle nowadays mukhang malabo yan. Better clarify the models.  Malamang, the Pioneer mentioned here is a standard DVD player

[tein]

Use the pc nalang as your player sir both dvd and bluray, then get the right player plus codecs sir then your good to go in playing your movies from your pc, sa audio out if your pc has optical or coaxial out use that to bypass the sound from pc para yun receiver mo mag decode ng DTS or DOLBY audio. peace 

[kyleryner]

@ all,

thanks for the replies and advice guys...

Re: what type of DVD player i mentioned in..

LG 32LH20 for 26,900 with FREE Pioneer HD DVD player w/ HDMI cable (no 5.1 speaker system)

actually, its not a packaged solution.. SM Appliance offers the above LG model with a 5,000 pesos cash rebate that you need to buy from their store.. and so the salesman offered me "Pioneer" DVD player HDMI na daw with HDMI cable. I saw it, its pioneer (silver finish) but I did not jot down the model no. It retails for 4,500 (so I have 500 pesos left over pa) There is a regular non-hd player Pioneer brand also for 3,xxx also. Ive seen them in  at least 2 SM appliance stores (Harisson Plaza and SM Makati)

So I confirm it is indeed an HD player. 

Still same question though.. do i really need one if i can use my PC as a HTPC ..
for playing MKVs and other avi codecs not recognized by stand-alone players, a PC is a must anyway (short of buying a media player)

But what if use the PC DVD drive to play regular DVDs.. will my PC "upscale" the signal via HDMI as good as what an HD player can (or so the salemen claim)?


@ tein

     - use my PC as dvd and BLURAY? how do i do that?    or did you mean mkv files? is that considered bluray na ba?  (newbie here, remember) 

     - get the right player .. you mean software?  I use VLC player.. people say its the best with all the necessary codecs built in already. What would you recommend?

      - Audio out, my PC only have the standard mobo-built in line out. (although the spec/systray has a fancy utility called IDT Audio) .  My Video card has HDMI with 5.1 one though. Wouldnt that be better?
VC specs says:

 

Built in HDMI with 5.1 surround sound.
  built in hdmi with HD audio support for single HDTV connectivity. This unique feature is enabled with an intelligent DVI to HDMI adapter, no internal SPDIF or other audio cabling is required.

  whoa. I just realized JUST NOW what it means... i dont have a HDMI port after all.. i still need to get a DVI-HDMI adapter... dammit. Hope it doesnt cost much...

[Philander]

LG 32LH20 for 26,900 with FREE Pioneer HD DVD player w/ HDMI cable (no 5.1 speaker system)

I think you are referring to a Pioner DVD Player that has HDMI and supports upscaling of a DVD to 1080p resolution.

Pioneer did not release any HD DVD player.

Im tempted to get the Samsung so i can have a nice 5.1 sound system over my present stereo one.
but im wondering if a Pioneer HD player with the HDMI cable wouldnt be a lost opportunity for a freebie..
(then there are other offers like SHARP and Devant who have their own freebie players/ HTS)

It's your choice, maximize the audio (getting the 5.1 HTIB but no upscaling and watch upto 480p resolution only) or Maximize the video and watch upscaled DVD upto 1080p but with Stereo mode only. If it were me, I would choose the latter and will just invest for a good HT system or HTIB.


Can you answer this? Is the HTIB free from Samsung has digital optical or coaxial input? If so,  then get this and just buy a decent DVD upscaler for less than 6K (some brand goes as low as 2.5K). THis would be better since HTIB is more expensive that the DVD player. Also if you can connect your PC (with SPDIF out) to the free HTIB, then you can maximize your display and audio as well.

Thing is, i dont have true HD dvds.. mostly regular DVDs and avi files and the occasional MKV files..

I already own several DVD players and play regular DVDs on them and USB flashdrives.

I said earlier HD DVD is out of the question.

I plan to connect my PC thru HDMI with the LCD TV 6-8 feet away probably using a long CHEAP HDMI cable.
With that setup, I can now play MKV files from my PC.

so the question is.. do i even need that HD-DVD player? Granted, I realize the HDMI cable it comes with would be better than the china-made cable i plan to buy, but i doubt it's length will reach my PC (unless I bring my PC closer). 

You will only need HD DVD player or a HD DVD ROM drive if you have HD DVD media to maximize it, otherwise it will just serve as DVD upscaling player. Again dont be confused with the diff formats.

The pioneer you are referring is a DVD Player (only) but it supports 1080p upscaling through HDMI.

Will that Pioneer HD DVD with original (presumably) HDMI cable play DVDs and USB files BETTER than my PC (with an HD capable VC btw) ever could? Would the cheap (CDRKing) and longer cable degrade the output sigificantly or would it remain the same?

THis we can't tell, as your PC has diff video chipset used compared to the Pioneer video chipset. Usually a decent HD VC outperforms chipset of DVD player.

Also, in HTPC, you ouput the video to LCD using your defined the screen resolution. To output 1080P, you will need additional software.

 
If the answer is no, its not gonna make a big difference either way, then I dont see a reason to get the HD player and will opt for the regular DVD instead with free 5.1 sound system...

Unless of course you masters have different advice?

thanks....

YOu may need upscaler player for convenience since you dont need to boot up a PC to play DVD. And again, if you use your VC, you are outputting the video as the screen resolution, to output 1080P, you will need additional software.



There are many other things going on with your questions, I may not be able to explain them all. What you need is to check the capability of your LCD, your HTIB, the DVD player, your PC etc. With that, you will be able to maximize them.

To summarize, if the free HTIB has optical/coaxial input, I'll get the HTIB, otherwise I will choose the Pioneer DVD player that supports DVD 1080P upscaling. Also check your PC if it has SPDIF out so you can use the HTIB for your 5.1 audio. If the PC do not have spdif out and obviously the free HTIB does not have 5.1 analog input, then basically the output will still be stereo, you can use Prologic to phantom 5.1 sound.

Or to solve your dilemma, ask the LCD vendor on how much you will add if your are going to opt for a 5.1 HTIB that has DVD upscaling capabilities upto 1080p.

I hope I didnt cause you more confustion

[Philander]

actually, its not a packaged solution.. SM Appliance offers the above LG model with a 5,000 pesos cash rebate that you need to buy from their store.. and so the salesman offered me "Pioneer" DVD player HDMI na daw with HDMI cable. I saw it, its pioneer (silver finish) but I did not jot down the model no. It retails for 4,500 (so I have 500 pesos left over pa) There is a regular non-hd player Pioneer brand also for 3,xxx also. Ive seen them in  at least 2 SM appliance stores (Harisson Plaza and SM Makati)

So I confirm it is indeed an HD player.  

Mind you, ITS NOT.

Still same question though.. do i really need one if i can use my PC as a HTPC ..
for playing MKVs and other avi codecs not recognized by stand-alone players, a PC is a must anyway (short of buying a media player)

But what if use the PC DVD drive to play regular DVDs.. will my PC "upscale" the signal via HDMI as good as what an HD player can (or so the salemen claim)?

I answered this already above. And to give you an idea, if you use the PC as your player and your source is HD, yes the quality will be HD (though display resolution vs video resolution will play a role here, for now ignore this). AGain, if your source is HD, then you will be eventually viewed this as HD.

@ tein

     - use my PC as dvd and BLURAY? how do i do that?    or did you mean mkv files? is that considered bluray na ba?  (newbie here, remember)  

Forget BLuray for now, lets discuss MKV alone... unless you have BD media and BD ROM.

    - get the right player .. you mean software?  I use VLC player.. people say its the best with all the necessary codecs built in already. What would you recommend?

XMBC or VLC would do the job.

     - Audio out, my PC only have the standard mobo-built in line out. (although the spec/systray has a fancy utility called IDT Audio) .  My Video card has HDMI with 5.1 one though. Wouldnt that be better?
VC specs says:

If your VC has HDMI, then use this connection to the LCD. Still it will output 2ch since the LCD that you are going to buy can only decode 2 ch LPCM audio (sometime 2 ch DD audio, but still 2 ch). YOu cannot maximize the 5.1

To have 5.1 audio from PC, you have many ways.

Get a AVR that has HDMI in and can decode audio from HDMI (very expensive)
Get AVR with 5.1 analog input IF AND ONLY IF your PC has 5.1 analog output.
GEt another SC that has SPDIF out and you can USE ANY HTIB or AVR that has optical/coaxial input.

 
  whoa. I just realized JUST NOW what it means... i dont have a HDMI port after all.. i still need to get a DVI-HDMI adapter... dammit. Hope it doesnt cost much...

Hahhha I answered your previous question without reading this one.... anyway...

You can use DVI-HDMI (not that expensive) but VGA would suffice for now.

[kyleryner]

@Philander,

   WOW.  That was an EXCELLENT and VERY thorough reply.. thanks for taking the time and thought to answer my many pesky questions..    much appreciated.

   Your post didnt confuse me at all, and i learned quite a lot. thanks so much...

   EDIT: And I just noticed you added even MORE helpful comments after I finished typing this..so i added a few more comments  

  

You will only need HD DVD player or a HD DVD ROM drive if you have HD DVD media to maximize it, otherwise it will just serve as DVD upscaling player. Again dont be confused with the diff formats.

The pioneer you are referring is a DVD Player (only) but it supports 1080p upscaling through HDMI.

  duuuhhh...      this was the problem. I confused "HD" with HDMI capable player, since people keep saying it upscales dvds to "better" quality, and so i equated it as being "Hi-Def" or the HD part of HDMI.... duuuuh.. my apologies for the confusion..  newbie mistake..  As of last month I know almost zero knowledge about LCD TVs, 1080ps, HDMI, contrast ratio etc, and ive been reading up on them the past weeks..  

 
  I think you are right, the HTS or HTIB deal seems better.

This is the freebie from the Samsung model:

    HT Z120 model:
   http://www.jbhifionline.com.au/home-theatre/home-theatre-system/samsung-htz120-dvd-home-theatre-system/436307

   not sure if it has digital or coaxial inputs..will check them again tom, but I think Im sold on this already. You are right, i can buy a cheaper HDMI (not HD!! lol! ) DVD player if i want to upscale.. or for now, as you and others have pointed out, I can use my PC as a HTPC.   Retailcost of the HTIB is 10,000+, even the above link converted from AUD shows approx the same price. So I guess it is a good deal...

Usually a decent HD VC outperforms chipset of DVD player.

Glad to hear it. My Vc is ATI HD3650 and it boasts it has HD technology.

YOu may need upscaler player for convenience since you dont need to boot up a PC to play DVD. And again, if you use your VC, you are outputting the video as the screen resolution, to output 1080P, you will need additional software.

   Its no hassle booting up my PC since its on practically 24/7 anyway  , and is 6-8 feet away from my TV cabinet... getting long cables and organizing them to be unobtrusive would be the trickier part.. or just lay them on the floor.. who cares as long as i get clear picture and sound... LOL  

   Philander, what do you mean outputting to 1080p need additional software? what software? As for the screen res, the ATI Catalyst Control Center says I can change up to 1600x1200. (not sure if this is what you mean). In any case playing at 720 is fine by me I guess...

If your VC has HDMI, then use this connection to the LCD. Still it will outpur 2.1 since the LCD that you are going to buy can only decode 2 ch LPCM audio (sometime 2 ch DD audio, but still 2 ch). YOu cannot maximize the 5.1

To have 5.1 audio from PC, you have many ways.

Get a AVR that has HDMI in and can decode audio from HDMI (very expensive)
Get AVR with 5.1 analog input IF AND ONLY IF your PC has 5.1 analog output.
GEt another SC that has SPDIF out and you can USE ANY HTIB or AVR that has optical/coaxial input.

So even if the VC claims it's HDMI can output 5.1, the LCD TV will only interpret it as 2 CH? so thats why the HTS or HTIB  inputs is essential to getting true 5.1 sound?  I think im beginning to understand...

I think the cheapest solution would be to get a SC with SPDIF.. (hopefully its not expensive)

btw, my bew mobo (aside from my vc) also boasts it has HD-6CH (well the box says so anyway) but it only has the standard mic-line-out-line-in inputs. I think my old mobo had a Spdif but i never even knew what it was for. Darnit.


Well that's all for now.. thanks again so much for the responses, theyve really been helpful.

Oh by the way, the irony isnt lost on me that ive been obsessing on the "freebies" HTS vs HDMI player and not even considering the ACTUAL LCD TV SPECS...LOL!!   Well it is Samsung vs LG after all, so i guess theyre more or less the same level. My eyes sure cant tell much difference.  I guess im just a sucker for getting good "deals"  

Cheers!

 

[kyleryner]

just to add..

found the specs for the Samsung HTZ120 on the Samsung.com.ph site...

CONNECTIVITY

Anynet+    No
HDMI-CEC    No
Wireless-Ready    No
Wireless Module included    No
USB Host    Yes
HDMI Out    No
SCART Out    No
Audio Inputs    1
Optical Inputs    0
Coaxial Inputs    0
Headphone Jack    0
Mic Jack    No


So I guess the answer is no.. it doesnt have optical or coaxial inputs... (it is a freebie after all..) 

[Waxx]

welcome pala to pdvd sir...

im here in your thread once again.. and i agree with most of what other respected members have told you...


as for answering your subject... ill get the htib... you can use your pc to play your dvd and upconvert it the same way that pioneer can (if not better)....

and i believe you are going into the path of htpc... and im sure there are members who can help you with that as well... (i beg for forgiveness if i cant help you with this, for i dont have a HTPC)...

dvi-d to hdmi adaptors are cheap (200-400pesos)... dvi-d to vga is even cheaper...

and most of your questions (re vga cable length.. ) i've answered in the mkv thread... so hope it helps..

and good luck and welcome to the best and friendliest site in the planet.. pinoydvd..

PS. hope you have a deep pocket.... coz pretty soon, youll learn of the diseases called SARS, KULAM, and such...

[kyleryner]

and good luck and welcome to the best and friendliest site in the planet.. pinoydvd..

PS. hope you have a deep pocket.... coz pretty soon, youll learn of the diseases called SARS, KULAM, and such...

@ waxx,

  Hello again   and thanks for the welcome.

  I totally agree.. this is the best and friendliest site!  Ive been getting Super-Excellent tips and advice from you, Philander and others.. Not just simple one-liner advice, but very thorough ones that took time and effort talaga. Really appreciate it!  Ive been to pinoydvd years ago (unless i confuse this current one with a diff site, basta alam ko pinoydvd din. But either i forgot my login name or i got purged for inactivity siguro)  Back then  i asked and discussed what DVD player to buy.. bagong uso pa lang dati yung mga divx players.. hehe..

 And NO, I DONT HAVE A DEEP POCKET.. hehe... naka-ka inferiority complex nga when i read posts discussing hi end systems, series 6 TVs, 60 in Plasma TV and all those other EXPENSIVE and drool-causing gadgets many people have..  E Monster cable lang nga cost more than 10k..

 I almost felt shy nga and out of my league asking for advice for budget friendly setup but responses have been friendly, warm and helpful.    

 Notice all my posts/queries related to if and how i can have HD/Bluray level quality using my existing PC.. bec if you asked me few months ago i didnt think it would have been possible. I havent even heard of mkvs until recently... hanggang divx and xvid lang ako before... lol...

 Imagine, all i wanted was to finally buy an LCD TV (32 inch lang) bec Ive been noticing shops have been offering promos left and right. Thought Id give myself an early Xmas Present  .  All I wanted was an LCD TV, then these promos started offering free HDMI players..(ano yun? Google....) and HTS (ano yun? Google...)  What the heck is 1080p, contarst ratio, etc... (google.. google...) Till i found posts in pinoydvd and also in Tipidpc..  then i began to realize suddenly, it might be possible to have Bluray quality playback if i use my PC.. so its an unexpected Bonus...hehe

 SARS? KULAM? Do I even want to browse/google for that? You warned me I will need deep pockets.. lol..

 Thanks again everyone.. ill be around more regularly this time, (even if just to lurk..) hehe

[Alfie]

per my experience, you don't need to connect your HTPC via HDMI, the VGA is more reliable and has the same sharpness and color saturation.

I used to connect my HTPC via HDMI on my 42" LGFr60..however, since these panels respond differentl;y to the HDMI audio, there are times that the audio cannot be detected by the panel, thus, you'll have to check out the device manager and if the driver was not recognized re-install it.

I got tired of all that hence, I shifted back to the VGA connection and just set the video card to the default of my panel w/c is 1920X1080....now with HDMI and DVI(BTW..this is what I favor, however, the major brands still utilizes VGA as connectors to the PC, possibly due to laptop connectivity), it sets itself automatically.

For more than 3 meters actually, the recommended connection is via VGA.(much cheaper, less hassle, and sturdy) 

Anyway, enjoy.

[Clondalkin]

Just to add, many people (myself included) consider the PC (with good video card) as the original upscaling DVD player.  I was able to convince the wife to buy a stand-alone DVD player in 1998 (it was very expensive then) when I showed her 6 Days 7 Nights DVD playback through a PC connected to a high quality CRT monitor past 12 midnight (I was too mesmerized by the IQ to wait for the following day).     And it was rather disappointing to find out eventually that early gen DVD players could not produce the same IQ as that of the PC.

Dont buy an HTIB that doesnt have digital audio input (optical or coax).

Im surprised why your ATI CCC limits the resolution to only 1600x1200 - but probably because you are looking at VGA settings only or, your monitor limits the available resolution?  If you can connect via component video (you'd need that TV-Out to Component Video dongle that comes with many boxed ATI VCs), or HDMI, CCC allows resolutions that are even higher than 1080p.  Im positive about that because I can force my HD-CRT above 1080p resolutions but I would have to be scrolling through pages because anything higher than 720p wont fit in a single screen.  Anyways the video engine of ATI graphics cards is arguably the best in terms of IQ.

What's your LCD brand? I can somehow relate with Alfie's experience because I also have an LG LCD.  I cant recall the highest resolution setting via VGA of my LG, but regular computing was certainly more pleasing to the eyes through VGA connection.   However, in the case of my 32LG50, many manual image tweaks are only available when connected via HDMI, hence my wife decided to keep the HDMI connection set at 1080p, while regular computing is done on the primary 19 inch LCD monitor.

However, do note that Samsung, Sony and Sharp LCD HDTvs (the full HD models) are known to have excellent implementation of 1:1 Pixel mapping via HDMI (please read about this) that allows very crisp and clear texts which is desirable for regular computing.  

[kyleryner]

per my experience, you don't need to connect your HTPC via HDMI, the VGA is more reliable and has the same sharpness and color saturation.
 
For more than 3 meters actually, the recommended connection is via VGA.(much cheaper, less hassle, and sturdy) 

Anyway, enjoy.

 I'm just hearing this last 2 days from many folks here with surprise that the old VGA connection is
actually better than the other inputs. I would have thought these newer technologies like HDMI would be better but apparently it isnt 

 Thanks for the tip especially if longer than 3 mtrs the recommended connection would be VGA.. (only problem i see is the thicker cable would make it harder to conceal.. unless i get really long one and route it behind cabinets instead of the more direct line-of-sight connection)

  and I Will (Enjoy) 

[Waxx]

its not really that thick.... around 1.5x more of a standard hdmi cable...

and to shed light into your newer technology input thingie..

based on my post on the mkv thread.. hdmi was not really developed for the computing sector.. it was developed for the consumer electronics sector... the only advantage that hdmi has is that it can transmit sound.. hence the name (high definition multimedia interface)..

but if you will be looking at the computing sector... vga is still better than hdmi... eversince pre hi def days.. the pc has high def support already... beyond 1920x1080 and higher...  and it gave birth the next generation of pc display cables namely... the dvi (digital video interface)...

hdmi was just included in this generation's videocards cause of the high marketability to cross integrate it with consumer electronics... such as.. 1.  use your lcd as a monitor... 2. HTPC...

if you notice.. the reason why monitors are much more expensive than lcd tv.. is due to the higher resolution capability of monitors... beyond 24 in and above, 1600x1200 is just the norm.. and it could go higher...  but as for lcd, its peaked at 1080p (1920x1080)... add that to the scale of production.. so what we have is cheaper lcd tv vs lcd monitor...

i just connected my mac mini to my lcd tv last weekend... and i was actually surprised coz the vga cable displayed a much more better resolution than the hdmi cable... here is what i did...

1.  macmini > dvi-d to hdmi adaptor > hdmi > samsung lcd tv (a650) = resolution was a bit off...

2. macmini > dvi -d to vga adaptor > vga > samsung lcd tv = perfrect!!!

ill post screenshots when i get back home this weekend...

nakakatuwa mag surf sa big tv e.. its like.... WHOA factor!.. my little nieces and nephews would love it...

[kyleryner]

Just to add, many people (myself included) consider the PC (with good video card) as the original upscaling DVD player.  I was able to convince the wife to buy a stand-alone DVD player in 1998 (it was very expensive then) when I showed her 6 Days 7 Nights DVD playback through a PC connected to a high quality CRT monitor past 12 midnight (I was too memerized by the IQ to wait for the following day).     And it was rather disappointing to find out eventually that early gen DVD players could not produce the same IQ as that of the PC.

More endorsement for the VGA connection    (Im surprised sales people i asked dont endore it)

silly newbie question.. what does IQ stand for? (i dont think it's for Intelligent Quotient.. lol)

Dont buy an HTIB that doesnt have digital audio input (optical or coax).

   Awwww...    And here i was all set to get that Samsung HTZ120. Keep in mind its only a "freebie" or more accurately, packaged at a big disc. Thats why i got tempted and was choosing between that package (includes a standard dvd player)  or a package with HDMI DVD player.

  Without digital and coaxial inputs, i couldnt maxmize the 5.1?  Maybe thats why theyre practically giving them away with the LCD TV.

Im surprised why your ATI CCC limits the resolution to only 1600x1200 - but probably because you are looking at VGA settings only or, your monitor limits the available resolution?  If you can connect via component video (you'd need that TV-Out to Component Video dongle that comes with many boxed ATI VCs), or HDMI, CCC allows resolutions that are even higher than 1080p.  Im positive about that because I can force my HD-CRT above 1080p resolutions but I would have to be scrolling through pages because anything higher than 720p wont fit in a single screen.  Anyways the video engine of ATI graphics cards is arguably the best in terms of IQ.

Right now im using my standard lcd 15" monitor. (Just got the new mobo and VC few weeks ago to replace the ones that got FLOODED by Ondoy)

The VC outputs to VGA, DVI and S-Video. Is the S-video=component video?

It comes with a S-Video to standard Video out (RCA?) dongle, I hooked it up to my regular TUBE TV as a test. Had a hard time switching between LCD Monitor to the TV.. couldnt get it to display at the same time. Have to "Swap" using ATI CCC.  Hard to read  computer text and icons on the TV, but i managed. Played some games and watched somes video on the TV. Its ok, but have streaks on it, not for longterm use definitely. (dont know if its really like that.. i even bought a better video cable) but its just for testing since i plan to get an LCD TV for use.

What's your LCD brand? I can somehow relate with Alfie's experience because I also have an LG LCD.  I cant recall the highest resolution setting via VGA of my LG, but regular computing was certainly more pleasing to the eyes through VGA connection.   However, in the case of my 32LG50, many manual image tweaks are only available when connected via HDMI, hence my wife decided to keep the HDMI connection set at 1080p, while regular computing is done on the primary 19 inch LCD monitor.

I havent bought my LCD YET. All these questions i have will help me decide what to get this week. As i pointed out earlier, ironically, im focusing now on the FREEBIES i can get (HTS vs HDMI DVD player) rather than what brand or features of the actual LCD TV... lol  

But all these advice is helping me.. (like checking if it has DVI inputs as well as VGA/HDMI)

Right now the choices are

Samsung B350 for 27,900 with FREE HTS..5.1 speaker system but only regular DVD player
vs
LG 32LH20 for 26,900 with FREE Pioneer HDMI DVD player w/ HDMI cable (no 5.1 speaker system)

Ill google later how your 32LG50 compares with the LH20 (urs is most likely better by the sound of it)

I also considered/considering Nextbase's 32" DEVANT models (again bec they offer Freebies.. what can i say? Im a sucker for deals! )

However, do note that Samsung, Sony and Sharp LCD HDTvs (the full HD models) are known to have excellent implementation of 1:1 Pixel mapping via HDMI (please read about this) that allows very crisp and clear texts which is desirable for regular computing.

 

are some 32" inch models of the brands you mentioned included in the full HD models? Some claim they are while others say anything lower than 40" couldnt be considered full HD despite the claims (or at least not distinguishable daw)

Anyway, thanks again for all the inputs.. Im learning new stuff every new post  

As I said earlier, all ll I ever wanted was a simple nice LCD TV.. now with all these tips, i am envisioning a bluray quality capable home theater system via my PC,  also a kickass PC gaming console as well as a 32" LCD monitor for occassional PC use (I plan to get a wireless mouse/kb so i can face the TV away from my CPU) All for a very reasonable price... or practically free using present hardware.. just add some extra cables or whatnots...  

Thanks PINOYDVD!!!  
 

[Waxx]

More endorsement for the VGA connection    (Im surprised sales people i asked dont endore it)

silly newbie question.. what does IQ stand for? (i dont think it's for Intelligent Quotient.. lol)



   Awwww...    And here i was all set to get that Samsung HTZ120. Keep in mind its only a "freebie" or more accurately, packaged at a big disc. Thats why i got tempted and was choosing between that package (includes a standard dvd player)  or a package with HDMI DVD player.

  Without digital and coaxial inputs, i couldnt maxmize the 5.1?  Maybe thats why theyre practically giving them away with the LCD TV.


Right now im using my standard lcd 15" monitor. (Just got the new mobo and VC few weeks ago to replace the ones that got FLOODED by Ondoy)

The VC outputs to VGA, DVI and S-Video. Is the S-video=component video?

It comes with a S-Video to standard Video out (RCA?) dongle, I hooked it up to my regular TUBE TV as a test. Had a hard time switching between LCD Monitor to the TV.. couldnt get it to display at the same time. Have to "Swap" using ATI CCC.  Hard to read  computer text and icons on the TV, but i managed. Played some games and watched somes video on the TV. Its ok, but have streaks on it, not for longterm use definitely. (dont know if its really like that.. i even bought a better video cable) but its just for testing since i plan to get an LCD TV for use.


I havent bought my LCD YET. All these questions i have will help me decide what to get this week. As i pointed out earlier, ironically, im focusing now on the FREEBIES i can get (HTS vs HDMI DVD player) rather than what brand or features of the actual LCD TV... lol  

But all these advice is helping me.. (like checking if it has DVI inputs as well as VGA/HDMI)

Right now the choices are

Samsung B350 for 27,900 with FREE HTS..5.1 speaker system but only regular DVD player
vs
LG 32LH20 for 26,900 with FREE Pioneer HDMI DVD player w/ HDMI cable (no 5.1 speaker system)

Ill google later how your 32LG50 compares with the LH20 (urs is most likely better by the sound of it)

I also considered/considering Nextbase's 32" DEVANT models (again bec they offer Freebies.. what can i say? Im a sucker for deals! )
 

are some 32" inch models of the brands you mentioned included in the full HD models? Some claim they are while others say anything lower than 40" couldnt be considered full HD despite the claims (or at least not distinguishable daw)

Anyway, thanks again for all the inputs.. Im learning new stuff every new post  

As I said earlier, all ll I ever wanted was a simple nice LCD TV.. now with all these tips, i am envisioning a bluray quality capable home theater system via my PC,  also a kickass PC gaming console as well as a 32" LCD monitor for occassional PC use (I plan to get a wireless mouse/kb so i can face the TV away from my CPU) All for a very reasonable price... or practically free using present hardware.. just add some extra cables or whatnots...  

Thanks PINOYDVD!!!  
 

IQ = image quality.. medyo natagalan din ako sa pag isip nyan.. bumaba ng ilang puntos ang IQ ko.. (the other IQ) 

usually freebies htib doesnt have inputs e... its designed to enjoy viewing out of the box.. walang input input ng external/additional devices... if you really want a great bang for the buck HTIB.. try the onkyo htib!! very nice!!

S- video is definitely not component video.... component video is better... you will know component when you see the green, blue, red inputs.. (aside from the red/white of the sound input)... and no you dont need special cables for this.. you can use the same rca cable (yellow white red) and plug it in the component input (just make sure you plug it in the correct ports both ways)

tube tv wont really handle pc connectivity.. unless you put the resolution output settings really low.. (sub 480i).. you can try outputting it thru S video at 320x240... baka mag work.. pero di talaga maganda.. (mas maganda pa resolution ng psp and nintendo ds)

just in case... get a better lcd.. bigger is always better.. onga pala.. what's your budget ba? there are great sellers here with better deals than malls.. and there's the local pdvd members with shops in malls who also has great deals... you just have to read the marketplace..

best regards and happy purchasing!

[Clondalkin]

Just to clarify, the ideal HDTV for PC connection is the one with 1:1 pixel mapping through HDMI because that would not only be able to render crisp and clear texts similar to that of regular PC monitors, but it also allows you convenient 1080p connection via HDMI for your high def viewing needs.

Problem is, many HDTV models either do not have this, or have a rather iffy implementation of it (as in the case of my 32LG50).  Hence, many people find VGA connection nicer.  If you will have dual monitor configuration, I would still suggest that you connect the new LCD HDTV via HDMI for video viewing, then use your old LCD as primary monitor for regular computing.  Kayang-kaya ng ATI3650 yan.

That S-Video looking port of the ATI card is actually the HDTV-out.  The ratings far exceed 1080p.  I dont know why you got a composite dongle but anyways, if you can get a component video dongle, you'd certainly be able to output high def resolution through that ATI port.  But then again if your forthcoming LCD has HDMI in, then simplify the connection by using a DVI-HDMI cable, or a DVI-HDMI converter plus HDMI-HDMI cable.  The only reason why I used the HDTV-out to Component Dongle is because I connected one of my PCs to an HD-CRT which has component video input only - the IQ (Image Quality) is absolutely awesome.  Again, simplify your connection as much as you can.  If audio is not reliable through the HDMI, just make the connection through the audio out of your PC - preferably the SPDIF.

The way to have 5.1 surround via analog is to have 5.1 analog output from your PC.  You can possibly buy dedicated soundcard with analog 5.1 output but why would you do that if your PC most likely has built-in SPDIF out?    Therefore, do not buy an HTIB without digital input.  Try to ask for discount in lieu of the HTZ120 - or get it free but sell it to somebody...or get the HDMI DVD player and sell to put up the budget for a better HTIB or a full sized HT system.   The HTIB is of paramount importance because most of the MKVs out there have DTS soundstream, while most mainstream HDTV's have rubbish built-in sound system.  Ikaw rin.  hehehe.

Sorry I dont know the current models number of full HD LCDs available in Manila.

[sardaukar]

Makikiki-tanong lang. Alam ko yung SARS, pero ano yung KULAM? Is it also an acronym for something?

[tein]

ooops sorry for the late reply but they already answered all, regarding the player sa pc, use the clondalkin special  dami tutulong sayo dito sir like ako dati lage din nag tatanong dito 

[kyleryner]

Master Clondalkin,

Just to clarify, the ideal HDTV for PC connection is the one with 1:1 pixel mapping through HDMI because that would not only be able to render crisp and clear texts similar to that of regular PC monitors, but it also allows you convenient 1080p connection via HDMI for your high def viewing needs.

I tried asking sales personnel about 1:1 thing they dont have a clue what im talking about..    I guess I COULD probably bring my laptop w/ cable to test.. but thats prolly overkill already.. lolz





 

That S-Video looking port of the ATI card is actually the HDTV-out.  The ratings far exceed 1080p.  I dont know why you got a composite dongle but anyways, if you can get a component video dongle, you'd certainly be able to output high def resolution through that ATI port.

The thingie that came with the VC is this:

http://www.powercolor.com/images/accessories/s2av_cable.gif

Manufacter's website (Powercolor) calls it the S-Video to AV. (sorry if i got the name/term wrong). I assumed it was s-video bec thats what they called it. Another website also called it the  S-Video to composite lead.  (Btw, website also says the package comes with DVI Dongle but mine doesnt.)

Not that Im expecting/hoping to get a clear pic out of that S-video/ HDTV-out to my regular TV since as you said, Im gonna be getting an LCD soon anyway... but out of sheer curiosity, since you mentioned it can output high def res thru that port, why is it my attempts didnt get a clear pic? I used the above attachment to get pic in my TV but there are mild streaks/"scanning" things, like watching TV with antennae only and not clear signal.  Managed to watch thru an entire movie though. (just to see if i can)


 

 If audio is not reliable through the HDMI, just make the connection through the audio out of your PC - preferably the SPDIF.

The way to have 5.1 surround via analog is to have 5.1 analog output from your PC.  You can possibly buy dedicated soundcard with analog 5.1 output but why would you do that if your PC most likely has built-in SPDIF out?  

My audio out from my bnew mobo (740GM) at first glance, dont have SPDIF..  just the standard 3 ports..line in,line-out, mic.  But then I checked the manufacturer's website (ECS) and saw in their specs under "Internal I/O Connectors and Headers"   it has 1 x SPDIF out header so hopefully that means I DO in fact have SPDIF after all.. will just have to figure out how to access it when needed.. (its not even mentioned in the manual!) But in case it doesnt, i guess i could always get a SC with the SPDIF port...

Also, the mobo specs says Sound is

    

* Compliant with HD audio specification
    * IDT 92HD202 6-channel audio ( CO-lay 92HD206)

6 Channel High Definition Audio
Integrated 6-channel HD Audio CODEC delivering advanced multi-channel audio and bringing you the experience of home theater-quality sound.

First, I dont know what all that means.. LOL..

Second, I dont know why they would boast that and not explain clearly how to output it properly. Is it just thru the the single line-out port?  Or unless nga, thru SPDIF? (one would think theyd be more clear in their installation manual or website)



 

Therefore, do not buy an HTIB without digital input.  Try to ask for discount in lieu of the HTZ120 - or get it free but sell it to somebody...or get the HDMI DVD player and sell to put up the budget for a better HTIB or a full sized HT system.   The HTIB is of paramount importance because most of the MKVs out there have DTS soundstream, while most mainstream HDTV's have rubbish built-in sound system.  Ikaw rin.  hehehe.

 Huhuhu..  that's the rub... ma-oover budget na.. hehe  just originally wanted an LCD TV tapos naging w DVD player then with HTS.. tapos now hi-end HTS with digital input..hehe baka next time na lang siguro...hehe (in w/c case I guess SPDIF out is already moot i guess) Pero pag-iisipan ko muna talaga..hehe...

Another problem is since the setup is in my bedroom, where the TV cabinet is a mere 3 feet only away from the foot of my bed, there wont be room for those HUGE speakers esp for large subwoofer on the floor... so a simpler and smaller HTS might be a better fit. I COULD setup the LCD/HT in the Living room, but I watch TV/movies in my bedroom 95% of the time (may aircon e..hehe) Besides, baka mamaya e pag wala ako pakialaman pa ng mga maids ang HT sa sala..hehe

Anyway, again thanks for all the help.. have a lot to consider and its all been fun...

Should buy already this weekend.. unless sa kakareserch ko e ma-delay pa to look for better setup/deals..hehe...   I think ill check out this ONKYO HTS I read about...hehe.....



 

[kyleryner]

ooops sorry for the late reply but they already answered all, regarding the player sa pc, use the clondalkin special  dami tutulong sayo dito sir like ako dati lage din nag tatanong dito 

no prob, tein...    dami ngang tumutulong sa akin, nahihiya na nga akong magtanong.. baka sobrang kulit na..haha

whats a clondalkin "special"? 

hopefully someday i can repay Pinoydvd and ako naman sasagot sa mga makukulit na newbies once may alam na ako.. hehe

peace!

[Philander]

@Philander,

   Philander, what do you mean outputting to 1080p need additional software? what software? As for the screen res, the ATI Catalyst Control Center says I can change up to 1600x1200. (not sure if this is what you mean). In any case playing at 720 is fine by me I guess...

Eto aaminin ko medyo mahirap iexplain. Try to read first about 'Display Resolution' and 'Video Resolution'. May tool kasi (some included in your VC configuration to output Video Resolution instead of Display Resolution.

Pero ganto na lang, kung ang bibilhing mong LCD ay FullHD, then nacover nya yung resolution na 1920 x 1080; if you are going to watch 1080p files, then you maximize the viewing if your display resolution is 1920 x 1080.

So even if the VC claims it's HDMI can output 5.1, the LCD TV will only interpret it as 2 CH? so thats why the HTS or HTIB  inputs is essential to getting true 5.1 sound?  I think im beginning to understand...

Yes, kasi physically ang channel and speakers lang naman na nakainstall sa LCDs ay usually 2ch/2speakers. So you really need receiver or HTIB to process the sound (connection type is important)

I think the cheapest solution would be to get a SC with SPDIF.. (hopefully its not expensive)

That's correct. Get a SC that has SPDIF as I am yet to find motherboard that sell SPDIF headers (from your other posts)

btw, my bew mobo (aside from my vc) also boasts it has HD-6CH (well the box says so anyway) but it only has the standard mic-line-out-line-in inputs. I think my old mobo had a Spdif but i never even knew what it was for. Darnit.

Your MOBO's build in SC is indeed a 6ch, you can configure the MIC and LINE IN to be the Center/Subwoofer and Rear channels correspondingly.

However you need to have receiver with 5.1 analog inputs to maximize this.

[Philander]

Also, the mobo specs says Sound is

* Compliant with HD audio specification
    * IDT 92HD202 6-channel audio ( CO-lay 92HD206)

6 Channel High Definition Audio
Integrated 6-channel HD Audio CODEC delivering advanced multi-channel audio and bringing you the experience of home theater-quality sound.

   
First, I dont know what all that means.. LOL..

Second, I dont know why they would boast that and not explain clearly how to output it properly. Is it just thru the the single line-out port?  Or unless nga, thru SPDIF? (one would think theyd be more clear in their installation manual or website)

I explained this above, your SC produces 6ch via analog out.

Alternative route, you can get 5.1 PC speaker from Logitech or Creative, cost about 2.6K and above. Your PC will be the one to perform the decoding.

[Philander]

I'm just hearing this last 2 days from many folks here with surprise that the old VGA connection is
actually better than the other inputs. I would have thought these newer technologies like HDMI would be better but apparently it isnt  

 Thanks for the tip especially if longer than 3 mtrs the recommended connection would be VGA.. (only problem i see is the thicker cable would make it harder to conceal.. unless i get really long one and route it behind cabinets instead of the more direct line-of-sight connection)

  and I Will (Enjoy)  

I'm just hearing this last 2 days from many folks here with surprise that the old VGA connection is
actually better than the other inputs. I would have thought these newer technologies like HDMI would be better but apparently it isnt  

Actually HDMI is STILL BETTER. VGA could be more reliable (and easier to set-up) as per Clondalkin which I agree. However, HDMI is still better especially if you know how to maximize it.

[Clondalkin]

I tried asking sales personnel about 1:1 thing they dont have a clue what im talking about..    I guess I COULD probably bring my laptop w/ cable to test.. but thats prolly overkill already.. lolz

It's OK.  Just be kind to them because you are more fortunate.  The test is really simple. Connect your PC via HDMI and check the texts.  If the texts are as crisp and clear as that of your regular PC monitor or the laptop, then 1:1 pixel mapping is working great.   If the texts have shadows or ghosts and kinda eye-sore, then sorry - in that case, check VGA connection to compare.

The thingie that came with the VC is this:

http://www.powercolor.com/images/accessories/s2av_cable.gif

Not that Im expecting/hoping to get a clear pic out of that S-video/ HDTV-out to my regular TV since as you said, Im gonna be getting an LCD soon anyway... but out of sheer curiosity, since you mentioned it can output high def res thru that port, why is it my attempts didnt get a clear pic? I used the above attachment to get pic in my TV but there are mild streaks/"scanning" things, like watching TV with antennae only and not clear signal.  Managed to watch thru an entire movie though. (just to see if i can)

Not the dongle.  Check the following link.  What Im using is the 2nd HDTV component video adapter from the left.

http://ati.amd.com/products/hdtvadapter/index.html

You were not able to get "clear pic" because (a) the dongle you used is for composite video and (b) you need an HD-CRT or an HDTV with component video input.  If you have friends who own those Japanese old TVs capable of 720p or even 1080i, that would be a good monitor for high def movie viewing.  For regular computing with HD-CRTs, you have to totally minimize the contrast to make the texts gentler to the eyes.

My audio out from my bnew mobo (740GM) at first glance, dont have SPDIF..  just the standard 3 ports..line in,line-out, mic.  But then I checked the manufacturer's website (ECS) and saw in their specs under "Internal I/O Connectors and Headers"   it has 1 x SPDIF out header so hopefully that means I DO in fact have SPDIF after all.. will just have to figure out how to access it when needed.. (its not even mentioned in the manual!) But in case it doesnt, i guess i could always get a SC with the SPDIF port...

As Philander posted, your mobo might be able to output multi-channel analog audio through a single output port at the back.  It's worth a try.  Can you check the audio settings of your PC and see if there are options for various kinds of audio output (headphone, stereo, 2.1Ch, 5.1Ch)?

     
Another problem is since the setup is in my bedroom, where the TV cabinet is a mere 3 feet only away from the foot of my bed, there wont be room for those HUGE speakers esp for large subwoofer on the floor... so a simpler and smaller HTS might be a better fit. I COULD setup the LCD/HT in the Living room, but I watch TV/movies in my bedroom 95% of the time (may aircon e..hehe) Besides, baka mamaya e pag wala ako pakialaman pa ng mga maids ang HT sa sala..hehe

No room can be too small for a nice set of speakers.  Hehehe.  I think 3 feet is enough clearance for monitor type speakers or those slim type floor standers.   At any rate, you certainly would save space if you use HTIB in your bedroom.   

[Waxx]

OT: di pa man din ay naaacquire na ni kyle ang SARS.... isang sakit na mahirap gamutin sa pdvd 


i figured my sammy ln52A650 doesnt have 1:1 pixel mapping kaya pala wala sa tamang screen panning nung nilagay ko sa hdmi ang connection...

btw.. when you have 1:1 pixel mapping on an LCD monitor whose native res is 1920x1200...  would it look a bit washed out when playing 1920x1080 (ps3 via hdmi-dvi d cable)? or its the same as playing it in 1920 x 1080 capable monitor?

here's my hardware: ps3>hdmi-dvid>Dell wfp2407

kasi iniisip ko kung mag uupgrabe ba ako to sammy 26in or the same dell wfp2408 (with hdmi input) if ever mas sharper sya vs my current setup... i get bothered that what im seeing now is kinda stretched (16:10) hence i think its less sharper e.. is this true? or paranoid lang ako?

[Alfie]

Actually HDMI is STILL BETTER. VGA could be more reliable (and easier to set-up) as per Clondalkin which I agree. However, HDMI is still better especially if you know how to maximize it.

No to start another debate about these since I believe it was discussed before, but the HDMI is less superior than the DVI  and VGA. ( I just cannot find the thread anymore, but I believe it also merited a thread at the AVS Forum).

The HDMI was conceptualized to "Control Piracy, and it's only advantage is it's incorporated audio".

[Clondalkin]

i figured my sammy ln52A650 doesnt have 1:1 pixel mapping kaya pala wala sa tamang screen panning nung nilagay ko sa hdmi ang connection...

btw.. when you have 1:1 pixel mapping on an LCD monitor whose native res is 1920x1200...  would it look a bit washed out when playing 1920x1080 (ps3 via hdmi-dvi d cable)? or its the same as playing it in 1920 x 1080 capable monitor?

here's my hardware: ps3>hdmi-dvid>Dell wfp2407

kasi iniisip ko kung mag uupgrabe ba ako to sammy 26in or the same dell wfp2408 (with hdmi input) if ever mas sharper sya vs my current setup... i get bothered that what im seeing now is kinda stretched (16:10) hence i think its less sharper e.. is this true? or paranoid lang ako?

Hi Waxx, please try to read about Samsung's 1:1 pixel mapping.  Your Series 6 HDTV is too high grade not to have it.  I seem to remember that you have to connect to a specific HDMI (maybe HDMI 1 or 2) and then rename that port to "PC" or something and voila, you'd have the sharpest/clearest/crispiest texts.  Please check and try.

The only way for PC monitors to match the color saturation of HDTV LCDs is to use similar LCD Panel tech and engine.  Most LCD monitors use TN panel which is certainly dull compared to panels used for good quality HDTVs.   But for gaming purposes, it doesn't really matter that much because the image is animated anyways.   Wait Im not sure if I got your question right.  hehehe.

For your reference, the best LCD HDTVs for PC application Ive actually seen are the full HD Sonys and Sharps.   However, Ive read that Samsung HDTVs can achieve the same (from Series 5 if I remember correctly.)

Panasonic full HD LCDs, unfortunately, does not implement 1:1 pixel mapping just as nicely and would recommend owners to use VGA for PC connection.

[Waxx]

Hi Waxx, please try to read about Samsung's 1:1 pixel mapping.  Your Series 6 HDTV is too high grade not to have it.  I seem to remember that you have to connect to a specific HDMI (maybe HDMI 1 or 2) and then rename that port to "PC" or something and voila, you'd have the sharpest/clearest/crispiest texts.  Please check and try.

The only way for PC monitors to match the color saturation of HDTV LCDs is to use similar LCD Panel tech and engine.  Most LCD monitors use TN panel which is certainly dull compared to panels used for good quality HDTVs.   But for gaming purposes, it doesn't really matter that much because the image is animated anyways.   Wait Im not sure if I got your question right.  hehehe.

For your reference, the best LCD HDTVs for PC application Ive actually seen are the full HD Sonys and Sharps.   However, Ive read that Samsung HDTVs can achieve the same (from Series 5 if I remember correctly.)

Panasonic full HD LCDs, unfortunately, does not implement 1:1 pixel mapping just as nicely and would recommend owners to use VGA for PC connection.

sige ill try.. although nataandaan ko is. i plugged it sa hdmi 4 i think... but all the same.. im happy with pc in.. but for the sake of testing... ill check it out..