Topic: Do I even need a HDMI ready-DVD player if i use my PC as HTPC? (edited title)

[Waxx]

i just downloaded and re read the manual.. tama nga kayo sir.. hdmi 2 supports dvi in...

now comes the question......

is it sharper than the one im using now.. pc in via vga cable?? or the same??

right  now my setup is this:

all inputs (ps3/nmt/dvd/bluray/xbox360)> onkyo 876 > hdmi >sammy (via hdmi1)

so, should i just do this?

all inputs + mac > onkyo > hdmi > sammy (via hdmi 2)

or just leave it as is?

[Waxx]

Hi Waxx, please try to read about Samsung's 1:1 pixel mapping.  Your Series 6 HDTV is too high grade not to have it.  I seem to remember that you have to connect to a specific HDMI (maybe HDMI 1 or 2) and then rename that port to "PC" or something and voila, you'd have the sharpest/clearest/crispiest texts.  Please check and try.

The only way for PC monitors to match the color saturation of HDTV LCDs is to use similar LCD Panel tech and engine.  Most LCD monitors use TN panel which is certainly dull compared to panels used for good quality HDTVs.   But for gaming purposes, it doesn't really matter that much because the image is animated anyways.   Wait Im not sure if I got your question right.  hehehe.

For your reference, the best LCD HDTVs for PC application Ive actually seen are the full HD Sonys and Sharps.   However, Ive read that Samsung HDTVs can achieve the same (from Series 5 if I remember correctly.)

Panasonic full HD LCDs, unfortunately, does not implement 1:1 pixel mapping just as nicely and would recommend owners to use VGA for PC connection.

sir clond... here's an easier explanation..

i got my dell 2407wfp before for pc/mac use.. and since i brought home my mac and installed it to the tv, i figured to just use this to play ps3 here at work.. (uhmm didnt sound right no?)

so dell came out with a newer model 2408wfp... the only difference is, that they have hdmi in..

what bothers me is this:

if i upgrade to a 2408 and use hdmi in on the monitor.. would it be sharper? or just technically the same as using dvi in of the 2407 im currently using? i mean... would using hdmi-in port on a monitor render the screen to display it properly in a 1920x1080 resolution (16:9)? or will it give the same 'stretch effect" (16:10) that i am currently having now? i tried to tinker with my monitor now, and i cant switch it to aspect ratio (16:9) while playing ps3.. its just locked at 1:1 to fill up the entire screen which i believe stretches the image a bit which renders the games less sharper..

magulo parin ba explanation ko??

 

[Clondalkin]

For your reference Waxx.  Good luck!

http://www.genmay.com/showthread.php?t=809501

Dont forget the abracadabra renaming of the port to "PC".  Interesting that with this keyword, the Samsung HDTV would allegedly disable the post processings that tend to wreck the quality of texts...so without those post processings, what happens to the quality of video???

[Clondalkin]

sir clond... here's an easier explanation..

i got my dell 2407wfp before for pc/mac use.. and since i brought home my mac and installed it to the tv, i figured to just use this to play ps3 here at work.. (uhmm didnt sound right no?)

so dell came out with a newer model 2408wfp... the only difference is, that they have hdmi in..

what bothers me is this:

if i upgrade to a 2408 and use hdmi in on the monitor.. would it be sharper? or just technically the same as using dvi in of the 2407 im currently using? i mean... would using hdmi-in port on a monitor render the screen to display it properly in a 1920x1080 resolution (16:9)? or will it give the same 'stretch effect" (16:10) that i am currently having now? i tried to tinker with my monitor now, and i cant switch it to aspect ratio (16:9) while playing ps3.. its just locked at 1:1 to fill up the entire screen which i believe stretches the image a bit which renders the games less sharper..

magulo parin ba explanation ko??

Malinaw ang explanation and very interesting one.   Im sure you've already read a lot about 1:1 pixel mapping which essentially means whatever the VC throws out will be rendered as is on the monitor.   But the basic premise is, you want to do 1:1 pixel mapping based on the monitor's NATIVE resolution diba?  So would you be able to force feed a 1920x1080 signal from a VC to a 1920x1200 monitor and display it as 1920x1080?   Interesting idea but I dont know.  

1:1 pixel mapping via HDMI as applied to a 1920x1200 native monitor fundamentally means 1920x1200 output I think.  And LCDs primarily designed as PC monitors as in the case of the Dells have 1:1 pixel mapping for sure.  Im sure new models of widescreen monitors have 4:3 mode (for those doing 4:3 photoshops) but having 16:10 and 16:9 modes on the same monitor with 1:1 pixel mapping - that sounds really nice but I haven't seen one.

But what you want is easily solved by purchasing a native 1920x1080 PC monitor.  Dami na and ang gaganda.


Edit:  I forgot.
2407 via DVI vs 2408 via HDMI = I expect it to be the same 16:10 quality.

[Clondalkin]

is it sharper than the one im using now.. pc in via vga cable?? or the same??

right  now my setup is this:

all inputs (ps3/nmt/dvd/bluray/xbox360)> onkyo 876 > hdmi >sammy (via hdmi1)

so, should i just do this?

all inputs + mac > onkyo > hdmi > sammy (via hdmi 2)

or just leave it as is?

Give it a try please.  For PC connection, assuming the combination of HDMI 2 connection and renaming of the port to "PC" work as touted - do you remember the 1st time you connected via DVI-D and noticed the crispiness of texts and webpages compared to that of VGA?

However for other devices such as Xbox360, BD player, NMT, DVD, I dont think it makes any discernible difference which HDMI port you connect; but I'd be glad to be proven wrong on this. 

I'm sure a lot of people are just as excited as you to know the results.  Please let us know.

[Waxx]

Malinaw ang explanation and very interesting one.   Im sure you've already read a lot about 1:1 pixel mapping which essentially means whatever the VC throws out will be rendered as is on the monitor.   But the basic premise is, you want to do 1:1 pixel mapping based on the monitor's NATIVE resolution diba?  So would you be able to force feed a 1920x1080 signal from a VC to a 1920x1200 monitor and display it as 1920x1080?   Interesting idea but I dont know.  

1:1 pixel mapping via HDMI as applied to a 1920x1200 native monitor fundamentally means 1920x1200 output I think.  And LCDs primarily designed as PC monitors as in the case of the Dells have 1:1 pixel mapping for sure.  Im sure new models of widescreen monitors have 4:3 mode (for those doing 4:3 photoshops) but having 16:10 and 16:9 modes on the same monitor with 1:1 pixel mapping - that sounds really nice but I haven't seen one.

But what you want is easily solved by purchasing a native 1920x1080 PC monitor.  Dami na and ang gaganda.


Edit:  I forgot.
2407 via DVI vs 2408 via HDMI = I expect it to be the same 16:10 quality.

interesting... i googled for my dillema and here's what i got..

apparently... my monitor forces my ps3 connection to go 16:10 (1920x1200) even if the maximum output of ps3 is at 16:9 (1920x1080).. with that being said.. i am not able to adjust the dell monitor not to force it to 16:10 and display it at native 16:9 resolution (with black bars on top expected)...

i can however.. try connecting the ps3 via component cable and make the monitor display it at 16:9 or 16:10. but here begins another sub-dillema.. i believe ps3 could only output at 1080i max if using the component cable.. i dont know if its the limitations of the ps3 or the limitations of the ps3 component cable.

so technically.. playing ps3 at my lcd monitor now via hdmi-dvi cable is ok, but i get the feeling nga na its a bit stretched coz the monitor is forcing it to fill the entire screen via its 1:1 mapping (16:10). ive read some users complain while others say that its barely noticeable.. but for me, i just want to see the difference. i dont mind small black bars on top as long as the graphics are as crisp as it is when i play in my lcd tv at home.

and on that note.. i will haveto wait on when i could borrow a 2408wfp lcd monitor to test out if indeed there is streching or not when plugged in via hdmi or if you could choose settings whether you want to turn on 1:1 or maintain aspect ratio... and in my case.. id also like to be able to test drive a sammy t26hd to know if indeed it has the same case as my dell monitor or it can display 1080p via hdmi natively.

i have this assumption na when you plug in via dvi input kasi.. it forces it to fill the entire screen (16:10) and if you plug it via hdmi, it forces the screen to render it natively at 16:9@full screen or is it just wishful thinking on my part? 

[Waxx]

Give it a try please.  For PC connection, assuming the combination of HDMI 2 connection and renaming of the port to "PC" work as touted - do you remember the 1st time you connected via DVI-D and noticed the crispiness of texts and webpages compared to that of VGA?

However for other devices such as Xbox360, BD player, NMT, DVD, I dont think it makes any discernible difference which HDMI port you connect; but I'd be glad to be proven wrong on this. 

I'm sure a lot of people are just as excited as you to know the results.  Please let us know.

so kelangan talaga i rename into PC or else it wouldnt work? hmm interesting... will try that this weekend...

as far as i recall.. when i plugged my mac via hdmi-dvi cable into hdmi4 input.. distorted sya at wala sa tamang panning ng screen... (parang its out of sync).. so i tried the vga cable and thats where the crispiness is..

ill try it again this weekend and take picture and if indeed it is better in hdmi, then i will have one hi res vga cable up for sale.. 

[kyleryner]

You were not able to get "clear pic" because (a) the dongle you used is for composite video and (b) you need an HD-CRT or an HDTV with component video input.  If you have friends who own those Japanese old TVs capable of 720p or even 1080i, that would be a good monitor for high def movie viewing.  For regular computing with HD-CRTs, you have to totally minimize the contrast to make the texts gentler to the eyes.

I see...  no prob there, dont really need it, just curious.  
re: old japanese tvs.. you know, a while back when one of our TVs was broken, I thought of buying those surplus Japanese/Korean TVs in Raon.. big screen size between 3-6k, depending on model. But theyre old, menu is in Japanese, and they're not cable Ready.. so i  just had my Old TV repaired..  But i wonder if they are capable of 720p or 1080i since theyre "Japanese Old TVs"    I doubt the Raon boys would know if i ask them...

As Philander posted, your mobo might be able to output multi-channel analog audio through a single output port at the back.  It's worth a try.  Can you check the audio settings of your PC and see if there are options for various kinds of audio output (headphone, stereo, 2.1Ch, 5.1Ch)?

Yes it can... another duuuuhh for me     (this board could really use a head-slapping smiley..hehe)  All along its in the systray - IDT Audio Settings and there is the option to change Jack Configuration to Stereo, Quadraphonic,  5.1 and even 7.1 (!)  

Ive also been reading in other threads more on the topic, and so I know now the 3 ports (mic, l-in and l-out will be transformed to Rear/ Front/ CFE.) those 3 are all i need right? But as Philander pointed out, i would need a RECEIVER  that can  accept these 3 inputs.

And as Philander also pointed out,

Alternative route, you can get 5.1 PC speaker from Logitech or Creative, cost about 2.6K and above. Your PC will be the one to perform the decoding.

But i dont think PC speakers will be as powerful as HTS for movie watching? or is it?

If it is, then its a more affordable alternative to a HT setup.. (2.6 k above basta less than 10k+ for Audio Receiver HTS?)

Then I can  just use my PC as a HTPC, use the ONBOARD SOUNDCARD 6 channel sound to a PC 5.1 Speakers, use my Video Card's VGA cable OR the DVI port to the LCD TV, and i can play MKVs, AVIs from th HD and DVDs from the DVD Drive with Dolby 5.1 (and DTS?)...

If it works (assuming PC Speakers are of HT quality), then its a poor man's HTS.. no need for HDMI Players, (which was my original query) and no need for more expensive Receivers and HT System? Tama ba interpretation ko?

If so.. (and im kinda hoping it is...) then I could skip my original options that offers freebies and just go for a CHEAPER LCD TV ... Panasonic or Sharp comes to mind... and use the extra savings to invest in a good PC SPEAKER SYSTEM (but still cheaper than a HTS).. which brings my post back to full circle...

I dont have to use my PC all the time anyway, just for popcorn movies or family-time-watching. I could use my old DVD player to play regular dvds/ divx like TV series w/ no need for 5.1 sounds...

EDIT: Im beginning to think that the above might be a silly question, as ive been browsing thru PC Speakers and (so far) seeing they have typically 30w power (compared to 350w above for HTS...) oh well... 
    

  


  

[av_phile1]

Guys, when connecting your HTPCs to LCD TVs via DVI,  make sure your PC video card or built-in video in the MOBO is HDCP compliant.  I would say all LCD TVs sold these days with DVI/HDMI ports are HDCP complaint. But not all video cards with DVI are.   Otherwise, you get to all sorts of compatibility issues like getting no display on the LCD TV after booting up your PC or, as in most cases, the LCD TV will downscale one level below its native resolution and you'll get crappy video.  In that case, use VGA connection which is analog and can look better between non compliant devices.  

[Philander]

I see...  no prob there, dont really need it, just curious.  
re: old japanese tvs.. you know, a while back when one of our TVs was broken, I thought of buying those surplus Japanese/Korean TVs in Raon.. big screen size between 3-6k, depending on model. But theyre old, menu is in Japanese, and they're not cable Ready.. so i  just had my Old TV repaired..  But i wonder if they are capable of 720p or 1080i since theyre "Japanese Old TVs"    I doubt the Raon boys would know if i ask them...



Yes it can... another duuuuhh for me     (this board could really use a head-slapping smiley..hehe)  All along its in the systray - IDT Audio Settings and there is the option to change Jack Configuration to Stereo, Quadraphonic,  5.1 and even 7.1 (!)  

Ive also been reading in other threads more on the topic, and so I know now the 3 ports (mic, l-in and l-out will be transformed to Rear/ Front/ CFE.) those 3 are all i need right? But as Philander pointed out, i would need a RECEIVER  that can  accept these 3 inputs.

And as Philander also pointed out,

But i dont think PC speakers will be as powerful as HTS for movie watching? or is it?

If it is, then its a more affordable alternative to a HT setup.. (2.6 k above basta less than 10k+ for Audio Receiver HTS?)

Then I can  just use my PC as a HTPC, use the ONBOARD SOUNDCARD 6 channel sound to a PC 5.1 Speakers, use my Video Card's VGA cable OR the DVI port to the LCD TV, and i can play MKVs, AVIs from th HD and DVDs from the DVD Drive with Dolby 5.1 (and DTS?)...

If it works (assuming PC Speakers are of HT quality), then its a poor man's HTS.. no need for HDMI Players, (which was my original query) and no need for more expensive Receivers and HT System? Tama ba interpretation ko?

If so.. (and im kinda hoping it is...) then I could skip my original options that offers freebies and just go for a CHEAPER LCD TV ... Panasonic or Sharp comes to mind... and use the extra savings to invest in a good PC SPEAKER SYSTEM (but still cheaper than a HTS).. which brings my post back to full circle...

I dont have to use my PC all the time anyway, just for popcorn movies or family-time-watching. I could use my old DVD player to play regular dvds/ divx like TV series w/ no need for 5.1 sounds...

EDIT: Im beginning to think that the above might be a silly question, as ive been browsing thru PC Speakers and (so far) seeing they have typically 30w power (compared to 350w above for HTS...) oh well... 
    

There are really good 5.1 PC speakers available, sometimes it's better than entry level HTIB from LG, Philips, Samsung, (those SRP is below 10K without HDMI), however it comes with a price. Check mid end level 5.1 speaker system from Logitec, AltecLansing or you may want to try Klipsch.


Again, if you really want to have 5.1 audio, you can opt to get from one of Samsung panel distributors here, and add about Php 5K for a Samsung HT z220 or something that has optical/coaxial digital input.

Or get the HDMI DVD player or the free HTIB and sell it, then get the Samsung HTIB Z220 for 8.5K posted in FS section.

PC speaker system usually have 1 input only, unlike HTIB, it has HDMI DVD player, USB, Radio, 2 to three inputs, etc.

[Clondalkin]

We're using Logitech's 2.1Ch Z4 (the black option) for my daughter's bedroom PC - pretty powerful and boomy PC speaker and great for listening to Itunes or watching movies.

[kyleryner]

Again, if you really want to have 5.1 audio, you can opt to get from one of Samsung panel distributors here, and add about Php 5K for a Samsung HT z220 or something that has optical/coaxial digital input.

Or get the HDMI DVD player or the free HTIB and sell it, then get the Samsung HTIB Z220 for 8.5K posted in FS section.

To SUM up/ Tie-up this thread, my original post was:

 

Samsung B350 for 27,900 with FREE HTS..5.1 speaker system but only regular DVD player
vs
LG 32LH20 for 26,900 with FREE Pioneer HD DVD player w/ HDMI cable (no 5.1 speaker system)

I made a stupid mistake, it wasnt an LG 32LH20, it was for a Panasonic 32C10. (ang gulo kasi ng notes ko w/ many scribbles..hehe)

And as I clarified later, it wasnt technically free HDMI player, but a free 5,000 cash that you need to use to buy at SM Appliance, and i thought i could use the 5,000 to buy the HDMI DVD player w/c cost around that much.  So technically, the Panasonic 32C10 was selling at SM for 21,900.. with free 5k worth of items..

I was leaning towards the Samsung bec I loved the idea of having 5.1 speakers.. but then of course i learned of many other factors I needed to consider...

I just read thru the entire thread of Panasonic 32C10.. from what i read, its a good 32" lcd tv that is selling like hotcakes. I even read your post, Philander, that you bought one. Im wating for your review.  

Long story short, since I became more savvy from reading thru dozens of pages here at PinoyDVD,   I think your advice is the best one, Philander.

I will look for a Panasonic C10 elsewhere, (not in SM) for 19.5 to 20 k, (hopefully they still have it at that price.) I learned from the threads to look at Western, Ambassador, Anson's etc.. and not just in SM stores..

then take the 6,900 to 7,900 savings i got from NOT buying at SM and either

   a) buy a good Upscaling DVD player w/c will leave me w/ leftover cash or
   b) add a bit more to buy a good 5.1 Sound system (with receiver ba?) that can accept coax or digital in.

 
  EDIT: I just discovered the Generic DVD players board where Im seeing what folks say are good HDMI players for around 2.5k!



   I could always just get the LCD first and take my time to research for later purchase a) and b), but I assumed kasi buying a package might give me some discounts from the store.

    Seems Waxx might be right...

    

OT: di pa man din ay naaacquire na ni kyle ang SARS.... isang sakit na mahirap gamutin sa pdvd  

      Took me some searching to get that SARS means  Speakers and Audio Replacement Syndrome.. hehe

      Pero may gamot naman dyan I think... an empty wallet! hehe...

      (btw, my original budget going in was not more than 30k )

      
       Thanks again to all for being patient and helpful in this endeavor, I truly appreciate it.. parang nakakahiya nga e, just for a measly low-budget LCD purchase e dami dami ng tanong.. hehe

        PINOYDVD ROCKS!  

      

[Philander]

Want straight advice? Dont get the C10x if you will use it mainly as your LCD panel for your HTPC. As one of the member pointed out, it does not implement 1:1 pixel mapping thus you will notice some ghosting in texts  especially if you are very discerning on how your Windows Icon/text will look like (DVD/video viewing does affected by this). But dont get me wrong, the PC input of the C10x IS VERY VERY CLEAR, yun nga lang sa malapitan medyo may ghosting sa text. If you are 3 to 5ft away from the panel di mo na ito makikita

Try to go to other shops as well like Sights and Sounds in Shangrila, especially if you want samsung, they offer very competitive price for their panels and they have a bundled promo for their LCD and HTIB. You can PM them for their prices


*-Im not in any way affiliated with Sights and Sounds, just merely giving suggestions

[kyleryner]

Want straight advice? Dont get the C10x if you will use it mainly as your LCD panel for your HTPC. As one of the member pointed out, it does not implement 1:1 pixel mapping thus you will notice some ghosting in texts  especially if you are very discerning on how your Windows Icon/text will look like (DVD/video viewing does affected by this). But dont get me wrong, the PC input of the C10x IS VERY VERY CLEAR, yun nga lang sa malapitan medyo may ghosting sa text. If you are 3 to 5ft away from the panel di mo na ito makikita

Try to go to other shops as well like Sights and Sounds in Shangrila, especially if you want samsung, they offer very competitive price for their panels and they have a bundled promo for their LCD and HTIB. You can PM them for their prices


*-Im not in any way affiliated with Sights and Sounds, just merely giving suggestions

Well guys, just went ahead and bought the Panny C10 today...

Thanks for the warning though, Philander..

No, Im not gonna be using it regularly for my PC.. when I said Ill use it as HTPC, I just meant i planned to use my PC when watching movies .. (thanks to this thread, I know what i need to do to accomplish that now.. a long HDMI cable or a long VGA cable,  and a 5.1 speaker system that would accept inputs from my soundcard.)  Nothing permanent, I meant to do it even if i have to keep plugging cables in and out or wires crossing the floor (temporarily). I dont mind having a messy setup.

Also to use the LCD for gaming by using a long usb extension then gamepad/mouse/keyboard ON THE BED (if I have to  ) or the wireless versions.

First thing I did when I unpacked the Panasonic C10 was to hook it up via VGA cables. (tried to buy 5m HDMI cable from CDRKing at the same mall I bought the LCD, but out of stocks, they just have the 3M ones. Will go out tom to look for the 5M one)

Rewarded with (for me) clear and readable text. Then next thing I did was play an MKV file (I only have 2 for now).  GREAT PQ!  Tried testing Games, viewing pics, eve opening a word document. (I dont have plans to use it for work! but now that i think of it i wonder what a spreadsheet would look like on that sucker.. )  Didnt fiddle with it so much so I didnt notice the lack of 1:1 ratio.. (LCD was on the floor too, so I was testing it at that level so couldnt be more thorough. Will test more when I get the HDMI cable)

All in all.. Im happy so far.. cept for some minor things which I already posted in the Panasonic C10 thread...

Now one down...( LCD)  two more to go (5.1 speakers and HDMI player) for my goal of HTPC...

Once again, thanks to all who gave their valued advice...

[av_phile1]

Congrats on your new LCD TV.  Glad to hear you're making progress.   

[Clondalkin]

You can still use your Panasonic C10 for regular computing comfortably.  You just have to sit farther as you would when watching a regular TV as opposed to kissing the monitor - then magnify the texts as big as the screen allows.  In which case, you need a wireless keyboard - laser type (bluetooth, 2.4GHz) preferably that can reach about 10m range. (3 meters lang range ng regular wireless).

Enjoy!

[Waxx]

so kelangan talaga i rename into PC or else it wouldnt work? hmm interesting... will try that this weekend...

as far as i recall.. when i plugged my mac via hdmi-dvi cable into hdmi4 input.. distorted sya at wala sa tamang panning ng screen... (parang its out of sync).. so i tried the vga cable and thats where the crispiness is..

ill try it again this weekend and take picture and if indeed it is better in hdmi, then i will have one hi res vga cable up for sale.. 

here is my report on what transpired last weekend on my test:

1. using mac mini> dvi-hdmi > onkyo 876> hdmi 2/dvi in:

    a. no rename:
    - windows is very very sharp and colors are vibrant
    - text is readable
    - mac wont work

    b. renamed the input port to PC:
    - windows 7 showed good softer resolution
    - colors are easier on the eyes / less vibrant
    - text is readable
    - mac still wont work

2. used the VGA cable connected straight to the VGA input of the TV
    - windows 7 and mac works
    - text and display was almost the same/ if not the same as case 1.a
    - opted to stay with this setup

what bothers me is why mac wont work if you let it pass thru the onkyo 876 receiver 

anyways.. i saw no difference in crispiness of resolution on my test.. so i opted to still use VGA cable. (to be able to use mac)

what i noticed is that thru hdmi2/dvi port.. you can rename it to "PC" and it will automatically adjust the settings of the TV to give it a softer look and less vibrant colors so that it would be much easier on the eyes.. something i can also do if i just copied the settings and applied them in my PC in profile..


here's what i accidentaly discovered while i was tweaking the tv settings while using ps3:

my tv was used to set at 16:9 mode.. and i just noticed it that there was a  portion of the game that was chopped off screen as verified in the title screen, so i put it to 'just scan mode' and verified that indeed there was a portion of the screen that was cut.. so right now i use the 'just scan' option. ill post pics next week.

all along i was playing games and watching tv in overscan mode?

 

[Clondalkin]

all along i was playing games and watching tv in overscan mode?
 

Just Scan is one of the nicknames of 1:1 Pixel Mapping.  Other vendors call it Dot-To-Dot

"Just" in Japanese English means EXACT = EXACT Scan = Zero Overscan = Zero Underscan  

So your Samsung allows Just Scan mode even under VGA connection?  That's good because my LG disables Just Scan if I dont connect via HDMI.  And if your TV does Just Scan via VGA, you really dont need HDMI connection.   

[Waxx]

Just Scan is one of the nicknames of 1:1 Pixel Mapping.  Other vendors call it Dot-To-Dot

"Just" in Japanese English means EXACT = EXACT Scan = Zero Overscan = Zero Underscan 

So your Samsung allows Just Scan mode even under VGA connection?  That's good because my LG disables Just Scan if I dont connect via HDMI.

hmmm i was using just scan in hdmi 1 and not hdmi 2..

ay teka.. nalito na ako.. i forgot.. pero as far as i recall.. pag naka VGA di napapalitan ang aspect. its fixed

[Clondalkin]

hmmm i was using just scan in hdmi 1 and not hdmi 2..

ay teka.. nalito na ako.. i forgot.. pero as far as i recall.. pag naka VGA di napapalitan ang aspect. its fixed

Ok try to verify.   If you can still enable Just Scan via VGA, that's great - but most HDTVs does Just Scan via HDMI.

HDMI handshake issues with the Mac perhaps?

[kyleryner]

Congrats on your new LCD TV.  Glad to hear you're making progress.

 thanks AVPhile    hehe oo nga.. ang haba habang usapan bago nakabili ng 32" LCD  

 Not yet done.. working on my Audio and HDMI player pa..  

You can still use your Panasonic C10 for regular computing comfortably.  You just have to sit farther as you would when watching a regular TV as opposed to kissing the monitor - then magnify the texts as big as the screen allows.  In which case, you need a wireless keyboard - laser type (bluetooth, 2.4GHz) preferably that can reach about 10m range. (3 meters lang range ng regular wireless).

Enjoy!

thanks Clondalkin.. I am enjoying it.  Yesterday I bought 5 mtr HDMI and also 5 mtr VGA cable..(400 pesos each so 800 pesos) and DVI-HDMI adaptor for my VC (120 pesos) and 3.5mm jack to 2 RCA (30 pesos) for my soundcard to Component... Overkill yata HDMI na, may VGA pa.. wanted to have 2 options and test if there is a diff bet the two..

Nahirapan akong ikabit yung HDMI cable BEHIND the TV Cabinet and Closets to get behind my PC.. ang sikip at mabigat kasi mga closets,di ko na magalaw masyado. It should have been enough length if it reached the floor (behind the furniture) but it got stuck somewhere.  Hiningal ako at pinawisan ng todo para mailabas lang ang cable. Managed to do it with LITERALLY INCHES to spare lang.

Tapos tried the same with VGA cables.. this time..INCHES NAMAN ang kinapos!!! mga 6 inches na lang sa VGA port!! LOL.. nahirapan pa akong ilabas uli since it got stuck na. I can still use it naman but in FRONT of the furnitures..messy cables...

Walang sound sa HDMI (still researching that issue... seems like its a common prob) so using Sound out from PC to HiFi Stereo Component ko..

Ok nga to use the TV now as a PC.. although not for net browsing or working.. just for Audio, Video, Gaming  

My setup is in my bedroom.. TV is in front of the bed, Computer is at the left of the bed.. Even before I use computer late at night pag napapagod na ko sa kakaupo I just continue browsing from my bed using a laptop (naka wireless). Ganun ako katamad kahit na katabi ko na nga lang ang PC.. hehe

Tsaka na ko bibili ng wireless kb and mouse (used to have 2 wireless mice, I stopped using them since 2x na nasira) For now I can use a loooong wired usb hub (4 feet lang layo ng PC ko sa Bed) ang connect USB mouse and Keyboard..  hehe.. poor man's 'wireless' setup..    So ill be Gaming/Using from my Bed..

Also, I have a utility that I used to use with an old Tablet PC... thru the home network, i can use  PC#1 (desktop)  mouse to control PC#2 (Tablet).  Not sure if there is keyboard control.. but if there is, then I can use my laptop as the keyboard/mouse for the Desktop/HTPC... presto! Instant Wireless setup!   And if Im not mistaken this is the same princple with Windows' Remote Access (?) wherein someone can take control of another PC (usually for technical assistance?) Havent tried that yet though...

[av_phile1]

Your VC is a video card only so even if it has HDMI port, you won't get any sound through it, unless your VC is connected to your sound card.  If I recall right inspecting one of the first generation video cards with HDMI, there's a provision to have it connected to your sound card via a board-to-board wiring connection.

[Waxx]

Ok try to verify.   If you can still enable Just Scan via VGA, that's great - but most HDTVs does Just Scan via HDMI.

HDMI handshake issues with the Mac perhaps?

as far as i remember.. no just scan via VGA..

as for the hdmi.. most probably mac doesnt detect the connection.. kasi naka connect pa sa receiver (via hdmi).. but direct sa tv dati kaya e..

[av_phile1]

here is my report on what transpired last weekend on my test:

1. using mac mini> dvi-hdmi > onkyo 876> hdmi 2/dvi in:

    a. no rename:
    - windows is very very sharp and colors are vibrant
    - text is readable
    - mac wont work

    b. renamed the input port to PC:
    - windows 7 showed good softer resolution
    - colors are easier on the eyes / less vibrant
    - text is readable
    - mac still wont work

2. used the VGA cable connected straight to the VGA input of the TV
    - windows 7 and mac works
    - text and display was almost the same/ if not the same as case 1.a
    - opted to stay with this setup

what bothers me is why mac wont work if you let it pass thru the onkyo 876 receiver 

anyways.. i saw no difference in crispiness of resolution on my test.. so i opted to still use VGA cable. (to be able to use mac)


 

The mac mini might not be HDCP compliant as I recall reading about OS X not being HDCP compliant.  . Though apple might have already released fixes for that.    That could account for your MAC mini not displaying via HDMI on an LCD TV that's HDCP compliant and through the receiver which is also HDCP compliant.  But analog VGA will work just fine.  .

[Clondalkin]

Waxx were you able to check the quality of texts (regular computing) when Just Scan was enabled?   Any text ghostings or shadow?

[Waxx]

i took screenshots.. here they are.. (click on title for hi res pic)

 mac osx in vga




mac osx in hdmi1



win7 in hdmi 1 : note the overscan



win 7 in hdmi2/dvi: renamed to 'PC'



win7 in VGA



i kinda liked it better in vga rather than in hdmi...

[av_phile1]

mac osx in hdmi1[/url]



win7 in hdmi 1 : note the overscan



win 7 in hdmi2/dvi: renamed to 'PC'



win7 in VGA



i kinda liked it better in vga rather than in hdmi...

It looks like your LCD TV downscales your PC input to a lower resolution when using hdmi than with VGA.

[Waxx]

sir avphile, just as sir clondalkin pointed out.. it does downscale it if connected thru hdmi.. but there if  you connect it to hdmi2/dvi connectivity and rename it to "pc" you will get the same resolution as the vga gives, but with a much more smoother toned down colors and sharpness.. i was switching to and fro form vga and hdmi2 and i figured theyre exactly similar to each other except for the settings.. and hdmi2 input wouldnt accept the mac osx passing through the hdmi connection of my avr...

so i stuck it out with vga.

[kyleryner]

Your VC is a video card only so even if it has HDMI port, you won't get any sound through it, unless your VC is connected to your sound card.  If I recall right inspecting one of the first generation video cards with HDMI, there's a provision to have it connected to your sound card via a board-to-board wiring connection.

But VC promises HDMI Video/Audio .. its even 5.1 Audio. this is from the VC, not from the mobo mind you..)

from the box:

Built in HDMI with 5.1 surround sound
The ATI RADEON HD 3600 series GPU jas a built in HDMI with HD audio support for single HDTV connectivity.
This unique feature is enabled with an intelligent DVI to HDMI adapter; no internal SPDIF or audio cabling is required.


But then i've seen several posts with the problem I just  mentioned.. Video only; no audio.

I read somewhere its a conflict bet the mobo's built in sound (realtek).  Or it may be bec its we used a DVI-to-HDMI adaptor instead of straight HDMI-HDMI. Maybe its bec the box says "via INTELLIGENT DVI to HDMI Adapter"? And maybe the adaptor I bought from CDR King isnt quite "intelligent" or the wrong kind? (since this adaptor isnt included in the box)

Again, not so sure and will spend some more time researching it.

Meanwhile, if it really is JUST VIDEO and no sound.. then there's not much point using the HDMI if you have a VGA cable with the same length. (although in my case i wasnt successful in setting up the VGA cables properly so HDMI is still the way to go for me)

With or without sound via HDMI, I'm ok.. no biggie. I'm currently im getting good sound thru soundcard to 2 big speakers (from Hi-Fi Stereo) on top of my TV Cabinet (thats what I use for my DVD watching). If I setup a 5.1 system  soon HDMI audio will be moot anyway... but curiousity is getting the better of me and I'll see if  it's a problem that can be solved. 


************

Just like to share something I just discovered..

I was messing with the Video Display of the PC (henceforth dubbed "HTPC"   ). I've been using CLONE DISPLAY since I set it up yesterday so I have a WYSIWYG display on both my monitor and LCD TV... then I tried the "Extend Desktop" (in ATI Control Catalyst).. saw the LCD showed my wallpaper and then i can move my mouse between the 2 screens. Then I played a video file and DRAGGED it across the TV... WOW!! it worked!! then Fullscreen, dragged the mouse back to my PC monitor and the movie is still playing on the LCD TV!!  FREAKIN AWESOME!!!!    

In effect, I can continue working while TV is playing a video OFF my PC!!

I just totally Geeked out!  I wasnt expecting this, I havent read or heard of it in my limited research on the subject. The fact that I stumbled upon it on my own just makes it all the more thrilling. (Like a total geek, I excitedly called my wife who was busy cooking to show it off... hehe  )

You cant get that feature from HDMI players!!  

I even tried playing 2 movies simultaneosuly.. 1 on my PC monitor and the other on the LCD TV.. both played smoothly with no lags..(except the audio naturally mashes together..) Im amazed that my PC can handle it (well it is a dual-core after all) and how the harddisk can access data on 2 diff files simultaneously..

I love my new HTPC!!  

[av_phile1]

But VC promises HDMI Video/Audio .. its even 5.1 Audio. this is from the VC, not from the mobo mind you..)

from the box:

Built in HDMI with 5.1 surround sound
The ATI RADEON HD 3600 series GPU jas a built in HDMI with HD audio support for single HDTV connectivity.
This unique feature is enabled with an intelligent DVI to HDMI adapter; no internal SPDIF or audio cabling is required.


But then i've seen several posts with the problem I just  mentioned.. Video only; no audio.

I read somewhere its a conflict bet the mobo's built in sound (realtek).  Or it may be bec its we used a DVI-to-HDMI adaptor instead of straight HDMI-HDMI. Maybe its bec the box says "via INTELLIGENT DVI to HDMI Adapter"? And maybe the adaptor I bought from CDR King isnt quite "intelligent" or the wrong kind? (since this adaptor isnt included in the box)

Again, not so sure and will spend some more time researching it.

Meanwhile, if it really is JUST VIDEO and no sound.. then there's not much point using the HDMI if you have a VGA cable with the same length. (although in my case i wasnt successful in setting up the VGA cables properly so HDMI is still the way to go for me)

With or without sound via HDMI, I'm ok.. no biggie. I'm currently im getting good sound thru soundcard to 2 big speakers (from Hi-Fi Stereo) on top of my TV Cabinet (thats what I use for my DVD watching). If I setup a 5.1 system  soon HDMI audio will be moot anyway... but curiousity is getting the better of me and I'll see if  it's a problem that can be solved. 

check out avforum here:

http://www.avforums.com/forums/graphics-cards-tv-tuners-webcams/748459-asus-eah3650-no-audio-vista-3.html

it might work for you.