Topic: Do branded cables really make a difference?

[ATJr.]

thing is, people who are able to hear differences in cables (and/or those who refer to themselves as audio purists) tend to be the ones who frown upon the use of any sort of tone control manipulation (be it via the tone knob, or eq, or dsp, etc.)

kaya nga eh, sa cable nila ibinabaling ang kawalan nila ng tone control....
kaya ayun, walang katapusang pag papalit palit ng cable...
kung alam lang nila kung paano tinimpla ng mga recording engineers yung
plaka or cd......

kahit pa sabihin na direct to disk yung plaka,
gumagamit ng equalization yan,
another name for tone control,
kasi imposible na walang gagamitin na tone control....

i remember about 30 years or more ago,
me nagpagawa sa akin ng phono preamp na solid state,
yung nagpagawa, merong 8 track recording shop,
from vinyls to tape...
so minsan ipapakalikot yung equalisation para makuha nya
ang tunog na gusto nya, pwede naman yon...

[rthirtyfourgtr]

^ IMO, a self-respecting audiophile would take the time to understand the processes involved in sound/music reproduction, from the original time sound waves leave the performer's mouth/instrument, until the time they reach the listener's ears during playback.

with a good understanding of the processes involved, one should be able to discern what is and what's not essential in a proper audio playback system.

[Tempter]

kaya nga eh, sa cable nila ibinabaling ang kawalan nila ng tone control....
kaya ayun, walang katapusang pag papalit palit ng cable...
kung alam lang nila kung paano tinimpla ng mga recording engineers yung
plaka or cd......

kahit pa sabihin na direct to disk yung plaka,
gumagamit ng equalization yan,
another name for tone control,
kasi imposible na walang gagamitin na tone control....

i remember about 30 years or more ago,
me nagpagawa sa akin ng phono preamp na solid state,
yung nagpagawa, merong 8 track recording shop,
from vinyls to tape...
so minsan ipapakalikot yung equalisation para makuha nya
ang tunog na gusto nya, pwede naman yon...

Gusto ko pa rin talaga ng OLD SKUL equalizers, laki ng nagagawang difference...

Kahit crappy ang amp at source mo (not to mention CABLES), laki ng nagagawa pag may multi-band equalizer ka.

[Nelson de Leon]

if believing in cables is due to the fact that you can hear a difference...
then incorporating a tone control instead surely will make a difference, no debating this fact...

thing is, people who are able to hear differences in cables (and/or those who refer to themselves as audio purists) tend to be the ones who frown upon the use of any sort of tone control manipulation (be it via the tone knob, or eq, or dsp, etc.)

Some people avoid using analog tone controls and EQ primarily because it adds coloration sa sound, and more often very significant even when the analog tone controls and EQ are set to zero (unless there's a bypass). Probably because additional link sa signal chain ang circuit ng tone control and/or EQ.

[ATJr.]

Some people avoid using analog tone controls and EQ primarily because it adds coloration sa sound, and more often very significant even when the analog tone controls and EQ are set to zero (unless there's a bypass). Probably because additional link sa signal chain ang circuit ng tone control and/or EQ.

the moment the singer's voice hit the diaphragm of the mike in a recording studio,
coloration has already started....
a tone control can have a potential to reverse that...the RIAA playback is a tone control...
it all boils down to preference or nakasanayan na...

[mykel18]

the moment the singer's voice hit the diaphragm of the mike in a recording studio,
coloration has already started....
a tone control can have a potential to reverse that...the RIAA playback is a tone control...
it all boils down to preference or nakasanayan na...

But in using tone control, you would have to use it everytime for every song/album to reverse the coloration done then. Bawat kanta/album kelangan timplahin to get the sound you want.

Also do note that speakers, amps, cables, sources, records all have their own unique traits/character/signature sound. System matching/synergy ang kelangan kaya yung iba pumipili din ng babagay na cable for their system.

[Weng!]

But in using tone control, you would have to use it everytime for every song/album to reverse the coloration done then. Bawat kanta/album kelangan timplahin to get the sound you want.

does this mean that when you have a perfectly-matched cable in your system, wala ng timplahin and it will adjust to the different coloration introduced in each and every song?

nagtatanong lang po, peace

[ATJr.]

if your belief system tells you that you should use branded cables, then by all means do it...
it is your happiness that is at stake and that is all that matters....
we are just having a discussion here, and that be aware that other points of view exist...
there are far too many variables involved and cables are just one of them...
i think that your speakers still stand to be the weakest link....

[bumblebee]

But in using tone control, you would have to use it everytime for every song/album to reverse the coloration done then. Bawat kanta/album kelangan timplahin to get the sound you want.

Does this mean there's also a specific cable for a specific song?

[ATJr.]

Does this mean there's also a specific cable for a specific song?

oh i heard stories about that one too....

[mykel18]

does this mean that when you have a perfectly-matched cable in your system, wala ng timplahin and it will adjust to the different coloration introduced in each and every song?

nagtatanong lang po, peace

Mine doesn't have tone controls. If most of the songs sounds the way I like on my system (and fewer doesn't), then it is okay for me than using tone controls. I just simply want to enjoy and listen to the music with convenience and less hassles, imho.

[ATJr.]

Gusto ko pa rin talaga ng OLD SKUL equalizers, laki ng nagagawang difference...

Kahit crappy ang amp at source mo (not to mention CABLES), laki ng nagagawa pag may multi-band equalizer ka.

i was privileged to have been invited to an audiophile's setup somewhere in Welcome rotonda, QC...
he as a speaker system composed of about 32 speakers forming a wall of sound,
several ML 25's Crown Studio reference amps and multi band electronics crossovers,
bago magpatugtog, itinotono muna yung system using pink noise generators and RTA's
in other words, me tone control....
boy pag narinig mo yung system nya, baka itakwil mo yung sa iyo....

[mykel18]

Does this mean there's also a specific cable for a specific song?

Eto di ko na alam 

[deist]

An artist before going to the recording studio should have a "vision" of how her/his album should sound, it's one of the first few steps in the creative process, part of the process are the tweaks involved in the recording. In short,everything done in the recording studio is a conscious effort to turn the artist's vision into reality. I think that's the reason why audiophiles doesn't want to use tone controls, to hear it as close to how it was recorded as possible.

[jh@meeh]

Cable debate is endless, its like politics and always boils down to budget and what kind of system you have.

Many people are saying that your cable must be transparent, should not add any coloration, but if the system is too analytical other people dont like it and they want to mix a cable which adds coloration(sure there is) and for them that is musical. Cable company are producing different type of cables to suit a system and to have different flavor and prices to suit your budget. Parang vapers lang yan, kanya kanyang juice   

Kung ang speaker mo naman is worth a value, bigyan mo nman sya ng justice at wag gamitan ng lamp cord  ...For me, cable is part of the system and you should respect it same as speakers and amps.

My 2 cents...

[ATJr.]

An artist before going to the recording studio should have a "vision" of how her/his album should sound, it's one of the first few steps in the creative process, part of the process are the tweaks involved in the recording. In short,everything done in the recording studio is a conscious effort to turn the artist's vision into reality. I think that's the reason why audiophiles doesn't want to use tone controls, to hear it as close to how it was recorded as possible.

yes, this is true, that is why the term HI-Fidelity.....

[ATJr.]

Kung ang speaker mo naman is worth a value, bigyan mo nman sya ng justice at wag gamitan ng lamp cord  ...For me, cable is part of the system and you should respect it same as speakers and amps.

My 2 cents...

oo naman, kung nakabile ka ng 500k na speaker, hindi ka makakabile ng 15k na cable?
kahit naman ako hindi ko gagamitan ng mumurahing cable yan, me pangbile ako eh....
pero kung paga 5k yung speaker mo at gagamitan mo ng 15k na cable, aba eh wag naman....

[Nelson de Leon]

if your belief system tells you that you should use branded cables, then by all means do it...
it is your happiness that is at stake and that is all that matters....
we are just having a discussion here, and that be aware that other points of view exist...
there are far too many variables involved and cables are just one of them...
i think that your speakers still stand to be the weakest link....

the issue of using branded cables has already been discussed in the previous posts. As a metter of fact, it was suggested that the title be changed to Do Different Types And/Or Brand of Cables Really Make a Difference. 

And i agree with you that cables are just one of the many variables. 

[mykel18]

we are just having a discussion here, and that be aware that other points of view exist...

just giving my inputs/pov to the discussion as well. 

[jh@meeh]

pero kung paga 5k yung speaker mo at gagamitan mo ng 15k na cable, aba eh wag naman....

korek ka jan pare koy..esep esep pag may time.. ..at least dapat ang consideration sa cable ay performance to match system, looks, resale value, and top of all price 
Isa pa pala, WAF..

[Nelson de Leon]

i was privileged to have been invited to an audiophile's setup somewhere in Welcome rotonda, QC...
he as a speaker system composed of about 32 speakers forming a wall of sound,
several ML 25's Crown Studio reference amps and multi band electronics crossovers,
bago magpatugtog, itinotono muna yung system using pink noise generators and RTA's
in other words, me tone control....
boy pag narinig mo yung system nya, baka itakwil mo yung sa iyo....

I've been there and heard his primary set-up. hindi yun sandamalmal na monoblock ML amps. 

Yun 3 pairs SET KT88 monoblocks ata yun na-audition ko. 2 sets of preamps. Then dumaan muna sa active xover before pumunta sa power amp. Then after amplification, dumaan ulit sa built-in passive xover ng LS speakers niya. And yes, it goes very loud talaga. And even at loud volumes, walang clipping. Truly a system to admire. But unfortunately, hindi yun ang preference ko.  Now i know your preference.  And lovejbl's system included.

And looking from your point of view, hindi naman talaga audible ang changes ng wires sa system na yun, be it balanced or unbalanced and speaker wires. I underatand what you mean.

But there are also other systems that are very transparent. Most of them, in their simplest form, na subtle changes in wires or positioning does make a slight audible difference.

I do use EQ in my system, pero sa digital side. Hindi sa analog chain. I've had first hand experience na analog EQs tend  to add too much coloration (for me) even at zero. And it's also true na anything na idagdag natin, or anything na dadaanan ng signal chain, wires, preamps etc, are dagdag coloration. The point (my point  ) here is, how to minimize the coloration. Kaya nga very popular din yun mga Nelson Pass passive preamps, kasi less ang cocloration niya because passive siya.

[panzimus]

ibat ibang set ups talaga, ibat ibang flavor. That includes everything from the source up to the speakers (cables included ha). Pati nga positioning lang and room treatment nababago nya ang tunog eh.

For me, mas mahalaga to identify first kung ano ba talaga ang gusto mong klaseng sound then build your system para ma-achieve mo yun.

[bumblebee]

Pati nga positioning lang and room treatment nababago nya ang tunog eh.

Nababago talaga nya kasi the room affects the sound more than anything else in the chain.

[CoolTOYZPH]

before i dont believe that speaker cables have their own characteristics.....afterall they are all the same strands of copper binded together.... tapos to hear two diff cable side by side, i switch my preamp to mono and used two diff cables on left and right channel( i dont know if this test if proper for AB testing, sinubukan ko lang)......may difference nga. i dont know the science of it why it gives diff results, so ang bottom line for me is to get the cables na swak sa taste ko and dont buy something just because it looks good......

+1 for me.

For example I have experienced...
a) IC that bring out the brightness of a system. (Audioquest ICs)
b) IC that tame the brightness by opening up the mid-range. (Chord ICs)

A very noticeable difference in SQ is if you switch from copper wires to silver wires.
Recently also experienced cleaner sound with ICs that have plastic plugs versus copper plugs.

The difference is not something you will notice immediately but if you listen to your systesm 1-2-3hours a day then the minor changes become significant in the enjoyment of the music.

[musika]

Cable manufacturer said that electron or current passing to an specific conductor has an effect to its insulator, this is one of the reason why cable need breakin period. One insight, in cable properties Meron silang sina sabing skin effect. Correct me if I'm wrong.

Cheers,

[luis]

imho, based on actual testing or actual use:

QED IC (yung tag p1.6k) - revealing.
Monster Cable IC (yung tag p1.5k) - neutral
Anthony Audio IC (yung tag p1.5k) - warm

just sharing.   

[ATJr.]

current passing thru cables causes heat loss no matter how minute, this is inescapable....
perhaps this is one reason using heavier gauge of wire makes sense...
alternating current passing thru cables have this "skin" effect,
but in the high megahertz regions, no for audio frequencies...
a number 18 wire is good up to 21khz when considering this skin effect,
that is why several strands of smaller wires as in a cat5 cable is immuned at this frequency...
when exposed to air, copper reacts with hydrogen and becomes tarnished,
that is why silver plating helps...
when exposed to air, several plastic insulations lose original consistency and hardens and discolors....
there is no escaping this, in time you have a cable that is not pliant as the day you first got it...
may even have changed in color and has become stiff...
that is why replacing then when they show signs of wear can be a good thing..
or perhaps redoing the end terminations can save you from buying a new one...
i read advertisements by manufacturers....they are all meant to sell, not to educate...
i have seen this effects from making house calls on rich clients having these cables...
they buy new ones and give the old cables to me, para tansuin...

[AppleMan]

eh yung VDH white color with stranded silver wire? 

[obsi]

Cal, comment naman diyan, your thoughts are very welcome.

[ATJr.]

 

But unfortunately, hindi yun ang preference ko.  Now i know your preference. 

i am a simple guy, i go for bang for the buck, if i were as rich as those guys, then who knows?, maybe....

but then maybe not, kung alam mo kung paano ginagawa ang "tira-tira" hindi ka bibile noon....