Author Topic: Alvin's Movieworld 2.40 CIH SETUP (Update 07/11/09 post#287)  (Read 36341 times)

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Offline streetsmart

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Re: Alvin's Movieworld 2.40 CIH SETUP (Update 05/19/08)
« Reply #210 on: Jul 21, 2008 at 12:00 PM »
Wow...kong alvin...any web links to that article??  :o :o

I read the article. Nothing exciting. Came out on Sunday. The article was really more about the Eagles and how they kicked out Don Feldon. Binanggit lang that napanood nya ang Reunion concert ng Eagles sa HT ni Alvin and magaling ang HT.
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Offline alvinthx2

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Re: Alvin's Movieworld 2.40 CIH SETUP (Update 05/19/08)
« Reply #211 on: Jul 21, 2008 at 03:26 PM »
Yes nothing special, just a mention. but I was invited to verify Val's audio system using my equipments and have a side by side comparison of an ear-tweaked vs. an instrument-tweaked system in the near future. ;)
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Offline Munskie

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Re: Alvin's Movieworld 2.40 CIH SETUP (Update 05/19/08)
« Reply #212 on: Jul 21, 2008 at 03:28 PM »
Yes nothing special, just a mention. but I was invited to verify Val's audio system using my equipments and have a side by side comparison of an ear-tweaked vs. an instrument-tweaked system in the near future. ;)

Another event to look forward in the future.... ;)

Offline streetsmart

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Re: Alvin's Movieworld 2.40 CIH SETUP (Update 05/19/08)
« Reply #213 on: Jul 21, 2008 at 03:36 PM »
Yes nothing special, just a mention. but I was invited to verify Val's audio system using my equipments and have a side by side comparison of an ear-tweaked vs. an instrument-tweaked system in the near future. ;)

Alvin, how does Val tweak his audio system by ear?

I suppose he has a parametric eq with certain settings, tapos ikaw naman mag-adjust ng eq through the use of instruments?
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Offline alvinthx2

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Re: Alvin's Movieworld 2.40 CIH SETUP (Update 05/19/08)
« Reply #214 on: Jul 21, 2008 at 05:18 PM »
Val's setup is tri-amplified. Had a chat with some wiredstate members and from the looks of it, they prefer doing it by ear. I told them that if you use instruments, you can be sure you are within acceptable tolerances, but still they contend that the ear is the final instrument. I would agree with that, except that I still need some verification to any adjustments done by ear.  You know me, I don't want a long discussion. I respect their opinion.

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Offline streetsmart

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Re: Alvin's Movieworld 2.40 CIH SETUP (Update 05/19/08)
« Reply #215 on: Jul 21, 2008 at 05:28 PM »
Val's setup is tri-amplified. Had a chat with some wiredstate members and from the looks of it, they prefer doing it by ear. I told them that if you use instruments, you can be sure you are within acceptable tolerances, but still they contend that the ear is the final instrument. I would agree with that, except that I still need some verification to any adjustments done by ear.  You know me, I don't want a long discussion. I respect their opinion.



Oh ... I recently read a post by a top acoustics professor bout the ears. The contention is that music is a very complex set of sounds, made even more complex cuz of its interaction with the room. Because of this, head movement of even a few inches can make a differnce in what you hear.

On another matter, if you tune by ear, you have a pre-determined idea of what you want to hear. Individual taste comes into play. Even if you do a very accurate calibration by instrument, he may still not like the sound cuz that's not his taste.

Very difficult. Good luck!
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Offline docsialu

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Re: Alvin's Movieworld 2.40 CIH SETUP (Update 05/19/08)
« Reply #216 on: Jul 21, 2008 at 05:36 PM »
http://wiredstate.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=19365

Guys, thats the ws link of the article

Offline alvinthx2

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Re: Alvin's Movieworld 2.40 CIH SETUP (Update 05/19/08)
« Reply #217 on: Jul 21, 2008 at 06:15 PM »
Oh ... I recently read a post by a top acoustics professor bout the ears. The contention is that music is a very complex set of sounds, made even more complex cuz of its interaction with the room. Because of this, head movement of even a few inches can make a differnce in what you hear.

On another matter, if you tune by ear, you have a pre-determined idea of what you want to hear. Individual taste comes into play. Even if you do a very accurate calibration by instrument, he may still not like the sound cuz that's not his taste.

Very difficult. Good luck!

True, that is why we have the NRC of Canada and the AES to set some standards or at least some basis for what is good and whats not. Its not a flat response that I would like to achieve but a curve that is considered by most experts as "Ideal", but then of course you can alter it too suit your taste.

I read somewhere that 50% of the sound that you hear is influenced by the quality of your gear and the other 50% is determined by the quality of the acoustics of your room. Even the flattest speakers will sound horrible in a bad room. the interaction of room boundaries and the shape of the room determine the final sound that is heard by our ear. what I will try to achieve is to integrate the room into the system with the use of the existing components available.
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Offline streetsmart

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Re: Alvin's Movieworld 2.40 CIH SETUP (Update 05/19/08)
« Reply #218 on: Jul 21, 2008 at 06:23 PM »
True, that is why we have the NRC of Canada and the AES to set some standards or at least some basis for what is good and whats not. Its not a flat response that I would like to achieve but a curve that is considered by most experts as "Ideal", but then of course you can alter it too suit your taste.

I read somewhere that 50% of the sound that you hear is influenced by the quality of your gear and the other 50% is determined by the quality of the acoustics of your room. Even the flattest speakers will sound horrible in a bad room. the interaction of room boundaries and the shape of the room determine the final sound that is heard by our ear. what I will try to achieve is to integrate the room into the system with the use of the existing components available.

I fully agree.

You might also want to use your multiple-mic set-up. Chris Kyriakakis of Audyssey says that if you do an Audyssey set-up with a single mic position, you will get an absolutely flat curve that would blow your mind away (his words), but it doesn't sound good. That's why their philosophy is to have multiple mic readings around the main listening position and produce a curve that is not flat but does consider the effect of the room itself.
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Offline alvinthx2

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Re: Alvin's Movieworld 2.40 CIH SETUP (Update 07/21/08)
« Reply #219 on: Jul 21, 2008 at 07:43 PM »
Posted some new pictures ;D
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Offline iiinas

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Re: Alvin's Movieworld 2.40 CIH SETUP (Update 07/21/08)
« Reply #220 on: Jul 21, 2008 at 08:25 PM »
Posted some new pictures ;D

mukhang monster nga yung esoteric sir alvin, nice! congrats!

btw, i noticed that you placed your apple tv and popcorn on top of your power amps, (tama po ba ako?), if so, dont the power amps get hot hindi kaya baka ma-fry yung mga chips ng apple tv nyo and popcorn?
« Last Edit: Jul 21, 2008 at 08:40 PM by iiinaslao »

Offline streetsmart

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Re: Alvin's Movieworld 2.40 CIH SETUP (Update 07/21/08)
« Reply #221 on: Jul 21, 2008 at 08:30 PM »
Posted some new pictures ;D

Hehe. So I guess the membranes worked!  :)

Can you give us some details? Dimensions? Material?

Actually, I am building 3 more 8' bass traps. I hope they make an improvement too.  ;D
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Offline frootloops

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Re: Alvin's Movieworld 2.40 CIH SETUP (Update 05/19/08)
« Reply #222 on: Jul 21, 2008 at 09:50 PM »
Yes nothing special, just a mention. but I was invited to verify Val's audio system using my equipments and have a side by side comparison of an ear-tweaked vs. an instrument-tweaked system in the near future. ;)

Sir Alvin, I think this is a special mention and something to be proud of.  ;)


Quote from Val Villanueva

We were seated comfortably inside Alvin Ong’s acoustically superb home theater watching the DVD concert of The Eagles’ Farewell 1 Tour - Live From Melbourne. Now, Alvin (a.k.a. alvinthx in the videophile fraternity) is known in the home theater community as having one of the best systems there is.

Offline streetsmart

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Re: Alvin's Movieworld 2.40 CIH SETUP (Update 07/21/08)
« Reply #223 on: Jul 22, 2008 at 07:18 AM »
Alvin, curious lang ako. How are you setting brightness, contrast and color sa Popcorn? Right now, I set it by eye and it's not easy.
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Offline alvinthx2

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Re: Alvin's Movieworld 2.40 CIH SETUP (Update 07/21/08)
« Reply #224 on: Jul 22, 2008 at 07:49 AM »
Alvin, curious lang ako. How are you setting brightness, contrast and color sa Popcorn? Right now, I set it by eye and it's not easy.

since I have adequate brightness and a respectable black level. I don't do much adjustments with the 2 controls. Maybe I should download some test patterns from the NET and upload them to the HDisk of the PH and start from there.
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Offline alvinthx2

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Re: Alvin's Movieworld 2.40 CIH SETUP (Update 05/19/08)
« Reply #225 on: Jul 22, 2008 at 07:59 AM »
Sir Alvin, I think this is a special mention and something to be proud of.  ;)


Quote from Val Villanueva

We were seated comfortably inside Alvin Ong’s acoustically superb home theater watching the DVD concert of The Eagles’ Farewell 1 Tour - Live From Melbourne. Now, Alvin (a.k.a. alvinthx in the videophile fraternity) is known in the home theater community as having one of the best systems there is.

Ya, short but right on the money. there was really not much time to do a critical listen, because we always are talking to each other. We compared the Hell freezes over dts and Farewell 1 HD-dvd and it took a great amount of time just talking about the Eagles.
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Offline alvinthx2

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Re: Alvin's Movieworld 2.40 CIH SETUP (Update 07/21/08)
« Reply #226 on: Jul 22, 2008 at 08:02 AM »
mukhang monster nga yung esoteric sir alvin, nice! congrats!

btw, i noticed that you placed your apple tv and popcorn on top of your power amps, (tama po ba ako?), if so, dont the power amps get hot hindi kaya baka ma-fry yung mga chips ng apple tv nyo and popcorn?

I have no other place to put them. My amps run so cool (even at loud passages) that the popcorn hour and the apple tv runs 3x as hot. Its like having my amps serving as the heatsink of these devices ;D
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Offline alvinthx2

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Re: Alvin's Movieworld 2.40 CIH SETUP (Update 07/21/08)
« Reply #227 on: Jul 22, 2008 at 08:07 AM »
Hehe. So I guess the membranes worked!  :)

Can you give us some details? Dimensions? Material?

Actually, I am building 3 more 8' bass traps. I hope they make an improvement too.  ;D

They are 2'x4'x7.25". sides and back 1/2" plywood and 1/8" plywood as the membrane resonator. Inside 4x 2" 48kg/m3 fiberglass. fiberglass is compressed inside the box. BBC design is just 2'x2' centered at 63 hertz, mine has a greater surface area and a lower resonant frequency therefore I suspect they are actually absorbing 50 hertz.
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Re: Alvin's Movieworld 2.40 CIH SETUP (Update 07/21/08)
« Reply #228 on: Jul 22, 2008 at 11:02 AM »
They are 2'x4'x7.25". sides and back 1/2" plywood and 1/8" plywood as the membrane resonator. Inside 4x 2" 48kg/m3 fiberglass. fiberglass is compressed inside the box. BBC design is just 2'x2' centered at 63 hertz, mine has a greater surface area and a lower resonant frequency therefore I suspect they are actually absorbing 50 hertz.

Simple lang ang design. How do you find it? Did you check the RTA of the ARC for the before and after conditions? D ba dapat lumabas dun if the curve became flatter after the traps were installed? How does it sound?
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Offline iiinas

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Re: Alvin's Movieworld 2.40 CIH SETUP (Update 07/21/08)
« Reply #229 on: Jul 22, 2008 at 11:14 AM »
I have no other place to put them. My amps run so cool (even at loud passages) that the popcorn hour and the apple tv runs 3x as hot. Its like having my amps serving as the heatsink of these devices ;D

hehehe, iba talaga pag sosyal at top of the line ang amp, malamig. ang laking heat sink sir!  ;D

Offline alvinthx2

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Re: Alvin's Movieworld 2.40 CIH SETUP (Update 07/21/08)
« Reply #230 on: Jul 22, 2008 at 12:20 PM »
Simple lang ang design. How do you find it? Did you check the RTA of the ARC for the before and after conditions? D ba dapat lumabas dun if the curve became flatter after the traps were installed? How does it sound?

I still cannot verify if there is indeed a significant change in low frequency ringing because the equipment that I have, needs a special wire to make RT60 measurements down to 31 hertz. They have been very uncooperative as they don't answer email inquiries. Maybe because I got the equipment second hand, anyway, I would conclude that they are indeed effective as you can feel the membrane vibrate at low freq. Just don't know at what specific value.

Maybe gumanda nang konte, nothing dramatic as the room was already good before.
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Re: Alvin's Movieworld 2.40 CIH SETUP (Update 07/21/08)
« Reply #231 on: Jul 22, 2008 at 12:29 PM »
hehehe, iba talaga pag sosyal at top of the line ang amp, malamig. ang laking heat sink sir!  ;D

Yes, plus factor for good amps. You can't say that for receivers, masyadong mainit especially when they are in a closed cabinet. Heat is a major factor in equipment breakdown, kaya siguro mas matibay ang mga high powered amps :D
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Offline Panmunjom

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Re: Alvin's Movieworld 2.40 CIH SETUP (Update 07/21/08)
« Reply #232 on: Jul 22, 2008 at 12:45 PM »
kasanting na, koyang! ang galing boss Alvin!!  :D

Offline streetsmart

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Re: Alvin's Movieworld 2.40 CIH SETUP (Update 07/21/08)
« Reply #233 on: Jul 22, 2008 at 04:13 PM »
Yes, plus factor for good amps. You can't say that for receivers, masyadong mainit especially when they are in a closed cabinet. Heat is a major factor in equipment breakdown, kaya siguro mas matibay ang mga high powered amps :D

In my experience, true but not always true. My Aragon 8008BB is a very high powered amp. Very conservative 200 wpc but it can actually go much higher. Problem is that it runs so hot you can cook an egg on it. I think its because it is a Class AB amp.
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Re: Alvin's Movieworld 2.40 CIH SETUP (Update 07/21/08)
« Reply #234 on: Jul 22, 2008 at 04:18 PM »
In my experience, true but not always true. My Aragon 8008BB is a very high powered amp. Very conservative 200 wpc but it can actually go much higher. Problem is that it runs so hot you can cook an egg on it. I think its because it is a Class AB amp.

what do you mean by class ab sir mark?

Offline alvinthx2

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Re: Alvin's Movieworld 2.40 CIH SETUP (Update 07/21/08)
« Reply #235 on: Jul 22, 2008 at 05:25 PM »
kasanting na, koyang! ang galing boss Alvin!!  :D

Thanks, nokarin ka? (kapampangan for "where are you?")
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Re: Alvin's Movieworld 2.40 CIH SETUP (Update 07/21/08)
« Reply #236 on: Jul 22, 2008 at 05:32 PM »
In my experience, true but not always true. My Aragon 8008BB is a very high powered amp. Very conservative 200 wpc but it can actually go much higher. Problem is that it runs so hot you can cook an egg on it. I think its because it is a Class AB amp.

Class A amps run hotter than Class AB because the power transistors are always on, it is  the most inefficient design, class AB on the other hand share the load between 2 transistors (push pull) and are much more efficient. the most efficient design (that I know of) is class D (D does not stand for digital), there are the design used in our newer Sub amps.

Mark you are right, good amps can run hot when the speaker load is quite low and the speakers are inefficient. fortunately for me, my Elac's are rated at 91dB efficiency.
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Re: Alvin's Movieworld 2.40 CIH SETUP (Update 07/21/08)
« Reply #237 on: Jul 22, 2008 at 06:10 PM »
what do you mean by class ab sir mark?

I really don't know the gory technical details but its something like this:

Class A amps run at full power all of the time. Therefore, they run very hot.

Class B amps run at a power level depending on the volume. The higher the volume, the higher the power. Therefore, they are more efficient and are less hot.

Class AB amps are a composite. The amps run at high constant power up to a certain volume level. Above that level, the amp runs like a Class B amp.

In any case, Alvin pointed out something important which is the efficiency of the speakers. His Elac speakers have a 91 db efficiency. My PSB Stratus front speakers run at 88 db efficiency. The 3 db difference means that for a given SPL, my amp has to have double the power. In other words, my 200 watt amp is equal to his 100 watt amp. My amp needs to work harder and therefore run hotter. In addition, my amp is Class AB and is therefore inherently less efficient.

Which is better? Class A, B or AB? Ahh ... that's a question for Wired State audiophiles.
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Offline iiinas

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Re: Alvin's Movieworld 2.40 CIH SETUP (Update 07/21/08)
« Reply #238 on: Jul 22, 2008 at 08:13 PM »
I really don't know the gory technical details but its something like this:

Class A amps run at full power all of the time. Therefore, they run very hot.

Class B amps run at a power level depending on the volume. The higher the volume, the higher the power. Therefore, they are more efficient and are less hot.

Class AB amps are a composite. The amps run at high constant power up to a certain volume level. Above that level, the amp runs like a Class B amp.

In any case, Alvin pointed out something important which is the efficiency of the speakers. His Elac speakers have a 91 db efficiency. My PSB Stratus front speakers run at 88 db efficiency. The 3 db difference means that for a given SPL, my amp has to have double the power. In other words, my 200 watt amp is equal to his 100 watt amp. My amp needs to work harder and therefore run hotter. In addition, my amp is Class AB and is therefore inherently less efficient.

Which is better? Class A, B or AB? Ahh ... that's a question for Wired State audiophiles.

ah ok. thanks for the lesson sir mark.  ;D

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Re: Alvin's Movieworld 2.40 CIH SETUP (Update 07/21/08)
« Reply #239 on: Aug 03, 2008 at 11:38 PM »
Thanks, nokarin ka? (kapampangan for "where are you?")

Im from Bataan. But my Grandfather is from Betis, Guagua. Im a big fan of your and Munkies' HT. Hope to meet you soon.  :D