Author Topic: The War Begins... (Read 107302 times)

akyatbundok · « **Reply #240 on:** Sep 19, 2006 at 11:37 AM »

while hardware manufacturers are working on the universal player route, here's an alternative point-of-view from content producers:

Warner is working on a universal disk that has both formats in different layers, so it can be played on both a BD and HD-DVD player...... although it will cost more than pressing either format, its still cheaper than pressing both formats for every movie release.

format wars make life more complicated for everybody.

MAtZTER · « **Reply #241 on:** Sep 19, 2006 at 12:09 PM »

Quote from: av_phile1 on Sep 15, 2006 at 04:23 PM

Just FYI, there are now 3 variants of the DTS codecs to be used in both Bluray and HD-DVD.

http://www.dtsonline.com/dts-hd/dts-on-bluray-and-hddvd.php

DTS-Encore
Rebadged old DTS but using maximum bitrates at a CONSTANT 1.5mbps on compressed LOSSY format.

DTS-HD
High Defintion DTS at CONSTANT bitrate of 6mbps for Bluray and 3mbps on HD-DVD that can deliver 7.1 channels at 96/24 using compressed LOSSLESS codec

DTS-HD Master Audio
High Defintion DTS at VARIABLE bitrate up to 24.5mbps for Bluray and 18mbps on HD-DVD that can deliver 7.1 channels at 96/24 using compressed LOSSLESS codec - virtually indistinguishable from original audio masters.

OTH, DolbyTrueHD is said to be similar to DTS-HD Master Audio with a variable bit rate up to 18mbps on both formats using MLP - same lossless compression codec used for DVD-A.

Just for reference, the CD uses a constant bit rate of 1.1mbps of uncompressed data for 2 channels.

The typical DTS tracks on SD DVDs use LOSSY compression at a constant bitrate of 768kbps or 0.77mbps for 5.1 channels.

The typical DD tracks on SD DVD use LOSSY compression at a variable bitrate averaging 384 kbps to 448kbps max for 5.1 channels.

If people are generally happy with the CD and the DTS tracks on their DVDs, wait til they hear what the DolbyTrueHD and DTS-HD Master Audio for HD-DVD can do. It seems that both formats today represent the pinnacle of digital audio fidelity for both BD and HD-DVD.

With these new technologies, maybe another audio format war....HD-DVD audio or Super BR-CD or whatever...

Munskie · « **Reply #242 on:** Sep 19, 2006 at 01:45 PM »

An investigative report by the reviewers of ProjectorCentral.com on what is truly happening on the battlefront: on the displays of US Retailers.....see how dirty the Propaganda is.....The Format Wars is truly ragin on...

The Retailing of HD-DVD and Blu-ray (click)

av_phile1 · « **Reply #243 on:** Sep 19, 2006 at 02:48 PM »

Quote from: akyatbundok on Sep 19, 2006 at 11:37 AM

Warner is working on a universal disk that has both formats in different layers, so it can be played on both a BD and HD-DVD player...... although it will cost more than pressing either format, its still cheaper than pressing both formats for every movie release.

format wars make life more complicated for everybody.

That's quite interesting. Do you have a press release link I can visit and read more about? Thanks.

av_phile1 · « **Reply #244 on:** Sep 19, 2006 at 03:27 PM »

Quote from: MAtZTER on Sep 19, 2006 at 12:09 PM

With these new technologies, maybe another audio format war....HD-DVD audio or Super BR-CD or whatever...

Curiously enough, no such thing in the works. IF ever there'd be one, it would just be a extention of the DD vs DTS sort to which we all know the answer. This time, DolbyTrueHD and DTS-HD Master Audio are quite close that they'd be natural for an audio format war. But so far the industry is not abuzz with any such.

av_phile1 · « **Reply #245 on:** Sep 19, 2006 at 03:37 PM »

Quote from: Munskie on Sep 19, 2006 at 01:45 PM

An investigative report by the reviewers of ProjectorCentral.com on what is truly happening on the battlefront: on the displays of US Retailers.....see how dirty the Propaganda is.....The Format Wars is truly ragin on...

The Retailing of HD-DVD and Blu-ray (click)

This site has been discussed in other AV forums as well. And it is clear that salesfloor guys have a better incentive to push for a higher priced higher yielding product like a BD player which typicaly hovers around $1,000. The sad thing about this is that they dish out misinformation about the two formats at the expense of practical home HD use. While BD is superior in storage, it has no advantage whatsover in practical HT use. While the BD players output in 1080p, it again has no practical advantage as far as the final resolution on a progressive HDTV display is concerned. You only need to listen to the people who are early adopters of both formats to know which camp delivered and which disappointed the market. As always, never bank on salespeople to get the facts straight.

av_phile1 · « **Reply #246 on:** Sep 19, 2006 at 11:37 PM »

Quote from: akyatbundok on Sep 19, 2006 at 11:37 AM

while hardware manufacturers are working on the universal player route, here's an alternative point-of-view from content producers:

Warner is working on a universal disk that has both formats in different layers, so it can be played on both a BD and HD-DVD player...... although it will cost more than pressing either format, its still cheaper than pressing both formats for every movie release.

format wars make life more complicated for everybody.

Ok I just got the article on this here
http://www.newscientisttech.com/arti...ine-news_rss20

Munskie · « **Reply #247 on:** Sep 20, 2006 at 08:02 PM »

look what the format war has done...T3...rise of the Machines is only availbale on HD DVD...while the first two Terminators are available soon only in Blu-Ray. Only in hollywood, the Terminator series spanned three studios, two formats...and us, the consumers, caught in between...

av_phile1 · « **Reply #248 on:** Sep 20, 2006 at 08:31 PM »

Don't worry, when the PS3 gets released with the BD drive.....$599

Munskie · « **Reply #249 on:** Sep 20, 2006 at 10:09 PM »

I would have been more happy if studios cross the line, but I wouldnt mind getting that PS3 if the price goes down coz gamer din naman ako, though im playing just madden lately....

av_phile1 · « **Reply #250 on:** Sep 21, 2006 at 11:30 AM »

I think that same dilemna was aired in another forum and one HD early adopter said: Just get both players. I guess in Europe and in the US, that's really a non-issue. But here, it could be, especially for those still paying deferred payments on their Bravias and Aquos.

I have foreseen something like this, but didn't think much about it as I am sure it will affect very few titles. Most series and sequels come from just one studio. And if I had an HDTV, I would get both - HD-DVD first for the great value that the Tosh A1 has, then get a Blurry player later when it gets better value.

But just for the record, if you ask me, I prefer to see Blurry eat dust.

barrid · « **Reply #251 on:** Sep 22, 2006 at 11:50 AM »

Are foreign countries planning to release their movies in HD format too?

av_phile1 · « **Reply #252 on:** Sep 22, 2006 at 02:30 PM »

Quote from: •ßã®®¡D• on Sep 22, 2006 at 11:50 AM

Are foreign countries planning to release their movies in HD format too?

If any other country at this time is capable of releasing thier movies in HD other than the US, it would be Japan. I haven't looked into them with any seriousness but I read one poster in another forum say that the titles released locally in Japan were not as impressive as those released by hollywood in terms of PQ. I think they were talking about a Jap release of a foreign movie at that.

Next should be India with a total output greater than Hollywood. HD has yet to be introduced in Europe so I don't know if those Italian and British moviehouses have started. Then China and Hongkong. But no internet news about their progress in HD.

Take a look here for the titles available and soon to be released:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_HD_DVD_releases

Munskie · « **Reply #253 on:** Sep 22, 2006 at 04:39 PM »

This just in......

It's a bird, it's a plane, it's... 'Superman Returns' on Blu-ray, HD DVD (click)

both will be released in HD DVD and Blu-Ray....with the former being a combo HD/SD disc....this is pretty exciting!!

av_phile1 · « **Reply #254 on:** Sep 22, 2006 at 05:05 PM »

At $40 excludng shipping, its combination HD and SD makes it $5 pricier than the BD release and the 2-disc SE regular DVD release I would love to get this one instead of the regular 2 disc SD DVD. It will play on any regular DVD player for the SD side and give me incentive to go HD. This sort of reminds me of my SACD buying days - getting hybrid SACD titles and playing the CD layer while planning to get a universal player.

Munskie · « **Reply #255 on:** Sep 22, 2006 at 05:27 PM »

the anticipation heats up....which leads me to consider selling other titles in my DVD collection....im thinking they would still command fair value today.....and would certainly help in financing HD titles purchases....

Clondalkin · « **Reply #256 on:** Sep 22, 2006 at 05:36 PM »

Quote from: av_phile1 on Sep 22, 2006 at 02:30 PM

I haven't looked into them with any seriousness but I read one poster in another forum say that the titles released locally in Japan were not as impressive as those released by hollywood in terms of PQ. I think they were talking about a Jap release of a foreign movie at that.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_HD_DVD_releases

Probably those are Japanese movies/titles in the first place. It seems that cameras for film-making are still the forte of American makers and Hollywood, while cams for any other kind of video stuff are mostly Japanese. As far as my experience with Japanese made tapes, CDs, DVDs, and SACDS, I think they, at the very least, match the US made ones, and in many cases, richer in features and better in sound...kaya nga grabe ang mahal.

av_phile1 · « **Reply #257 on:** Sep 22, 2006 at 05:37 PM »

Quote from: Munskie on Sep 22, 2006 at 05:27 PM

the anticipation heats up....which leads me to consider selling other titles in my DVD collection....im thinking they would still command fair value today.....and would certainly help in financing HD titles purchases....

Thinking about the same thing. Better now than later. But let's wait until mid next year to see how things go. Pero sa totoo lang. Wala na akong gana manood ng DVD. HD na talaga. Really praying hard to win the lotto.

Munskie · « **Reply #258 on:** Sep 22, 2006 at 05:40 PM »

Quote from: av_phile1 on Sep 22, 2006 at 05:37 PM

Really praying hard to win the lotto.

im just glad theres paylite...

ill be browsing my DVD collection and select which has to go....

av_phile1 · « **Reply #259 on:** Sep 22, 2006 at 05:46 PM »

Quote from: Clondalkin on Sep 22, 2006 at 05:36 PM

Probably those are Japanese movies/titles in the first place. It seems that cameras for film-making are still the forte of American makers and Hollywood, while cams for any other kind of video stuff are mostly Japanese. As far as my experience with Japanese made tapes, CDs, DVDs, and SACDS, I think they, at the very least, match the US made ones, and in many cases, richer in features and better in sound...kaya nga grabe ang mahal.

Actually, soome recent hollywood blockbusters no longer use film. They are using those superHD digital cams, forgot the resolution I think 4X 1080p. If not mistaken, Star Wars Attack of the Clones and Revenge of the Sith were shot enitrely in digital high def. Not film.

Clondalkin · « **Reply #260 on:** Sep 22, 2006 at 05:46 PM »

Quote from: av_phile1 on Sep 22, 2006 at 05:37 PM

Pero sa totoo lang. Wala na akong gana manood ng DVD. HD na talaga. Really praying hard to win the lotto.

If the content is the same Bro. My case, I would rather watch clear p*r*t*d hollywood movies than sumo wrestling, or the mountains and the trees and the flowers and the bees in full HD.

Clondalkin · « **Reply #261 on:** Sep 22, 2006 at 05:51 PM »

Quote from: av_phile1 on Sep 22, 2006 at 05:46 PM

Actually, soome recent hollywood blockbusters no longer use film. They are using those superHD digital cams, forgot the resolution I think 4X 1080p. If not mistaken, Star Wars Attack of the Clones and Revenge of the Sith were shot enitrely in digital high def. Not film.

dapat pala di ko nalang pinalitan yung una kong word na movie-making...he he he....anyway, I really can't understand why the Japanese can't make movies that look like "hollywood" stuff in terms of image quality, although the storylines are some of the most imaginative I've ever watched.

av_phile1 · « **Reply #262 on:** Sep 22, 2006 at 06:13 PM »

Quote from: Clondalkin on Sep 22, 2006 at 05:46 PM

If the content is the same Bro. My case, I would rather watch clear p*r*t*d hollywood movies than sumo wrestling, or the mountains and the trees and the flowers and the bees in full HD.

Well, if i just want to see a so-so movie, maybe that will do. And to be honest, if and when I get into HD, I'd be more selective and disicplined (i hope).

When I first went into DVDs, I also started with pirated stuff and then moved on to origs especially during SALE periods. Within a year, I had collected more than 200 orig titles and twice that in pirated discs. I would even plunk in deposits for advance orders. Sillly of me. And then later, even when I started cutting back, any title na matipuhan basta SALE. This time, I'd get only those worth keeping and watching again. I really don't want to have anymore shelf-load of titles whose repeat-viewing is virtually ZERO. And I think I can count with my fingers those that will go High Def. Even with new movies.

Clondalkin · « **Reply #263 on:** Sep 22, 2006 at 06:36 PM »

Thank god for DVD rental shops, they allowed me to be extremely selective with my DVD purchases. Don't have 200 titles in my collection, not even 100, but I got the ones my family and I really really wanted. Ang nakakatuwa pa non, my daughter grew up watching her DVD collections like 10x over each. Sulit na sulit.

av_phile1 · « **Reply #264 on:** Sep 22, 2006 at 07:19 PM »

True, about the only DVD titles in my collection that have enjoyed repeat viewings were those Jurrasic Park series, Toy Story and all those Pixar and Disney animation that my son kept watching over and over. Apart from Saving Private Ryan.

The problem with rental shops, especially here in Manila, is that they are soooo late in adopting to new formats. Video City I think started renting out DVDs only in 2003 and with so few titles. And now with the new HD format, I would love to rent na lang. But if it took Video City all 6 years before renting DVDs out, I would think they'll start renting out HD titles in 2012 pa.

Clondalkin · « **Reply #265 on:** Sep 22, 2006 at 10:05 PM »

PS3 price cut to around $400 in Japan. This war is getting more interesting. NO to region coding..he he

barrid · « **Reply #266 on:** Sep 23, 2006 at 06:07 AM »

Kung sa Tokyo yan, puwede mo ba akong samahan para makapag decide na ako bumili ng HD player. Next month pa naman kung sakali lang.

av_phile1 · « **Reply #267 on:** Sep 23, 2006 at 06:48 AM »

I think November pa release ng PS3 sa Japan.

barrid · « **Reply #268 on:** Sep 23, 2006 at 08:09 AM »

Grrrr!!!!!! Nagkamali pala ako ng intindi. Sorry po. Bitin na naman ang desisyon ko.

Thanks for quick reply!

krazy · « **Reply #269 on:** Sep 23, 2006 at 07:32 PM »

looks like Sony did the right thing by including HDMI on the cheaper (20Gb) PS3 model after all:
http://www.gamespot.com/events/tgs2006/story.html?sid=6158155 At only about US$429, looks like the war is getting more interesting;)