Topic: PANASONIC C-Series (42/50C10) Impressions

[E-reply]

Panasonic plasma TV available at Sights and Sounds 4th level Shangrila Plaza:

50c10 at cash P85K 5 units left

We provide FREE Spyder TV calibration for TV purchased from us.

Why Calibration?
To rely on a pre-set picture setting is a hit or miss affair.  To get the right picture, we use Spyder TV calibrator.

Most TV sets are shipped out from the factory with color, brightness and contrast turned up too high.  This creates unnatural pictures, plus of course, it could shorten the picture tube lifespan.  Using the Spyder calibration, we will be able to adjust your modestly priced TV into much detailed look and prolong your TV set’s life than a much more expensive set that has not been adjusted.

[barrister]

Is there any shop that has the 50C10 on display?

This afternoon, I went to Sights & Sounds and Listening in Style at Shang, then to Theaterworks Trinoma.  None of them had the 50C10 on display.

[STI Edge]

tried all settings to set to 40 and all normal (contrast, brightness  etc.) since am still breaking-in the unit with my egreat. Never thought that the piq would be vibrant even at these settings. It maybe it's just me pero thumbs up ako sa unit na to!

[ninjababez®]

Is there any shop that has the 50C10 on display?

This afternoon, I went to Sights & Sounds and Listening in Style at Shang, then to Theaterworks Trinoma.  None of them had the 50C10 on display.

wow bro, jumping to 50" ? 
i have no plans for upgrade this year but if you do, ill follow  (prolly by december '09)

[barrister]

Hello People,

If you were to choose between 42c10 and 42PV80, what will you choose?

Thanks!

For me, the dealbreaker would be image retention. 

The PV series is confirmed to be prone to image retention, although members have reported that some specific units are less prone than others.   

The C10 series might be more IR-resistant, but the model is so new that there are no IR-related comments yet.

wow bro, jumping to 50" ? 
i have no plans for upgrade this year but if you do, ill follow  (prolly by december '09)

Lagi kasing kinakamusta ng in-law ko kung binebenta ko na raw ang old TV ko.    Sabi ko, benta ko sa kanya pag may nagustuhan akong 50-inch na bago.

OK yata ang G10, but I lost interest nung nalaman kong may exhaust fans pala.

Next, pinag-isipan ko ang S10, but I also lost interest after boss Carlo's comments.  Ang lumalabas ay malabo yata ang image ng SD DVD sa 1080p sets.

Next, 50X10 naman kaya.  Hindi 1080p native ito; 1366 x 768 lang.  Pero wala pang available, e.

50C10 na lang kaya?  Available na, pero wala naman akong makitang display set na puwedeng pang-audition.

50PV80 na lang kaya?     Kaya lang, takot ako e ... IR-prone daw ang 11th generation 2008 series.   

[kalash]

Sa naexperience ko sa PV series namin, burn in prone siya but not to the extent na IR. Hopefully di mangyari ang IR sa unit namin.

[chris69ners]

Sa naexperience ko sa PV series namin, burn in prone siya but not to the extent na IR. Hopefully di mangyari ang IR sa unit namin.

Sir, mas worse ang burn in (permanent), ang IR (temporary lang)...

[kalash]

Sir, mas worse ang burn in (permanent), ang IR (temporary lang)...

oh sorry, got confused between the two. May IR pa rin ang PV series even after the break in period sa unit. So is this issue really much less with the new gen models?

[barrister]

Sir, mas worse ang burn in (permanent), ang IR (temporary lang)...

That's right.  For the 2008 models, there are no burn-in problems, but IR is still an issue.

oh sorry, got confused between the two. May IR pa rin ang PV series even after the break in period sa unit. So is this issue really much less with the new gen models?

We don't know yet, sir.  We're still waiting for user comments for the 2009 12th gen models.

It will take some time before the comments come in, since there are very few owners as of now.

[james16]

Is there any shop that has the 50C10 on display?

This afternoon, I went to Sights & Sounds and Listening in Style at Shang, then to Theaterworks Trinoma.  None of them had the 50C10 on display.

I saw the 50C10 on display sa SM makati po, katabi nya yung 50pv80, 42s10 at 42lz80

[barrister]

Thanks!

[james16]

your welcome

[chris69ners]

When comparing reflectivity, look at the sharpness and brightness of the reflected image.

Yes, I think they're not very effective.  Reflectivity reduction is very slight, yet side-effects are visible. 

On the PV8, users usually see the cross-hatch pattern only when the TV is off.  But I've read one foreign forum post saying that he sometimes sees cross-hatch patterns while the TV is on, but only during very dark scenes. 



My 2006 EDTV is very reflective.

In fact, the reflections are so bad that I initially thought there was no anti reflective coating at all.

But I suspected there was a small amount of AR because I noticed that the ambient reflections on the wall clock hanging above my TV was much worse.  On the wall clock, reflections are very sharp; on the TV, reflections are more diffuse and blurred.

I confirmed the presence of AR when I googled for additional descriptions.  For example, the following linked page says, "Features: Video noise reduction, Q-link, anti-reflection coating, Real MACH system, Real Black Drive System ".
http://www.dooyoo.co.uk/plasma-tv/panasonic-th-42pa60/

The good part is that my screen has absolutely no cross-hatch patterns.



Bosing, I'm now seriously considering a 50C10. 

Ako rin sir barrister. Parang 50C10 na yata ang target kong pang upgrade sa PV70 ko. I was considering the 50S10 sana since full hd na but upon getting the price quote, its way too expensive compared to the 50C10. Like you I only watch dvds and cable but no hd stuff yet, and according to Carlo picture was not impressive when playing dvds on his S10. So now ipon mode muna and maybe before xmas makabili na din.

[kalash]

Just seen this model awhile ago beside a PV80 and it is truly reflective but the good thing is it gives a glossy effect to the picture. So if you intend to place it in a brightly lit room maybe this model is not for you.

[chris69ners]

I think it will be fine in my case bacause our living room is not really well lit. In my current setup, the windows with curtains are located on the right side and not directly in front of the tv screen so there are only minimal reflections.

[Invinciible]

i know this doesn't sound like a very bright idea, but i've been trying very very hard to produce image-retention, through ps3 gaming and watching with my egreat m34a (black bars).  and i have, as of yet, been unable to do so. none whatsoever.  i did go through the 100-hour burn in ritual before attempting this of course.

a bummer for me is that i have realized that my eyes are apparently very sensitive to the infamous green phospors. i see them floating around even when the screen is blank/empty and all black   i know it sounds crazy, and maybe it's something else.  believe me i would welcome it being the latter case.    all i know is i see small green dots and trails when i'm standing 5 feet in...

[barrister]

i know this doesn't sound like a very bright idea, but i've been trying very very hard to produce image-retention, through ps3 gaming and watching with my egreat m34a (black bars).  and i have, as of yet, been unable to do so. none whatsoever.  i did go through the 100-hour burn in ritual before attempting this of course.

You have a 42C10?  That's very useful information, sir.  I'm sure sir kalash appreciates the info too.

a bummer for me is that i have realized that my eyes are apparently very sensitive to the infamous green phospors. i see them floating around even when the screen is blank/empty and all black

OK lang yan, sir.  You'll get used to it after some time.

Pag tumagal yan, parang hindi mo na rin napapansin.  And on the very few instances when you do notice, you won't mind it very much anymore.

I'm actually glad that more members are now noticing phosphor lag.  2 years ago, I was the only one mentioning it, and my phosphor lag posts came and went without any comments from other members.

Other users in foreign forums have suggested that phosphor lag decreases as the unit gets more and more broken-in.  But I don't buy it.  Nasanay lang ang mata nila, pero hindi naman talaga nabawasan ang phosphor lag. 
 
In my case, I won't buy a higher-end plasma until after they resolve the phosphor lag issue.

[barrister]

I think it will be fine in my case bacause our living room is not really well lit. In my current setup, the windows with curtains are located on the right side and not directly in front of the tv screen so there are only minimal reflections.

Ok lang ang walang AR (anti-reflective) coating.  May problema rin yata pag may AR coating.

On 2008 models, some users notice faint cross-hatch lines. 

On the 50x1 (U.S. 2009), CNet editor David Katzmaier noticed faint diagonal lines:

"From seating distances closer than about 10 feet, we could make out a pattern of very faint, grayish diagonal lines that ran from the upper left to the lower right of the screen.

"...We described what we saw to Panasonic, and the company's engineer said he would get back to us with an explanation. Panasonic did send us a second TC-P50X1 when we asked for it, to make sure that the issue wasn't confined to our particular review sample. Both looked basically the same, and both showed the lines. No adjustment we could make eliminated the issue. "

http://reviews.cnet.com/flat-panel-tvs/panasonic-tc-p50x1/4505-6482_7-33490593.html

Nobody knows what's causing it, but it has been suggested that it's a side-effect of the AR coating.  It might depend on the way the ambient light falls on the screen, and/or the sensitivity of the user's eyes.

However, Panasonic has a different explanation (as quoted by Katzmaier):

Updated on May 28, 2009: The company got back to us with an explanation: "[Panasonic is] aware of the issue, but currently there is nothing that can be done to alleviate the lines. It is thought to be interference between the panel and front glass. At this time, a fix or software update to correct the phenomenon of the diagonal lines is not available. Engineers in Japan are continuing to study the phenomenon and investigate possible solutions and/or countermeasures."

[Invinciible]

You have a 42C10?  That's very useful information, sir.  I'm sure sir kalash appreciates the info too.



OK lang yan, sir.  You'll get used to it after some time.

Pag tumagal yan, parang hindi mo na rin napapansin.  And on the very few instances when you do notice, you won't mind it very much anymore.

I'm actually glad that more members are now noticing phosphor lag.  2 years ago, I was the only one mentioning it, and my phosphor lag posts came and went without any comments from other members.

Other users in foreign forums have suggested that phosphor lag decreases as the unit gets more and more broken-in.  But I don't buy it.  Nasanay lang ang mata nila, pero hindi naman talaga nabawasan ang phosphor lag. 
 
In my case, I won't buy a higher-end plasma until after they resolve the phosphor lag issue.

I'm pretty sure I was one if not the first to get a 42pc10 among active posters. 

http://www.pinoydvd.com/index.php?topic=96467.msg1015616#msg1015616

I think I mistakenly attributed the phosphor issues to my egreat m34a, as I posted that it had "grainy" tendencies in the egreat thread... my point is somewhat supported by the fact that one of the more vocal critics of the m34a's grainy pq also used a plasma (pv80) with it.  I agree with you sir, I think it's all a matter of being in the right state of mind.  Ignorance is truly bliss, eh? 

[barrister]

I think I mistakenly attributed the phospor issues to my egreat m34a ...

Ok lang sir.  May pag-asa pa siguro ang phosphor lag issue sa 2009 models.

Sabi ni sir Carlo mas konti na ngayon ang phosphor lag sa 42S10 niya:

Phosphor Lag:

Seems like the S10, with a new panel has the clear advantage here, with those pesky green trails kept to a bare minimum, with the PY800 I could easily see those green ghosts while playing a vicious FPS game on my PS3. With the S10, I could still see it, but with some degree of effort already.

Ignorance is truly bliss, eh? 

Totoo yan.   

[jetro]

a bit OT. Its upgrading time for me, I'll be coming from a 32 inc lcd 1080i samsung.  I am quite impressed with the 42pv80 when I auditioned it.  I heard 42c10 is also good and is now seriously considering it.

Naisip ko lang, since I will be upgrading why not go up a notch to 50 inch. BUT 50c10 is 85K vs 42c10 at 43K, thats almost double the price at 8 inch gain.  I haven't audioned the 50c10 but I am thinking, will the bigger screen justify the 40K++ increase in price?

what are your thoughts on this guys?

[blued888]

If you really want the bigger screen area and money isn't a problem then 50-inchers are the way to go.

Otherwise I'd stick with one or two 42-inchers.

[reynold]

a bit OT. Its upgrading time for me, I'll be coming from a 32 inc lcd 1080i samsung.  I am quite impressed with the 42pv80 when I auditioned it.  I heard 42c10 is also good and is now seriously considering it.

Naisip ko lang, since I will be upgrading why not go up a notch to 50 inch. BUT 50c10 is 85K vs 42c10 at 43K, thats almost double the price at 8 inch gain.  I haven't audioned the 50c10 but I am thinking, will it the bigger screen justifies the 40K++ increase in price?

what are your thoughts on this guys?

If you have the money, then buy that 50 incher, the bigger, the better

[barrister]

I haven't audioned the 50c10 but I am thinking, will the bigger screen justify the 40K++ increase in price?

what are your thoughts on this guys?

No, the P40K+ price is not justified.  For a mere 20% increase in diagonal size, you have to pay 100% more.

I suspect that for 50-inchers and higher models, mark-up is higher than for the low-end 42.

If you want the best value for your money, get the lowest-end 42-incher.  Maliit na lang siguro ang kinikita nila para sa ganyang model.

I asked about the 50C10 at Ansons Landmark.  Around P90K+.  I asked for a price-match at P85K.  Ok daw at P85K, basta cash.  Then I asked if they can price-match the 42C10 at P43K.  Hindi daw kaya, kahit cash pa.  

Pero wala namang masama sa ganoong pricing.  Legitimate marketing and pricing strategy lang yan.

[E-reply]

Is there any shop that has the 50C10 on display?

This afternoon, I went to Sights & Sounds and Listening in Style at Shang, then to Theaterworks Trinoma.  None of them had the 50C10 on display.

Hello Sir, we still have not displayed the new 50C10 because of many units of TH50PV80, which we need to liquidate and dispose.

You should have ask the staff to show you the 50C10. We have around 6 units 50C10 that are kept in adjacent shop Paradigm Showroom. My staff can direct you to the Paradigm Showroom to audition this TV. 

[jetro]

thanks for the reply guys.  i'm in the same line of thinking as barrister, 40K+ increase in price does not justify the 8 inch increase in display size.

looks like its the 42c10 for me. although, I want to audition the 50c10 and see if it will "talk to me"

incidentally, while waiting for my wife last week, I saw a 'last unit' 42pv80 selling at ansons, 49K 18 months zero interest. 

[barrister]

Hello Sir, we still have not displayed the new 50C10 because of many units of TH50PV80, which we need to liquidate and dispose.

You should have ask the staff to show you the 50C10. We have around 6 units 50C10 that are kept in adjacent shop Paradigm Showroom. My staff can direct you to the Paradigm Showroom to audition this TV. 

OK lang sir.  Your staff explained that the 50-incher will not fit in the showroom. 

And when I looked around, your shop is really stocked full!  Totoo naman na hindi na talaga kasya.

[ninjababez®]

Lagi kasing kinakamusta ng in-law ko kung binebenta ko na raw ang old TV ko.    Sabi ko, benta ko sa kanya pag may nagustuhan akong 50-inch na bago.

OK yata ang G10, but I lost interest nung nalaman kong may exhaust fans pala.

Next, pinag-isipan ko ang S10, but I also lost interest after boss Carlo's comments.  Ang lumalabas ay malabo yata ang image ng SD DVD sa 1080p sets.

Next, 50X10 naman kaya.  Hindi 1080p native ito; 1366 x 768 lang.  Pero wala pang available, e.

50C10 na lang kaya?  Available na, pero wala naman akong makitang display set na puwedeng pang-audition.

50PV80 na lang kaya?     Kaya lang, takot ako e ... IR-prone daw ang 11th generation 2008 series.   

ill prolly get a 720p variant if the price difference is over 10k.
regarding IR on 2008 series, i dont know if im just too blind to see it or i just know how to take care of my unit
to be honest, i feel stupid everytime im watching movies with fast pace scene without seeing the phosphor lag; or leaving it on pause for 30 minutes then watching again without noticing any IR.   

[barrister]

regarding IR on 2008 series, i dont know if im just too blind to see it or i just know how to take care of my unit

Suwerte ka siguro sir.  Baka maganda talaga ang unit mo.  Meron talagang PV na sobrang bilis daw magkaroon ng IR, even after a 100-hour break-in.

to be honest, i feel stupid everytime im ... leaving it on pause for 30 minutes then watching again without noticing any IR.   

Pause for 30 minutes?  ...  Scary ... 

Bilib ako sa yo, bosing ... you have nerves of steel! 

[ninjababez®]

Suwerte ka siguro sir.  Baka maganda talaga ang unit mo.  Meron talagang PV na sobrang bilis daw magkaroon ng IR, even after a 100-hour break-in.

remember my 24 hour whitewash burn in procedure 

Pause for 30 minutes?  ...  Scary ... 
Bilib ako sa yo, bosing ... you have nerves of steel! 

yeah bro 30 minutes paused
but after that long pause, i did finish the movie (must be the reason why i dont see it after)
panasonic said it's burn proof anyway (naniwala lang ako sa sinabi nila)