Topic: Toshiba RPTV

[iceman]

I need advice On whether to buy this TV or not. It is a 2 year old Toshiba 55 inch Rear projection TV and the owner is selling it for 100 thousand. Is it a good buy at this price? What are the pros and cons between rear projection TV's and those with picture tubes.

thanks,
 

[technogeek]

First thing you have to see is whether or not it is HDTV ready. Big difference there is with non-HDTV when viewing DVD's (because of line doubling).

[iceman]

Hi technogeek,

If it is not HDTV ready. does it mean that I'm better off using my old TV 32 inch Mitsubishi? By the way the RPTV is a Toshiba Theater Wide 55 inch TV. I haven't checked if it is HDTV ready or not will try to ask the seller tomorrow. But it is a widescreen version not the square type.

[afterglow]

The basic benefit of an RPTV is the size.  CRT displays are limited to 40" but RPTVs go all the way up to 80".  Also, some people consider the image to be more film-like.  
Disadvantages are that it requires more maintenance (convergence and focus), needs some sort of light control (doesn't do well with a lot of ambient light) and is more susceptible to phosphor burn (the burning-in of static images on the screen -- no video games!!).  
That being said, I find RPTVs a better value than CRT displays since it is possible to get a 60" RPTV for around the same price as a 36" CRT.
Toshiba makes some of the best value RPTVs around.  Relatively cheap and the performance is quite good and there are tons of tweaks documented on the web.  It is important to find out if the set is HD-ready since this will determine your upgrade path.  If it is HD-ready, then all you need to get HD is a progressive scan DVD player which will double your resolution.
It is also important to determine what sort of material you plan to watch with your set.  If you plan to watch mostly widescreen material, then the screen format will be perfect since you'll be using most of the screen.  However, if you plan on watching 4x3 material, be prepared to see black areas on the sides of the screen.

[iceman]

Hi Afterglow,

thanks for the info. Now I get it. I think it's not HDTV ready cause the reason he's selling the Tv is that he just bought a new Mitsubishi 65 inch RPTV to match his progressive scan pioneer dvd player. So here is my question. Is it worth buying at 100 thousand pesos?

thanks

[afterglow]

I don't know how much the theater-wides are going for nowadays (especially in the second-hand market)but as a point of comparison, you can get a 60" Toshiba HD-ready 4:3 RPTV brand-new for around PhP150K.
At the PhP100K price point, I doubt it if you'll find anything more than a 50" 4:3 TV brand-new so in that sense the 16:9 is a good buy.  Do understand, however, that your upgrade path is limited without HD and the fact that you are buying used.

[Rak-Rak]

Is it worth buying at 100 thousand pesos?

Mahal!!! :-/, yang 100K, konti na lang makakabili ka na ng 40 inch Toshiba HDTV RPTV na bnew. add 55K sa 100K na yan me 50 inch Toshiba RPTV HDTV na bnew.

[technogeek]

The others have already covered some of my thoughts on this. Let me add a few points though.
Get the model number. It is easy to check the specs at the Tosh website. There is a chance as it is only two years old.
If you are nuts over DVD's, invest in a good 16:9 RPTV. Retain your 4:3 tube for TV watching only.
IMHO,HDTV widescreen with a good DVD player will beat a smaller direct tube TV anytime. You will not experience "theater" viewing in a direct view TV.
Most DVD material are done in enhanced or anamorphic 16:9 format. You will not waste this technology in a square set, where you have ugly black bars. If you strecth it to fill the 4:3, then you will be sacrificing resolution.
Most good RPTV's can be tweaked to perfection! You can't do that with a direct tube. You just have to accept the adjustments the factory gives you in a direct tube. Tweaking is half the fun for a home theater hobbyist.
I also have a 32" tube, and it is still good, at least for TV and VHS. It took me years to be convinced to move into rear projection, but when I watched  a late model widescreen HD Toshiba with progressive scan DVD, there was no turning back. I guess your friend found this out too.
They are right about the prices. You are willing to shell out 100K. Konti na lang, you may be able to afford the 50", which to me is the minimum one should consider for RPTV. But then of course, you will have to consider that since we do not have HD broadcast, then a good DVD player is a must so you can enjoy the full benefits of the widescreen HDTV.
(540 lines x 2 = 1080 lines!) vs. 240 lines in a regular TV broadcast.

[Kups]

I have the 40" Toshiba.  With that price I suggest u get the brand new set.  After 100 hours do a grey scale calibration.

Better get the Toshiba plasma display.  Virtually perfect image reproduction.  No problem in producing black.  Image is like being embossed on the screen

[iceman]

How much is a toshiba plasma display?

[iceman]

Hi technogeek,

If you are nuts over DVD's, invest in a good 16:9 RPTV. Retain your 4:3 tube for TV watching only.

I plan on using it for DVD viewing only.

Most good RPTV's can be tweaked to perfection! You can't do that with a direct tube. You just have to accept the adjustments the factory gives you in a direct tube. Tweaking is half the fun for a home theater hobbyist.

Where can I learn to tweak this TV?

thanks to everyone who posted thier replies to this thread you all have been a very big help to me.

[alfred]

Iceman,

Try out this thread http://Directory of Audio-Video Stores! . there is an ongoing sale at the Listening group (room, style etc.) and also at Image at Harrison Plaza. I think I saw a Tosh for 105T and 109T 43" and 50" respctvly check it out.

[iceman]

Hi Alfred,

would love to check out those TVs but i'm from Cebu.   Baka next time kung makapunta ako sa Maynila.

[technogeek]

The 50 inch Toshiba plasma is awesome, and so is its price, 650,000 pesos. Not practical considering the technology of RPTV's have improved tremendously and are capable anyway of high definition output. 75% of the price of the plasma pays for the technology, as we see when a new generation of products first hit the market.
Where to learn to tweak? from hobbyists, from Calibration DVD's like Video Essentials and AVIA, from the internet, in forums. etc. Service manuals can be had. Calibrators can be hired, and you can pick-up a technique or two; but really, if you buy a Toshiba, a Mitsu, a Pioneer, chances are you will be so awed by image you will say you don't even need to calibrate your TV! But as I say, I am a natural tweaker, so I do it and I get the satisfaction from minute improvements that I accomplish.

[iceman]

The 50 inch Toshiba plasma is awesome, and so is its price, 650,000 pesos. Not practical considering the technology of RPTV's have improved tremendously and are capable anyway of high definition output. 75% of the price of the plasma pays for the technology, as we see when a new generation of products first hit the market.
Where to learn to tweak? from hobbyists, from Calibration DVD's like Video Essentials and AVIA, from the internet, in forums. etc. Service manuals can be had. Calibrators can be hired, and you can pick-up a technique or two; but really, if you buy a Toshiba, a Mitsu, a Pioneer, chances are you will be so awed by image you will say you don't even need to calibrate your TV! But as I say, I am a natural tweaker, so I do it and I get the satisfaction from minute improvements that I accomplish.

I'm also a tweaker myself, but only on audio equipment. Regarding TVs I don't know a thing about tweaking Tvs. Anyway will let everyone here know if ever i decide to buy the TV or not.

thanks

[alfred]

Hi Alfred,

would love to check out those TVs but i'm from Cebu.   Baka next time kung makapunta ako sa Maynila.

NGEK layo naman. Anyway called them up (d2 ako sa office walang magawa) listening... and image, both have no branches sa Cebu sorry

[iceman]

Ngek kawawa naman kaming mga Promdi. Inisnab lang kami sa listening group . Iisa lang ang high end shop dito. More on audio not home theater.  

[comfoosed]

Hi Iceman,

I casually inquired about a 43" HDTV non-widescreen set at Listening Room this morning and was told they were going for about P110K (possibly less 10-15% for a cash buyer).

Being an owner of a non-HD 1.33:1 Tosh RPTV, the improvement in resolution and clarity of an HD set is quite remarkable, especially if this is fed by a progressive dvd player.  I chime in with others who have said that if dvd is your primary viewing use, then the price premium of a widescreen HDTV RPTV/progessive dvd player combo is well justified by the better picture you will enjoy.

I think that P100K for a 2 year old 55" set may be a bit high considering the cost of new and better models.  Also, you would have to consider the condition of the set, primarily determining the extent and nature of its use.  CRT gun life is finite (you can research this on the net) and unlike light bulbs, they just don't break down - they gradually fade out.  Only the owner can tell you how hard the guns have been pushed.  These guns will get a heavier workout if used in well-lit viweing areas, where contrast is maintained at high levels. No amount of tweaking will improve the picture when any of the CRT guns is so affected. Replacing them may still be an affordable proposition (about $300/gun), but calibrating the set to mint condition afterwards may require technical expertise that is hard to find locally.  Also be wary of the seller's possible use of the set as a console gaming monitor.  If used incorrectly, the screen burn-in (like the monitors you see showing flight skeds at the airport) may be irreversible.  Also, if I remember correctly, the Tosh sets come in two model lines:  Theaterview and Cinema - the Cinema series being line-doubled while the other one was not.  This is reflected by a higher price of the Cinema series sets.  While this may be for the standard 1.33:1 sets, I am not sure whether widescreen sets also maintain such distinctions, or if they are relevant at all, given the viewing aspect ratio of the set.  55" is a large screen and any deficiency in resolution would already become very noticeable especially at closer viewing distances.

If I had only P100K now, I'd hold out for a better price or save to buy a new and better model.

[iceman]

Hi comfoosed,

thanks a lot for the very informative reply. After using my last life line " ask the audience". My final answer is I'll go with the audience. I think I'll pass and wait for a better deal or until I have enough money to buy a brand new one.



To everyone who gave their opinions thanks a lot !!!

Moderator paki lock this thread please.

thanks

[alfred]

Wait, wait. Have you tried front projection? My wife and I saw one yesterday at Image Harisson Plaza, Sharpvision selling at P45,000 and P61,000. These babies are good up to 100" not 100 thou so said the salesman. I will request a demo when I return, without my wife of course.  

[iceman]

Hi Alfred,

Will wait for the results of your demo with the front projection.

thanks

[Rak-Rak]

Will wait for the results of your demo with the front projection.

Iceman,
Eh pagdating sa front projection si Senior NEO ang tanungin natin. medyo marami nang na research siya tungkol sa front projection, let's start a new thread kc me mga nakita akng front projetors na mga 75K ang presyo at interesado akng malaman kung ok na ito.

[neo]

Iceman,

1. Personally, I think 100K for a 2 year old RPTV is a bit high.  Check out the specs.  The TV might have component inputs...but these might merely be interlaced component and not progressive component. You're better off saving for a brand new set which can accept a progressive input (480p).  Or you might want to try front projection (more on this later). Check out this link for a discussion on component video signals:

Compone
nt Video

2. Technically speaking, line doubling or progressive scanning does NOT mean doubling the number of lines. Rather it doubles the number of times the 480 lines are painted on the screen during the 1/30 second frame display time (converting to a progressive scanned signal).  However, I've heard (can't confirm though) that some HD RPTVs are able to upconvert regular 480i interlaced signals to a higher resolution. This is not line doubling but more appropriately termed "scaling" as the signal is still interlaced despite increasing the number of scan lines. Check out the following links for more information on progressive scanning:

Progressive Scan

3. A display (TV or projector) does not necessarily have to be HDTV compatible...we do not have HDTV broadcast in the Phils. As long as it has 480p capability, then you'll be able to use it with a progressive scan DVD player or an external line doubler.  In fact, some sets have the line doubling capability built in already. It just so happens that most HDTV sets are also 480p compatible. Check out this link for more info on this subject:

HDT
V, EDTV and SDTV

4. Finally, front projection...is this for you?  The decision will depend on a lot of factors.  There are plenty of pros and cons.  For my HT though, I use a DLP projector (same model as Afterglow's).  This is used almost exclusively for DVD viewing.  For regular programming, I use a 29" direct view set. Some of the advantages compared to RPTVs...small foot print, very portable, much bigger image (90" diagonal widescreen), more cinematic impact, plug and play, no need for elaborate setting up and calibration. Disadvantages...need total ambient lighting control, lamps need to be replaced every 1000-2000 hrs., too costly to use for regular TV viewing (replacement lamps are quite expensive). As for the pj's cost, the price will depend on the model and the features. You could get decent SVGA projectors for about P130K to P150K. The cheaper ones are not as good (low resolution, low light output, poor contrast, etc.).  

During the 2nd marathon, we used my projector for the HT room...we showed what kind of image quality can be produced and how big. I think the people were quite happy naman with what they saw.  Anyway, to compare RPTVs and Front Projectors, check out this link:

Bi
g Screen TVs and Projectors

I guess, that's it for now. Hope this helps.

Cheers - Neo  

[Eric_Samonte (Guest)]

Ayaw gumana yung insert image ko eh. Anyway, I was trying to show how a 4:3 broadcast [DragonBalls Z]would look on a 16:9 set..like the one ur trying to buy. This pic is that of a 2002 Toshiba 65HX81...which is widescreen. (Eto na lang ang link http://communities.msn.com/MgaSamonte/connecticutalbum.msnw?action=ShowPhoto&PhotoID=329 ) But it does a great job in stretching the 4:3 material unlike the older models which really suck. At normal mode mo lang puwedeng panoorin which defeats the purpose of a WS set. Pero kung puro DVD lang rin naman ang paggagamitan mo, OK na rin. Pero tama yung above post, it must be HD ready and accept prog scan to warrant a P100T bill.

[Rak-Rak]

I have an analog direct Samsung 32 inch tv, sanay na ako sa Streach mode niya for 4:3 images, kya ok pa rin yung mga concerts. wala akng problema sa Ambient lighting.  Kaya lang nung dinemo ni Neo yung Front Projector niya sa pader ng bahay ko eh nabighani ako sa laki ng screen!!!
Kailan kaya ako makakabili ng ganyan?

[iceman]

Hi everyone,

Thanks for taking time out to answer my question. I definitely learned a lot about RPTVs and front projectors from this forum. Ok, I will follow your advice and save up for a brand new RPTV or projector which i will try when I get to go on a vacation in Manila. Maybe next year.

thanks a lot guys.  

[levi]

To everyone who gave their opinions thanks a lot !!!

Moderator paki lock this thread please.

thanks

Iceman,

  I dont think we need to lock this thread. It has become very informative for everyone and for new members to come. Lets leave it open  so anybody can continue posting if they have there further inquiries. I hope this thread was able to help you and thanks to everyone who contributed.

Levi

[Rak-Rak]

Iceman,

Tama si Levi, let keep this thread open and lets concentrate sa Widescreen Rear Projection TV tutal me thread na ata of Fron Projection eh.

Rak-Rak

[iceman]

Ok, sorry for being selfish guys. I didn't think about the others who also might learn a lot from the postings. I certainly learned a lot about RPTVs and it helped me make a wise decision.

thanks,

[Rak-Rak]

Sayang we could use the help of electronic depot here. dati kasi medyo serious kami ni esmi dun sa Tohiba 40H80 RPTV nila. kaya lang medyo mabigat yung turn of events sa ating economia.