Author Topic: Picture Calibration (Read 34549 times)

streetsmart · « **Reply #90 on:** Apr 21, 2008 at 04:45 PM »

Quote from: pangke on Apr 21, 2008 at 03:59 PM

sir san po kayo nakakuha ng mga program na pang-calibrate...di ko kasi maramdaman yung pagka-HD nung pana 32lx77 na binili ko e. di ko naman madala ulit sa sights and sounds since malayo pa ko...laguna pa po kasi ako. pls help mga sir...yung po ba avia na program lang kelangan ko? then user friendly ba yun? hoping for your quick and informative replies mga master..thanks!!!

Avia or Video Essentials are both user-friendly. Madali gamitin. Magawa mo ang basic calibration using either software.

oReOsHaKe · « **Reply #91 on:** Apr 21, 2008 at 06:04 PM »

Quote from: pangke on Apr 21, 2008 at 03:59 PM

sir san po kayo nakakuha ng mga program na pang-calibrate...di ko kasi maramdaman yung pagka-HD nung pana 32lx77 na binili ko e. di ko naman madala ulit sa sights and sounds since malayo pa ko...laguna pa po kasi ako. pls help mga sir...yung po ba avia na program lang kelangan ko? then user friendly ba yun? hoping for your quick and informative replies mga master..thanks!!!

You can download Avia and DVE using http://www.youtorrent.com/.

dyerds · « **Reply #92 on:** Apr 21, 2008 at 09:29 PM »

Quote from: pangke on Apr 21, 2008 at 03:59 PM

sir san po kayo nakakuha ng mga program na pang-calibrate...di ko kasi maramdaman yung pagka-HD nung pana 32lx77 na binili ko e. di ko naman madala ulit sa sights and sounds since malayo pa ko...laguna pa po kasi ako. pls help mga sir...yung po ba avia na program lang kelangan ko? then user friendly ba yun? hoping for your quick and informative replies mga master..thanks!!!

Sir if you want to calibrate your tv that should be done where it is located in your house because ligthing on that room will also affect how you calibrate your lcd. You should better call S&S to request for pic calibration because that is one of the services they offer their customers who buy tv from them.

pangke · « **Reply #93 on:** Apr 22, 2008 at 07:37 AM »

i've already contacted sir vic and he said he will PM me the settings since they don't do calibration outside manila...that would be good for the time being so i'll still download the avia and dve...hehe.
thanks for the replies mga master.

avia at dve lang po ba kailangan ko..as in software lang at wala ng iba kailangang hardware...? TIA

mrm · « **Reply #94 on:** Apr 24, 2008 at 10:21 PM »

Quote from: Flood on Apr 20, 2008 at 11:25 PM

For example in the RGB graph what setting should you adjust if let's say the Red is oversaturated, same goes for Gamma, color temp and etc.

Hi,
If your oversaturation occurs below the 50% mark on the RGB graph then what you need to alter from the service menu are the color cut-offs as this are use to alter the dark end of the scale. Adjust them to balance the dark end of the graph.however I'm not confident in Spyder 2's ability to report accurately at low light levels so I did not modify them. And if the oversaturation occurs above the 50% mark then you have to adjust the Drives,Color drives are use to alter the bright end of the grey scale. It is also relative to luminance levels.Each time you increase the value luminance increases, similarly decreasing the value results in a decrease in luminance. As for the Gamma and color temps, try setting it to Warm and this will bring it closer
to the desired resulting color temp and gamma graph.

Quote from: Flood on Apr 20, 2008 at 11:25 PM

I Or does this simply mean that opening up the service menu is mandatory for calibrating TVs.

It is not mandatory to open the service menu. It it case to case basis ( i think). On my setup I did not change any service menu codes, to achieve
the current results i have shown here. I tried to alter them just for the learning process, but in the end set them back to their original setting as I
was happy with the results I have.

Quote from: Flood on Apr 20, 2008 at 11:25 PM

Right now my TV has a PC mode and that's the setting that I want to calibrate and I'm a little worried since I don't see any tint or gamma adjustments in the settings menu and I don't want to risk voiding my warranty for tampering with the service menu.

On some TV models they have individual adjustments for the RGB colors. If you have those then you may not need
to alter the service codes if you get it right, but if you don't or you do not have those options then maybe your only option is to go to the service
code menu.
If you calibrated it in PC mode then that is the mode that will be calibrated only. The others like HDMI1, HDMI2, TV modes will not be affected by
the calibration you did when it PC mode. You have to calibrate each and every one of them separately if you are going to use not just the PC mode.

NOTE:
Many of the remaining settings int the service codes menu are not relevant to our calibration needs, and are likely to cause more harm than good should you change them so be careful when tweaking.

Thanks for your post. maybe you can share with us what you have learned also when your done with your calibration.

Flood · « **Reply #95 on:** Apr 25, 2008 at 02:11 PM »

Thanks for the input but I'm really confused as to what tests I should run with my HCFR and Spyder 2, does it only have to be the greyscale tests or do I still have to test the others like near white, near black, primaries & secondaries etc?

mrm · « **Reply #96 on:** Apr 25, 2008 at 07:26 PM »

Quote from: Flood on Apr 25, 2008 at 02:11 PM

Thanks for the input but I'm really confused as to what tests I should run with my HCFR and Spyder 2, does it only have to be the greyscale tests or do I still have to test the others like near white, near black, primaries & secondaries etc?

Hi sir,
From the results I have shown here in this post, I only ran the greyscale and primaries/secondaries test. I think this is what is important or basic
to achieve a satisfactory result. I myself have not tried all those test that are present in the HCFR program because I am still not sure how to use
them. From the sites I have followed they also recommend those test only. Thanks.

gibsonline · « **Reply #97 on:** May 15, 2008 at 01:33 PM »

If anyone bought a spyder calibration & used it for their Samsung 32R81B...
pwede nyo kaya i-share sa akin yung settings? kung okay lang po sa inyo.

Thanks

DVDMe · « **Reply #98 on:** May 15, 2008 at 05:34 PM »

Hi,

Where can we buy spyder2 here in the phils.? how much? thanks.

mrm · « **Reply #99 on:** May 16, 2008 at 09:02 PM »

Quote from: DVDMe on May 15, 2008 at 05:34 PM

Hi,

Where can we buy spyder2 here in the phils.? how much? thanks.

hi, i bought mine at theater works and it's 4.5t cash.

mrm · « **Reply #100 on:** May 26, 2008 at 08:15 PM »

hi,
I just wanted to share my settings when using Digital Video Essentials(which I downloaded and red/green/blue filters both at ebay) on my
Pana 42pv70h and philips dvp5986. Overall the result was bright with good color tones, good for viewing in a well lighted room.

Panasonic
Mode Cinema
Contrast 58
Brightness 40
Color 66 ( I used only the blue filter to achieve the closest blue match I can get on the color pattern)
Sharpness 15
Color Temp Warm
Ch color set mid (Blue filter used also, but since pana has 3 adjustment only - low/mid/high - the closest to the pattern was mid)
Color manage on
Mpeg NR off

Philips DVD
Brightness 0
Contrast 0
Sharpness 7
Color 0

Service Codes Menu - default

Thanks.

eklok · « **Reply #101 on:** May 29, 2008 at 06:39 AM »

Quote from: gibsonline on May 15, 2008 at 01:33 PM

If anyone bought a spyder calibration & used it for their Samsung 32R81B...
pwede nyo kaya i-share sa akin yung settings? kung okay lang po sa inyo.

Thanks

My 32r81b calibrated by S&S using spyder

set to MOVIE
Contrast - 94
Brightness- 63
Sharpness - 10 (default on movie settings)
Color - 44
Tint - 44
Tone - Warm2
Backlight - 5

All enhancement off except for the MoviePlus.
(Looks very good in movies, skin tone is very natural)

**Calibrated on my pitch black room, it still depends on the environment, it may vary on where your TV is located.

**Good Luck

pangke · « **Reply #102 on:** Jun 19, 2008 at 09:14 AM »

mga master, san po kaya ako makakabili ng mga color filter? pls...TIA!!!

otepsy · « **Reply #103 on:** Jun 19, 2008 at 02:49 PM »

Quote from: pangke on Jun 19, 2008 at 09:14 AM

mga master, san po kaya ako makakabili ng mga color filter? pls...TIA!!!

sir follow this link we have a 2nd batch groupbuy for the THX Optimizer
http://pinoydvd.com/board/index.php?topic=78853.0

pchin · « **Reply #104 on:** Jun 23, 2008 at 06:29 PM »

Has anyone tried the Spyder on a rear projection tv? I presume the process should be similar of a LCD calibration.

Using the "baffle" or "base" (recommended for LCD) attached to the Spyder seems to have a hard time reading/scanning during the calibration process. However, when I remove the base or attachment the reading seems fine.

Also, how's the response or reading of the Spyder? Is the result consistent? During my testing, I used exactlly the same setting but measurement result is very inconsistent. $:-\$ Thanks.

eksi · « **Reply #105 on:** Jun 23, 2008 at 09:15 PM »

Meron po ba nagkalibrate ng ganitong combo: sony KLV32U300A and pioneer pv600? Paki share naman po... just want to try...

pchin · « **Reply #106 on:** Jun 26, 2008 at 09:23 PM »

Quote from: Marl_1 on Apr 09, 2008 at 12:24 AM

I just realized that it's a really time-consuming endeavor. My 1st try took 4 hours, didn't even get close. My 2nd try around 5 hours, came up with some good results.

Oh man...this is really tedious work....after putting more than accumulated 10 hours of calibration I'm still not sure where am I tho it's better than before.

Have to put in more effort in search for the Holy Grail...

Thanks to Marl_1 advice & tips.

pchin · « **Reply #107 on:** Jun 27, 2008 at 08:29 AM »

After accumulated more than 10 hours of calibration, suffered many sleepless nights & sacrifised many unwatched DVD & Blu-rays,

finally got some positive result but still a long way to go to achieve the "Holy Grail" status as mrm & Marl_1 have achieved.

So hard to adjust the setting as one good result but will affect the other one go hay wire. Hope the gurus can review my graphs & give some comments to improve it. Thanks.

Luminance

Gamma
Is it normal for the Yellow line to fluatuate? Or must it be a straight line as the Cyan line?

RGB Levels
I can't understand what happen from 10% to 50% Gray. It seems only at 60% Gray & above all 3 RGB lines hit the target.

Color Temperature
Again, from 10% to 50% Gray it's way out. Starting at 60% Gray the line hits the target. $:-\$

CIE Diagram
I'm not sure how to read this this. Apprciate some feedbacks.

sanmig_ph · « **Reply #108 on:** Jun 27, 2008 at 10:23 AM »

mga fafs pa share po ng calibration sa ps3 using spyder

tia

mrm · « **Reply #109 on:** Jun 27, 2008 at 06:29 PM »

@pchin

hi sir, may I know what is your tv and dvd player and their detailed settings you used to achieve your results.thanks

pchin · « **Reply #110 on:** Jun 28, 2008 at 12:16 AM »

Quote from: mrm on Jun 27, 2008 at 06:29 PM

@pchin hi sir, may I know what is your tv and dvd player and their detailed settings you used to achieve your results.thanks

Hi mrm,

my HDTV is the SONY 42" LCD rear projection at 720p. I'm using the OPPO 983 DVD player. Settings are all at default "0".

On my TV settings:

Iris 2
Picture 90
Brightness 45
Color 44
Hue: Middle
Color Temp: Warm 1
Sharp 25
Advance Iris: High

mrm · « **Reply #111 on:** Jun 28, 2008 at 06:46 AM »

@pchin

hi sir, did you selected this before you started the calibration on the HCFR:

Upon launching the HCFR application you'll be prompted a couple of times: select 'DVD manual' and 'Spyder II' if you're using a Spyder 2 colorimeter
Select References from the Preferences menu and ensure HCFR is using D65 white and REC 709 colourspace as a reference model and Gamma reference
at 2.22

mrm · « **Reply #112 on:** Jun 28, 2008 at 07:07 AM »

@pchin

hi sir,
From your graph what we should be most concerned are the RGB and Color Temperature graph.That is were the big problem lies.
From the RGB graph we can see that there is a huge discrepancy between the three colors below the 60% mark, that is why the delta E
is nowhere seen below that. When there is a discrepancy between the three colors the delta E gets bigger. Ideally we have to have them
at least close to each as much as possible and the delta E below 6 or much better if we can get 4.

Recommendations;

If you have color management menu in your tv I suggest you tinker with that first. Copy their default settings first before trying. Try raising the
blue and green because in your graph they are under saturated and try lowering the red. If your color management menu has no option for RGBYM
adjustment then your best solution is by entering service menu. When the service menu is the only option left then in your case when you get inside
the service menu, go to the drives and cuts section. The cut-off controls are used to balance the dark end of the grey-scale, that is below the 50% mark,
while the drive controls balance the bright end of the grey-scale. WARNING: BE SURE TO COPY ALL YOUR ORIGINAL SETTINGS FIRST IN YOUR SERVICE CODES. INCASE SOMETHING BAD HAPPENS IT BE CAN BE BROUGHT BACK TO DEFAULT. Our concern here is your dark end of the grey-scale. try to increase the value of theBcut (blue) to about a click or two and lower the value of the Rcut also. Save and exit from the service code and see if there is an improvement. If there is no improvement then try lowering/raising it again. If the green does not move at all then try to raise it also.

In your color temperature graph, we can see from the RGB graph that since your blue is under saturated it made your color temp much warmer than
our target of 6500K below the 60% mark. over saturate blue will make the color temp much cooler thus rasing the gamma. Under saturate will make
the color temp warmer thus lowering the gamma.

Recommendations;

This will depend on the result of our above test. If the blue under saturation is fixed above. then the color temp graph will improve also. In your cae your blue and green are under saturated that is why your color temp graph below 60% is a lot warmer than the target of 6500K. Raising the blue will raise the the temperature and make it a lot cooler(near the 6500K target).

Thanks

pchin · « **Reply #113 on:** Jun 28, 2008 at 09:15 AM »

Quote from: mrm on Jun 28, 2008 at 06:46 AM

@pchin hi sir, did you selected this before you started the calibration on the HCFR:

Upon launching the HCFR application you'll be prompted a couple of times: select 'DVD manual' and 'Spyder II' if you're using a Spyder 2 colorimeter
Select References from the Preferences menu and ensure HCFR is using D65 white and REC 709 colourspace as a reference model and Gamma reference
at 2.22

Thanks mrm for the feedback. Really appreciate it!

Yes, upon launching, I select 'DVD manual' and 'Spyder II'
Oh...I didn't adjust anything from the Reference menu.

So far the Gamma reference is default at 2.22.

This mean I have to go: Advanced > Preferences > Select "References" tab. Right?

There are three sections inside the References tab:

1. Color Space
Standard: HDTV REC 709
Change White (tick this): D65.

2. Gamma calculation
Which one do I select?
The default is "Display Gamma with black compensation". Do I leave this alone?

3. Gamma Reference: 2.22

Will get back to you once I have tried it out.

pchin · « **Reply #114 on:** Jun 28, 2008 at 09:23 AM »

Quote from: mrm on Jun 28, 2008 at 07:07 AM

@pchin hi sir,
From your graph what we should be most concerned are the RGB and Color Temperature graph.That is were the big problem lies.
From the RGB graph we can see that there is a huge discrepancy between the three colors below the 60% mark, that is why the delta E
is nowhere seen below that. When there is a discrepancy between the three colors the delta E gets bigger. Ideally we have to have them
at least close to each as much as possible and the delta E below 6 or much better if we can get 4.

Whoa....thanks so much for the detailed explanation & recommendations...I'm a bit lost here. Will have to carefully read & study your recommendations again.

Will verify with my TV setting & post feedback soon, tnx mrm.

mrm · « **Reply #115 on:** Jun 28, 2008 at 01:18 PM »

Quote from: pchin on Jun 28, 2008 at 09:15 AM

2. Gamma calculation
Which one do I select?
The default is "Display Gamma with black compensation". Do I leave this alone?

yes sir, just leave it at the default

j3yps · « **Reply #116 on:** Jul 07, 2008 at 11:50 PM »

Sino sa inyo meron/nakagamit nito? talaga bang maganda kalalabasan..gagamitin ko sana sa Laptop(MacBook Pro) ko eh...Saan nakakabili?

LETOR · « **Reply #117 on:** Jul 12, 2008 at 03:25 PM »

I have read a review of this calibration gadget (Spyder) on one of the issues of The Perfect Vision (TPV) magazine. The column title says "A techno-marvel to be sure, but is it necessary?" Here's the final conclusion:

The PLUS:

Well made, clever, affordable, nicely packaged
Easy to use
Could be useful for newbies

The MINUS:

Questionable results
No substitute for good eyes
Useless for experienced videophiles

Well, just like on audio...your ears and your taste has the final say and not the auto calibrator built in on the equipment.

bukoy · « **Reply #118 on:** Jul 14, 2008 at 11:28 AM »

the best calibirator is your eyes, trust your eyes

fnvillafuerte · « **Reply #119 on:** Jul 14, 2008 at 11:31 AM »

I definitely agree with LETOR and bukoy... I bought AVIA, Sound & Vision and THX Glasses calibration tools to calibrate my Pana Plasma but the result looks "too bright colors" for my eyes. So I ended up recalibrating based on my own eyes perception, which if tested by AVIA, Sound & Vision and THX Glasses will give "failed" or "not passed" grades! I just disregard the result of the calibration tools and used my previous personal calibration. Now I felt that my investment in the calibration tools were just a waste of money...